h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

as to weapons i will do whatever it takes to keep myself alive and to reduce the overal deathon this planet by whatever means ness.
now untill we actually cure death, the best way to deal with it is to stop people being sent to their deaths, even if it means killing.

you telling me that if you found bin laden sneaking away from yet another mass murder and you had a gun pointed at him. if you didnt shoot, he would get away, you dont have time to secure him.

would you pull the trigger.
if your answer is no then you probably will never understand my motivations.

Well, well, well this *has* been an interesting read. It's given me so much additional insight into the LOTR, which I'm sure will be dead useful if I ever decide to actually read the thing or watch the movie. Thank you everyone



It's a shame I missed the picnic though

Sorry to interrupt if I repeat anything anyone else has already said because I've only read the last few posts on this long thread.


>>he does what a film adaptation of a novel should do, but not necessarily what a film drawing on mythology might.<<

That's an interesting point. There is the example of Beowulf though, and the book and film loosely based on his story - "The 13th Warrior" really only fits where it touches. It's a good film and maybe some Beowulf fans complained about the liberties Crichton and McTiernan took, but if they did, I didn't hear about it. The real myth or legend just isn't as well-loved or well-known as Tolkien's. Arthur and Robin Hood get re-interpreted with every new book and film too. Maybe it's just that that's what happens with all stories. They have to grow or die. Tolkien's myth is being treated like a real myth by the story tellers. Story tellers always change and embellish.


>>I never saw any references in the books to female orcs or to orc children<<

I came across a reference to orc parenting in my copy of Lord of the Rings, in appendix A, a footnote in "Durin's Folk". The there's this paragraph:

'Then Nar turned the head and saw branded on the brow in Dwarfrunes so that he could read it the name AZOG. That name was branded in his heart and in the hearts of all the Dwarves afterwards. Nar stooped to take the head but the voice of Azog said: "Drop it! Here's your fee, beggar-beard." ... .'

And the name Azog was footnoted: "Azog was the father of Bolg; see The Hobbit, p 30."

Bolg and Azog are orcs.

I'll butt out now

" and there realy are those out there that same sex it to be popular."

Please write in English. I have no idea what you're on about.

"i have even heard of men becoming temporarily gay so as to be seen in a more sensitive light by women."

No, you haven't. You've heard about men LYING in order to get their leg over. The old "I'm gay, but I might turn straight for the right girl" gambit is sooooo early nineties. I have to say, though, it is *astonishingly* effective. I speak from personal experience. But here's the news - I'M NOT GAY.

You see, women are such mind-bogglingly stupid creatures that they'll believe you're gay even if you just TELL them you are. You don't have to actually do anything inconvenient or disgusting, like having sex with a man or anything. Read and learn. All you need to do convince a woman you are gay is:

1. Be clean. It is a "fact" known to all women that straight men do not wash, and that if a man changes his clothes more than once a day, he's gay. This extends to your flat/house. Absolutely the best way to convince and unsuspecting woman that you're gay is to have fresh flowers in your bedroom. NO straight man would do this, ever.
2. Be fit, but do NOT play team sports. Women know there are two kinds of men who are fit - rugger buggers, and the other kind of buggers. Join a gym, shave your chest, and get ripped.
3. Never drink pints. Alcopops or fruit-flavoured shots only.
4. Be a bit camp. This is not as easy as it sounds. Being a LOT camp is easy. Being just camp enough, tricky. This year's Big Brother is a perfect example.
Marco: ridiculous, over-the-top, asking-for-a-kicking camp. Seemed to be trying to convince *himself* he was gay.
Dan: just about right. Probably battering the women off with a stick.
Jason: trying, but not convincing anyone. Not camp *enough*.
5. LISTEN. This is by far the most important and difficult bit. You have to actually listen to the noise that comes out of women and remember it. You have seem like you care. DO NOT WORRY about this, because the effort will be worth it. Get all five points right, and a bunkup is an absolute, rock solid certainty.

Do please understand I am not speaking theoretically here. This is an approach I have used myself to incredibly rapid effect on two separate occasions. It is an approach I have seen work for guys who previously have had a hard time getting off with their own right hand.

There is only one possible worrying side effect. You might get chatted up by another bloke. Worse still, your quarry may introduce you to one, thinking you'll be perfect together (this happened to a friend of mine). The key in this situation is NOT to panic. You are, after all, dealing with another bloke. If you've been chatted up, politely decline, as you might a particularly ropey-looking but otherwise perfectly nice girl. If you're actually introduced, then take care: this guy is her friend. You can try one of two things:

1. Take him to one side and admit what you're up to. If you can make him like you, he might actually help. If this happens, you may find yourself loving blokes that little bit more. Not THAT much, obviously, but more than before.

2. Take him to one side and ask him about how he came out. Tell him you haven't told your parents yet. Tell him you're not even sure yourself. Tell him that you want to be with a girl one time to test yourself. Be convincing.

My friend (a master thinker on his feet) took approach (2). He slept with the girl the same night. He instantly gained hero status as a result of this inspired performance.

