Stumble into the DNA Hub - 2002/9

3 Conversations

WARNING - This on going experimental first attempt at Guide ML is a Hobby Horse of mine smiley - biggrin

In the beginning - 2002

I 'Stumbled' into the DNA Hub as a Newbie lurking to learn (A849756)

Those I stumbled across in order of appearance:-

J'au-æmne - HappyDude - Mina - MaW - FABT - Peta - Amy the Ant - xyroth - Whisky - Jim Lynn
Grey Desk - Tango - Jimster - spook - Emily - MaW

I shall point this Entry out to them when I get a bit further on.

Lurking prompted very interesting discussions with members of the DNA and h2g2 Teams and volunteers who gave their views frankly and openly.
Links to these conversations can be found at the bottom of the page.
Click on these links and draw your own conclusions.

My own conclusions are here (A904042) and here (A905500), along with the views and observations presented below.

Has the dust settled ?

The impression gained is that both the sites/activities are in good hands. Thanks due mainly to the original members of h2g2 who have been split up, despite any arguments to the contrary that have been expressed. Thankfully however the move seems to have been successfully achieved and all involved seem to have reached a happy compromise. Congratulations must go to whoever it was that instigated and administered the takeover. There is no doubt that Mark Moxon played an active part in this from an h2g2 standpoint, but I can find no trace of his BBC counterpart. I get the feeling that the move had always been envisaged and came about a little prematurely because of the sad death of DNA (the man) who had strong BBC connections.

I can find no one within DNA, researcher or italic, who was not/is not connected in some way with h2g2. That may be because I lack the necessary skills or motivation, other than curiosity to investigate it properly.
I haven't been able to clearly established who are on the payroll and who do it for fun. Nor specifically the name of he/she who holds the purse strings. Despite all talks and demands for freedom someone has to be in charge and someone has to pay for it.smiley - biggrin

Now that you are all settling down into a groove, please, please do not loose the purpose and drive that DNA (the man) inspired. You must all continue to work closely together.
It needs to be said that BBCi is a large community in itself, put it into the context of the BBC as a whole and it becomes frightening , and DNA as an entity becomes in danger of being totally engulfed.
The style of management control must be 'Open source' No one should seek to become indispensable. Look for continuity, instruct and guide a successor. To me the DNAhub and h2g2 are synonymous. Keep it that way.
In real life I was a middle manager in one of the major steel companies. As the necessary changes came about within the steel industry, the middle managers of my company had a rallying call 'Don't let the b******s grind you down'.
My old company was nationalised twice before the final restructuring that took place in the 80's. Because it had a solid management base and followed tried and tested management principles it is still in operation today allbeit under another name.

LONG LIVE H2G2 - Ancient Brit smiley - ok

Whether you like it or not

You should be aware that when you register with any DNAhub site your personal space is accessible from all the others, regardless of whether or not it is appropriate. These sites are listed to the left of the DNAhub page (Should you stumble across it). This list is not always up to date.

NOTE - h2g2 is a DNAhub site but DON'T PANIC

h2g2's LINK to the DNAhub is rather tenuous. Down at the very bottom of every h2g2 page you will find in very small print the words.

Powered by DNA, the BBC's community website engine

Click on these words and you will 'Stumble' into the DNAhub.

Unfortunately all DNA sites do not carry this message to name two the DNA Hub and Collective. smiley - huh

A Point of no Return

If you find the Hub a place of interest then you should be warned that it is easy to become lost. Each site seems to adopt a different skin and whilst you have a tag to 'My Space' clicking on it will only display your h2g2 Personal Space in the skin of the particular site that you are in.
There are ways of getting back to your h2g2 Personal Space but none of them are direct. You could use the 'Back' arrow on the address bar of your browser but if you have 'gone deep' this can be a bind and does not always work.

Escape Route - My BBC

Until March 03 all BBCi sites including the DNA sites had a link to 'My BBC' where a panel containing your own Net Favourites could be created.
By putting the h2g2 address of your space in this panel you had a readily available escape route back to a familiar page displayed in the skin of your choice. The addresses of other DNA sites could also be added to the panel.

The 'My BBC' site is now closed down. There are other ways of getting back to the original version of your Personal Space (see conversations below). Serious consideration should be given to having a Welcome page common to all DNA sites with a link back to the favourite version of your own site. The ideal solution would be to have all the DNA sites collected under one banner.

Added May 03 - I have just created a short cut back to My Space and put it on my desktop. This is a very simple and easy way to get back to familiar ground.

Happy Lurking - Ancient Brit smiley - ok

Lurk by Lurk - (Link as we go)

Conversations in chronological order.

1 - Here we go - Newbie needs help - 18th.Aug.02 to Post 52 20th.Nov.02

2 - Come in Peta - Take me to your leader - after Grey Desk : Whisky and Tango had had a go.

3 - Come in Jimster with - DNA questions - some answers

4 - What have we got ? - DNAhub I presume ?

