h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Why so harsh? How do you know he was aiming that at the moderation board...and what is the topic we are supposed to be talking about in your opinion?

Hi folks

I don't have time to read the backlog right now, so if this has already been suggested, I apologise in advance.

Researcher 186155, you might consider changing your nickname. A number of people, including myself, find your current choice offensive.

Also, take the chip off your shoulder for a while. This is a friendly community with a lot of people from all over the world. A lot of different opinions, a lot of issues to discuss. For the most part we try to do so in a reasoned, intelligent, and tolerant manner.

Unlike some sites, flaming and insults are not tolerated, as has been gently pointed out to you by my esteemed colleagues.

Please join in. But please, please take a bit of time to consider not only what you say, but how you say it.

Peace



Tal

I know that OBL was implying this because his previous post was saying that he could say what he wanted, and it was therefore stabbing at the idea that he couldn't offend people here and not be repremanded for it. I'm not out to be ahrsh, but sometimes the soft, gentle touch doesn't work. My dealings with OBL started as a question about his name at Peta's space, and the whole thing has snowballed a bit, I guess. I'll go away for a bit to calm down, eat some , drink some ...

Whoami?

This is an interesting topic. "we allow free speech on h2g2 as long as it doesn't offend anyone..." I have to point out that free speech is free speech...period. While I don't agree with everything OBL has said, he is allowed to say it, at least in America. And as far as this being a positive forum...I've been bashed for being an American ever since I got on this site. Don't dish it out if you can't take it.

Let's try a new subject then? The original posting is "why do people hate americans", i think. so i think the positive views of Americans belong on this site. I don't think a new thread should be started.

From all that I've heard in the past few months, there are a million and one reasons why people "should" hate america. At least let Americans defend themselves. Is this an international forum, or is it simply a forum for non-americans that let americans enter every now and then so they can be laughed at or kicked out.

So I am going to continue OBL's change of subject.

I like America because of its beauty. The land in America is truly beautiful, whether you want to see one of the biggest waterfalls in the world, or the some of the most majestic mountains. The beaches are wonderful and the forests are so full of life. If there's one thing that I love about America, it's the aesthetic.

What frightens me the most about the posts of people like Goens and OBL, is the flat dismissal of rational argument as "anti-american".
Yes, I am a US citizen, and yes I do question some of the policies and actions of our government. Do you not like this? Would you like to see people like me put on a list so you can keep an eye on us?

Goens, calling everyone stupid does not amount to self-defence.

Aww, bashed for being American by, in the words of your President '[your] good friends Great Britain?'. You should have told one of us earlier. I agree that that isn't fair. It's just that OBL coming in here, calling us stupid and picking at the community wasn't on - so I told him that it wasn't. Also, if 'free speech' is, in your words, ...period, then why is it limited in American law to that which doesn't cause harm to anyone else. With everything there is a limit...

Whoami?

Oh, and well said, theanthrope! Thanks for the assistance.

Whoami?

And Tal, thanks for flagging up the name situation again. You really are a .

Whoami?

I'm not talking about people who have differences of opinion, theanthrope...I'm talking about people who SAY they are anti-american and who go as far as to say that the MOVIES we export and the MCDONALD'S (for the love of God) are giving a bad view of american society. People who keep saying I hate your government, I hate the fact that you're so religious, i hate your movies, i hate mcdonald's, i hate your electoral college...

personally, i don't have a beef with people with a difference of opinion. It's just that when i differ with them, they simply say that I'm wrong, or they make fun of me. And what have I said? That I think our government is great, and I believe that we SHOULD be at war right now with Afghanistan since they are harboring terrorists that killed thousands of people in our country. (and yes, he "alledgedly" did these things, but i firmly believe that he is responsible). I just wish that when I gently say things, like explaining our electoral college system since certain people were a bit confused about it, that people don't make fun of me and slam me for some strange reason that they take out of my post. If we're allowed difference of opinions here, how about a simple "I understand, but I think it's unfair. Why do you think it's fair?" But I never get that. I get, "um, excuse me, I know how it works, so don't try to tell me anything", even though i wasn't directing anything toward that person. I don't want to fight. When I first came to this thread, I really didn't know why anyone would hate the US. Certainly, I have objections to the way our government does things. I don't agree with the welfare state to a large degree, and I feel that abortion should be illegal. But that's neither here nor there when we're talking about why somebody hates an ENTIRE country.

I think all western societies these days have had to tackle this issue. It is naive to think that free speech means freedom from the responsibility of thinking about how you might hurt other people with what you say. And h2g2 is very upfront about its rules, and you do agree to abide by them when you register, so it's not exactly hidden.

To say that everybody here is anti-american just because they disagree with you is also putting it a bit strongly. Goens, you and I have had some 'discussions' on another forum about Britian's role in Northern Ireland, but I don't hate you or think you are anti-British because of it ... and even in you are anti-British I don't take it personally just because I live here! It is ok to disagree.

Jude

"Also, if 'free speech' is, in your words, ...period, then why is it limited in American law to that which doesn't cause harm to anyone else. With everything there is a limit..."

One of the basic laws of philosophy going back to "the republic" and "the declaration of the rights of man" states that all laws should be made to protect one's personal liberties...this includes what you may do to another. this does not include psychological harm caused by words. The clear and present danger clause is meant to keep people from physical harm. Sexual harrassment is illegal because this can lead to rape and other sexual crimes, not to mention fear of promotions or something of that nature. My point is that I can stand in front of the white house and say "bush i hate you. you are a twit. Please God, kill him now" and nothing would happen to me. I can write in the newspaper that i love satan and i want to have his baby and nobody would care or censor it. This was the point i was trying to make. Sure there are limits...you're right about that.

"To say that everybody here is anti-american just because they disagree with you is also putting it a bit strongly. "


I reiterate:

"personally, i don't have a beef with people with a difference of opinion. It's just that when i differ with them, they simply say that I'm wrong, or they make fun of me."

Well, as they were being offensive to you, OBL was being offensive to us all.

Whoami?

A good joke, which seems suddenly relevent again is one from Bill Hicks c. 1991 "People keep saying we're at war - i tell 'em we not. You see, a war is when TWO sides are fighting..."

Davis, please change your nickname when you see this posting. We've all been asked not to use names that are sensitive right now. That is the reason that your space was hidden, and it's extremely likely that your nickname will not be allowed either when the office staff return in the morning (GMT).
In the meantime if you don't like what you read in this forum, why don't you try another? There are plenty more that you could join in, and would possibly enjoy more.

I agree with Jude. I think if someone wanted to, they should be able to come on here and say "I'm anti american for the following reasons..." without some Americans here taking it so personally.

Well, Listener, there was Islamic fundamentalism before the events I mentioned, there always is in religion, but I think the fact that the Muslim world feels like the put-upon underdog, this has caused people to rush to a collective identity, a way of defending themselves against nations stronger than they are who seem to have control over them.

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<Subject: To OBL
<Posted 1 Hour Ago by Whoami?

<I know that OBL was implying this because his previous post was <saying that he could say what he wanted, and it was therefore <stabbing at the idea that he couldn't offend people here and not be

This kinda sounds like why we're bombing Afganistan. Sorry, but I couldn't help but draw a comparison of like attitudes.

NM

a slight difference in the result FS.

No danger of me as an innocent bystander being killed by an arguement about censorship as opposed to being unlucky enough to be born in the wrong country