The point I'm making is: NO guy has ever "become gay" to get women. Men who sleep with men do so because they want MEN, OK? There's NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. Unless they're kidding themselves they're doing it to get to women. Those guys are saddos.

H.

sorry to spoil again, but to the person who thinks that is how i WOULD deal with rapist(s).
that is not at all what i said, you need to read it very carefully, as i will not reitterate for obvious reasons.

Marco: ridiculous, over-the-top, asking-for-a-kicking camp. Seemed to be trying to convince *himself* he was gay.

this is exactly the type of person that bothers me.

as to convincing women..absolute rubish.
any woman who has physicaly met me,is convinced i am a full homa phobe, nota semi.
in the real world i have no gay friends(yes any that came out where quickly dismissed)
i consume no data that is created by homo's
so on and so forth.
let me make it clear. use of violence against homo's is rediculus. nothing more than a neanderthall reaction.
mine is based on the old maxim of"sending someone to coventry'
the veto is the only real power anyone has in this world at the mo.

but from the part of my mind that created a plan for scociety, also comes ideas like group families, wher a couple gets married and over time new people are introduced by the partners as a way of preventing cheating.(and many other benefits and problems)
now in this kind of system who is to say what can go and what not.

my problem is the fact its out in the world like a big fat pride movement.
when really theres nothing to be proud off.
no woman has ever been told of my homosex act.
and the only reason i did it in the first place was to be sure it felt wrong.
as one of my ladies once said, if you like it do it, if you dont like it, do it anyway because you might like it.

still feels very wrong to me.
you may need to lie to women about your sexuality to get laid, but some actualy do it.
as with every thing in life Motive is just as important as reality.

Interesting a person open minded enough to try a homoseuxal relationship, but at the same time narrow minded enough to hate all homosexuals indescriminately.

just the same as not voting for the BNP, because there are some activists within thir ranks.

Are you saying that you hate all homosexuals regardless of who they are as a person, because there is the remote chance that one might try and rape you. And you're asking us to let you rule the world!

i dont hate anyone who is gay, i hate the act, and i prefer not to interact with those who practice it as a matter of principle.

as to rape by a guy man, i dont see where that came into it.
you obviously havnt been paying attention,
if anyone tried to take that liberty with me, as long as i were able.
the guy would be sliced diced and ready to serve as an example to other takers.

forced sex is a seperate nasty issue.
gay is just a world annoyance.

Right, i don't mind gay people, you just don't want them having sex. I think i follow you. (i think)

what i find discusting is that people can gather together for a cause, unified they can achieve hugh amounts for the world, but what do they do with it?
fight for the right to stick their willie in another man/ or women
yeah i know lesbians sound cool but its just as wrong.

i just feel there are more important issues that need to be brought to the fore ground.

and the concept of manogamy is beutiful.
to spend your whole life, working in a trusting partnership, side by side againt the odds. together you can achieve anything, even real hapiness.
i know it hughly conflicts with our massive animal egoes, that need more sex, more women, more power.
but arnt we meant to grow beyond that?

Just to skip most of the last page of posts:

Salmon are "spawned". It doesn't mean there are no females. But then, they do have eggs. "Spawn" is sometimes just a derogatory way of describing one's parentage, sort of like "son of a . . ."

In fact, I've wondered whether some of the orcs in the Lord of the Rings couldn't be construed as female.

As to mythology/novel: the lord of the rings is a novel. All the other stuff is Tolkien's pastiche created mythology. The Lord of the Rings is like The Metamorphoses: an attempt to tell a story or stories that solidify a certain bit of the mythology.

Good Point about Orc parentage from the Appendix.

Speaking of "son of a. . ." Gigabit: Who was refering to the son's ideas, you dolt? I've been going J.R.R. all day, you twit. If you would read, you would know that and wouldn't make such idiotic posts. (Well, you'd still probably make your idiotic, hateful, purile [criminal in some jurisdictions] comments about people more intelligent and feeling than you, but at least you wouldn't make idiotic statements about who people are referring to.)

>> ..but arnt we meant to grow beyond that? <<

"Meant"?
Are you suggesting there is a meaning to life?
That there is a higher purpose or a divine destiny?

Your arguments often fall back on such notions of a guiding principle to life and this seems at odds with your pro-active willfullness to personally set the world straight thru other means (such as your collection of AK-47s).


~jwf~

Oh, and, Gigaborg:

"i know it hughly conflicts with our massive animal egoes . . .
but arnt we meant to grow beyond that?"


Maybe you should try to yourself.

And speaking of your several mentions of weapons, AK-47s, shooting people, slicing people, administering vigilante justice to rapists and homosexuals...

I have to wonder why no one has yet complained to the powers that be about your advocating violence in these threads.

And, I have come to the conclusion it's because most members here are above resorting to the official 'yikes' button to sttle these breeches of the House Rules.

Many are obviously quite willing to let you continue your radical ravings and rhetoric violence because they are smuggly satisfied that they can let you babble on while really enjoying bashing away at you. Because you are in violation of several house rules they feel they can do so with impunity.