5 - A kindred spirit - Whisky opens up

6 - Spook is with me in Never Never Land

7 - A Book of the Future Editor - One Em (she'll know who I mean smiley - biggrin)

8 - A Book of the Future - So many Newbies

9 - Jimster introduces himself and Spells it out

Other Links of interest

  1. Douglas Adams: 1952-2001
  2. About the BBC
  3. The BBC - Past present and future
  4. An Introduction to DNA
  5. A short History of DNA
  6. X marks the spot
  7. Current DNA Clients (Existing Sites)
  8. The DNA Team
  9. Mark Moxon
  10. What is the BBC's interest in h2g2? Posted by Waz July 2001
  11. The Brainstorming Board

Why oh Why ?

Why is Parent to Parent buried in Parents' Music Room ?. DNA Sites need a home base.
On BBCi's Parenting Home page there is a direct Link to h2g2's own Parenting page. Why is it necessary to open up Parent to Parent at all ?. At 100,000+ researchers h2g2 has a long way to go to reach saturation.
Objective should be to increase the h2g2 user base and spread the DNA site gospel from there. Double up membership by getting each researcher to introduce at least one new member ?? Get them into h2g2 and disperse them from there. Members of any existing BBCi community outside h2g2 should be encouraged to join h2g2 not vice versa. BBCi 'community' front page needs a link to a DNA front page not an occasional reference as applies at present.

Avoid confliction and duplication

Use h2g2 as a test bed. Anna has got it with Parenting on h2g2..smiley - ok

By its very nature h2g2 has the bare bones for any communications site that needs to be generated.
H2g2 has to be integrated firmly into the BBCi's communication category.

'Collective' is Music and Film. Search h2g2 on those categories. h2g2 needs a 'Collective' cross reference similar to that of a music home page and a film home page

'SofP' sites should be relatively easy to cross reference.

The biggest problem is with '360' which in itself has such a wide scope that for the main part it is in direct opposition to h2g2 for contributors.

In entry 360 - Changing the World By Degrees--Maggy Dubya has tried to point to the '360' site. With what success ? Shouldn't h2g2 and 360 embrace each other on their respective front pages ?

Pick up Points

All sites/communities should at least have a functional desciption of their own front pages.

Having spent some time in BotF I am more convinced than ever of the need for specific help pages. It's easy to refer people to h2g2 and get them into more difficulty.

Stumble into other DNA Sites

  • Current DNA Clients (Existing Sites)
  • New Users on DNA sites
  • Tick the 'Show only users from this site' button, click the 'Show Users' button and it will only show those users whose personal space was created in the site you're in.

    2003 and beyond

    There is now a link to h2g2 on the BBCi/Communicate page
    Surely this should be used to collate all the DNA sites.

    This thread Reader/Writers Corner lead my to write Think about it

    A blast from the WW2 site - Friendly Fire

    I believe that in the long run DNA sites will embody h2g2 - Click Here

    A conversation on Get Writing - 'Things Move Fast'
    Get Writing seems to be a new breed of DNA site. H2g2 researchers are registered on the site, but no direct link to h2g2 pages is made. Will this prevent conflict and confusion ?

    Book of the Future slips into the past. - Read all about it

    MaW - puts it simply.

    Commonality - A common Introduction/Welcome to DNA Sites.

    iCan - The odd one out ? - My view following the launch
    Why is iCan special ?

    'iCan' became 'Action Network' in 2005.

    Are all Sense of Place sites powered by DNA ?

    If h2g2 is the father of all DNA sites then 'Sense of Place Northern Ireland' has to be the mother.

    Go there via Brian Willis's Personal Space. U193126


    Would you believe that Grey Desk came up with this

    Then along came Jim Lynn with THIS

    Which gave a lead to Welcome Back to h2g2!

    Is this Goodbye to Get Writing ? - getwriting/communitynews

    DNA Message Boards - Points of View -- 6Music -- 1XTRA

    Is '360' on its way out ? ----------------------- YES

    Does Catch'em Young hold any secrets ?

    2005 ?

    Effectively down to 'h2g2' - 'Collective' - ' Ican' and 'Message Boards'

    What does the future hold ? -- -- Where are we now ?

    It may well be that the new DNA Message Boards, will evolve into the form of 'Chat Rooms' with people talking about all aspects of Life the Universe and Everything. smiley - biggrin

    Things are certainly on the move. DNA is being trimmed to fighting weight, message boards are being chopped around and moved over to DNA.
    Let's see what happens over the next few months.

    Let's have it

    A related article Show me the way to go home

    Ben puts the posts together - What is h2g2's place in Internet-land

    Peet provides a meeting place for Mustardlanders.

    A Film, a new look Front Page, h2g2 on Mobile. Could this signal the oncome of a blizzard ?

    Ever onward - DNA Message Boards


    The BBC community remains unrecognised and fragmented.

    The DNA Hub is bogged down with the conversion of the 'Message Boards'

    Are these people stealing BBC's thunder ? MY Space.

    As discussed on BBC TV Programme - Click.

    A VOICE FROM ABOVE - DNA must have a part to play.

