h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I like that in a man, too!

I know exactly what sort of bloke you're describing. I remember myself once saying to someone that I'm sure fancied me, that he was too nice. He was. But it made him a little boring. I was never sure where I stood with him because he had a tendency to agree to everything I said. If you really want to get a woman interested - there's a pretty effective, simple game. (I'm not recommending people play games but...) It's merely to show interest, then back off.

May I reiterate what I said about 25 LEDs ago?

No games, no games, no games!

I guess the fact that I'm an old broad makes me a lot less tolerant of them than I used to be ... well, I guess I was never really tolerant of them, to be honest ...

Oooh I've been told that one works by many people. I'm trying, honestly I am, but I'm finding the backing off thing really hard. I always get paranoid that she won't realise I'm interested and I end up dropping too many hints, which is a real turn off......

Hooloovoo

Ooh paranoia around women. remember it well. always thought they were laughing at me. probably were though.

I know exactly what you mean B17!

So, you say you remember it, does that imply you got over the paranoia? How?

Never got over it, occassionally have bouts of it still, but generally dismiss it as being silly nonsense in my head. Also think along the lines of "Why should I let that bother me?"
There is one particular incident which still haunts me, though, and which would get yiked if I posted it here. Suffice to say, I never did find the answer to it.

Oooh that sounds intriguing.... feel free to email me if you want, contact details on my space

Hooloovooo

Self-consciousness in the arena is a terrible thing. I suffer from it greatly, always have.

Self consciousness is really just a negatively value-laden term for self awareness. Your true feelings surface as things like nervousness or shame or embarassment because you really don't feel comfortable. And you know you don't like the person(s) or give 2P for their opinions but social standards make it difficult to be rude and hermetic.
The polygamist free-love behaviors of the last forty odd (very odd) years are not everyone's cuppa. In fact, the old saw about 'mister right' or the notions of 'marriages made in heaven','true love', etc. must (I say must) have (had) some validity. An honest person, such as myself for example, who tries to deny their own feelings for the sake of social conformity will always fail and be visibly uncomfortable around others of a lesser moral standard.
Those socially and sexually active persons will observe this discomfort and compensate for their own failure to impress you by behaving negatively - confrontation, criticism, mockery. This is their cue to you that it is time to forgive and forget and get going or else to succumb to their lesser standards. Here, discretion is indeed the very best part of valour.

But self-confidence is another thing!
I know I don't care that much what complete strangers think of me: I know who I am, and so do the people close to me (and eventually those who take the trouble to find out). This also shows up in ones body language.

Wow John, you have a lot of rules for things that "always" happen. Does it really truly ALWAYS inevitibly take place like that?

"A ... person ... who tries to deny their own feelings for the sake of social conformity will always fail and be visibly uncomfortable around others of a lesser moral standard. Those socially and sexually active persons will observe this discomfort and compensate for their own failure to impress you by behaving negatively - confrontation, criticism, mockery."

Well, I am socially active almost all of the time, and sexually active when appropriate, but I don't behave with confrontation, criticism and mockery towards people I "fail to impress"... though I am a bit narked by that remark of yours, it must be said.

But I believe passionately that everyone has the right to go to hell in their own way, and if you choose to be someone who "tries to deny their own feelings for the sake of social conformity" that is up to you.

Don't mess with "forgive and forget" because that implies offence.

Be who you are, (which is obviously someone with very high personal standards), and to let others be who they are, (even if their standards are different from yours). Then you may find that people are kinder and more tolerant to you too.

Wary of moderators (sorry, censors), donating to Amnesty, and an open mind. I like you already!

Yeah - and bossy with it!

equal rights, innit?

Self abnegation and social conformity for the sake of acceptance.
I tried it for a while. Till I realised I wasn't actually enjoying the time spent watching drunks acting like - well, drunks I suppose, and fencing with complete idiots who thought being a single parent meant being desperate.
Much more fun going to bed with a good book and a hot water bottle. (Wish I could find some way to take the computer to bed )

Hooloovoo, I know what you mean about feeling women are laughing at you. I get that feeling too (and most of the time they are). But who cares really.
The ones that are gonna laff at ya aren't the ones you want anyway.

I decided I was never going to get involved with another man as long as I lived(Who needs 'em?).
Then I sort of repeatedly tripped over one on the way to the photocopier.
I think it's rather like when you're trying to remember something and you go away and think of something else. . .

Why don't you try making friends with them and then slipping in the odd compliment. If that goes well you could try the tentative kiss followed by the "Oh dear, I don't know what came over me".
If she doesn't swallow the hook she shouldn't be too upset that you tried.

"A ... person ... who tries to deny their own feelings for the sake of social conformity will always fail and be visibly uncomfortable around others of a lesser moral standard. Those socially and sexually active persons will observe this discomfort and compensate for their own failure to impress you by behaving negatively - confrontation, criticism, mockery."

'Well, I am socially active almost all of the time, and sexually active when appropriate, but I don't behave with confrontation, criticism and mockery towards people I "fail to impress"... though I am a bit narked by that remark of yours, it must be said.'

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You sound like a really nice person Ben. Most of the people who contribute to these fora are.
Unfortunately most of the people in the world aren't.
You may be naturally so comfortable with conformity that you have never been mocked by the normal people, but I can assure you it happens all the time, everywhere.
The trouble is most other people don't "let others be who they are, (even if their standards are different from yours)."
They try to force everyone to conform and the ones who don't ARE mocked.
But then again who cares, after all

Oh I was mocked.

I was verbally bullied in school from the age of 6 to the age of 10. 40% of my young life, 80% of my time in primary school.

I had no "best friend" in secondary school, and was always the outcast, the last but one to be picked for games.

I didn't even have a "best friend" at uni, though I did find my legs there a bit.

The guy I married 16 years ago became my best friend. And three years ago he told me he no longer trusted my judgement and did not want to be married to me any more.

But somewhere along the line I learned to like and trust myself. I dont care a damn what people think of me; but I do care very much about how they feel about themselves and the world in general.

I have also learned to like and trust my friends, and I have some very special friends, mainly women, and some men. The downside is that they are all over the world, the upside is that they my friends.

I am very loyal to them, and that loyalty puts me in some bizzare situations. My ex and I are friends again - we have a date on Friday. The last time we ate a meal together he asked my advice about his girlfriend.

Most of my friends drive me mad. They are too fussy, or to sloppy, or too scatty, or too obsessive - but that's ok. They are human beings, and so am I.

The key in this mad ramble is that when I learned to like and trust myself and other people, the cr@p I went through up to the age of 20 fell away.

Older and wiser, but still a girl called Ben

My own best friend also is my ex (married for only 6 years, but we lived together for almost 3 before that). Her new boyfriend comes very close to being another "best" friend. A lot of people seem to find this hard to accept/believe though...

I would find that very hard, unless I had a new partner of my own. The feeling of betrayal is hard (even impossible) to get rid of... but that's this bloke's perspective