All rather silly really. But surely someone from Homeland Security is also monitoring this thread and wondering where you have all these weapons stashed. And quite possibly someone from the BBC legal department is wondering how much more of this they can take.

Perhaps you should tell us more about your wounds and your military service. You have obviously been greatly impacted by it - and it has left you hung up somewhere between sentimentalist ideals for a better world and wanting to slice up homosexuals and rapists. A precarious balance which will not be aided by allowing the bitchy rabble here to continue taunting you.

I suggest you take a break and a deep breath.

Memebers here have lynched-mobbed several others in the past. One in particular who had served with the Isreali secret service and had guilt and anger just dripping from her bloody fingers. Instead of finding sympathy, guidance and companionship she got pushed beyond madness.


~jwf~

Anhaga - regarding what I was trying to get at with the LOTR as synthesising, or more likely oscillating between mythology and the novel (and I know I'm not being terribly clear): absolutely it's a novel in terms of its technique (it's probably closer to romance in terms of its overall form), but I was trying to get at something to do with the reception of it as regards the mythology. For example, look at what we're trying to do regarding the reproductive cycles of orcs. On the one hand, looking for bits of textual evidence to back up various theories (novel), on the other drawing in all kinds of other sources to explore ideas that make it seem as though orcs have this independent existence beyond what Tolkien has to say about them (which seems more akin to mythology)

<>



Gig, in my humble opinion, your whole homophobe thing is not something you should be promoting in your new society (is there a name yet?)

First you have to ask yourself why you would do such a thing and who would benefit by denying homosexuals their rights.

Oh, this leads me to another question - what colour are all the people going to be in your new society?


az

,,And speaking of your several mentions of weapons, AK-47s, shooting people, slicing people, administering vigilante justice to rapists and homosexuals...''
you find a single quote of mine that say's i think it's right to do harm on homosexuals, then i will be impressed.
same with harming anyone, exept in the name of self defence, defence of the enfeebled and against bin laden.

as to my mention of the rapist. i may have been refering to a personal moment in history where i actualy witnessed such an event and went balistic, or it is a hypothetical as to how i would react.
Violence should not exist,in any form. But it does, and some times without our ability to stop it.
just like every thing else it should be judged, controled and hopefully removed as a problem all together.

,,Many are obviously quite willing to let you continue your radical ravings and rhetoric violence because they are smuggly satisfied that they can let you babble on while really enjoying bashing away at you. Because you are in violation of several house rules they feel they can do so with impunity. ,,
i had a discussion earlier with someone else about the rules,

SPECIFICALY i said that i hadnt read the rules, but i feel that as long as i remained polite and constructive, i have as much right to a say as anyony else.
now if you occasionaly get annoyed with the way i label things, but that is a part of the way i talk.
if i say queer, so what they are and they dont mind beigg queer,so lets just call a spade a spade.ok

as to the stockpiling of weapons and all that.
well as far as i am aware there is quite a large reward on some of the terrorists out there, could come in right handy.
and id be doing the world a favour.
you may find it a little difficult to prosecute some one that dosnt break laws.
even if i did torture a rapist, who is to say that i did it in a place where there is a law against it.
EVEN SO the word torture IS SO wrong( you get a picture of someone preparing tools, and working skillfully to achieve an end!)
the "torture" i meant here was to infer that i didnt just kill i beat to death, if this incedent did ocour in reality, then i would have been so hyped by what he had done, i would have not realised that my hit had actually ended his life.

and if it did happen, then the guy would have been massive and much physicaly healthier than me, i would not have realised how fragile someone like that could be,ok
now please lets drop the rapist issue, if anyony would have behaved like that in the society thing, they would have been prosecuted,EVEN THE KING.

as for directly advocating violence to reduce violence,even if i HAD meant it like that for the world in general, still no worse than the typical advice a western general would give to his president.

i didnt say i had a military background.(just a violent one.
i will give no physical descr.
just remember violence is all around and we currently dont have the ability to choose our entry into this world.
i cant help being the product of a violent youth, blame my parent or the system.
all i can do is carry myself as an adult.
as an adult, i am responsible, as much as the rest of you.

how many hunters do you know that wont kill(( animals that lay eggs, animals that mate for life and animals that need the care of adult for a long period.

yes i do hunt(ONLY FOR FOOD), what you think its more humane to get someone else to do the killing for you.
have you seen the way they kill some.
at least with me they can garuntee a head shot, or a deadfall to the skull.
it just makes me sad we have to kill at all.

anyway how can i really be arguing against the advocation of violence?
have you read all my posts.
appaert from the obviously bad attempts at humor.
i have pour out over a hundred posts in about five or six different threads over the last 48 hrs.
i try not to insert anything i think is irrelivent in my language.
and i only repeated myself when specificaly required.
its gonna take a long time for people to really put it together and bandy it about between them, to split away the insanities, the deliberate misscomunications and various other anomilies.

as to the realy early post about about who in the race for wold power and who was playing who off against who(sounds like garbage unless your the person) wouldnt you say the best way to get the crown of all crowns is not to try to be the big public hero, but the already discreteded sneak who slowly builds up his powerbase, whilst the world thinks nothing of that harmless peon.