    Posting to P.O.V. brings trouble

    When I put a message into Wendy's Space ( MP now U1164931) I knew that I was stepping outside the functionality of the P.O.V. site. (See Post 9 this thread ) I had no idea however that it would cause the turmoil that followed.

    What was it that triggered the events ?

    Everything was going along OK until Wendy suddenly got the idea that I was up to no good and her posts became hostile. The change came round about the time I gave her a link to the Hub. Post 10 this thread. Amy the Ant,SEF,GreyDesk,T.i.T,Frankie Roberto and Mina all contributed to the thread after the time that Wendy joined it. I have read it again and can find no indication of any real problem. She went walkabout on the info that had been given to her. Made up her space using GML and joined in conversations and posted on h2g2 in a manner that was astounding for a newbie. I had told her in the 'Hi Wendy message that I suspected that she knew more about what DNA was about than she was letting on.

    Through all this I tried to keep an eye on her. She opened up a conversation I tried to get her back on track then out of the blue came Sorrel with this post.
    Shortly after this came the involvement of Sorrel, Kat and GreyDesk with regard to posting on Wendy's space.

    All hell was then let loose.

    My Message 'Hi Wendy' was removed and replaced with GreyDesk's message 'Hello Wendy - This is a test.
    I posted to this new thread questioning what was happening. At least it did what I had been trying to do by getting her out of the Hub and back to her own space, but it left me up the proverbial creek without a paddle.

    I then got 3 emails
    1 - From the POV Hosts telling me that my 'Hi Wendy' message had been removed. Not just the odd post but the whole message, some 40 odd carefully considered posts. On top of that it banned me from posting to Wendy's space. This means that I can not post to a thread that is basically a continuation of a thread that I started.
    The other 2 emails from POV Moderators were one for each of my posts to the new message, informing me that the posts had been removed. GreyDesk has questioned their removal but seems to have lost interest.

    I tried to whip up sympathy with 'Please release me' and one or two interjections into other conversations. They all fell on stoney ground.

    No sympathy from Peta who just throws the book at me.. She does seem to have a change of attitude later in the thread.
    Wendy is unapproachable - I tried here on another h2g2 thread she opened. I was successful but again she suddenly took umbrige (post 5 to 11)., It seems that among other thing she has a pursecution complex. I thought she was an innocent party but I am begining to have my doubts. Why should this latest twist be used in the final condemnation ?

    With a NUMBER of complainants why was it that no one came to me on my personal space. I did provoke a reaction form Sorrel, but that was after the event.

    Approach to POV hosts not much help I have to plead guilty. When I can find no justification for doing so. It wouldn't bother me not posting to Wendy ever again but the fact the 'Trigger happy button pushers" can create a situation like this does give me cause for concern.

    Peta emailed me and we came to an agreement


    Further notes to be edited as and when - to date I still fail to understand why this happened. I had trouble with three women when I first joined h2g2 and I have crossed swords with Tango and Amy the Ant long ago but surely they aren't still bearing a grudge after all this time.

    Mar.05 - Dropped onto my First Contact with Wendy

    Things seem to be related to the connection between Wendy, Sorrel/Kaz, Kat and GreyDesk. Sorrel and Kat had contacted him for help.
    The finger points at the connection between Wendy, Sorrel and Kat.
    Sorrel has a dual character in Kaz. Could it be that Wendy and Kat are similar dual characters ? Wendy shows remarkable grasp of h2g2 for someone who has only been there for such a short time. There were indications in the 'Hi Wendy' message that she was not telling all and she is showing very little interest in the new message in her space.

    As I promised Peta I'll just stay away from Wendy and meddling with POV functionality. However I shall lurk around and see what comes up.

    Does Wendy need protection ? As a Newbie she is technically capable and if she was upset by my post I still fail to understand why.

    This is quite a thread for a Newbie ? F24276?thread=599357

    People directly involved in this escapade before or around the time of the event are :-

    U197657 : Wendy Redred Robin - U1164931 was MP : Sorrel and Kaz- U1025853 alias U182246 : GreyDesk - U165955 : Kat - U234368 : T.i.T. - U228046 : Peta - U24 : Those in the Hub Conversation (After Wendy) : The VOP hosts : The VOP moderators :

    Other people must have been aware but stayed clear.

    2009 and trouble again

    I inadvertently got into Ouch! trying to trace someone. It's easy to do that when all a members conversations are listed, including those on any other site that they subscribe to. I Posted on Ouch because I had lost track a bit with my search being suddenly switched from h2g2 to the Ouch! site and I wanted to get a feel for where I was. The response that I got smacked of someone playing the fool. I posted an appropriate reply Would you believe that the pair who had posted back to me turned out to be bull dogs, who had my post removed and came after me.
    No more needs to be said. The two worthy characters are:-
    FacepunchRider and
    batsgirl both of whom have not given any details and so have not been welcomed to h2g2.

    These are the two relevant links:-

    For the h2g2 thread click here

    For the Ouch! thread click here

    It is important to take note of which community your message comes from.

    I have prepared this entry off line. This experience has taught me that when the crunch comes it is very difficult to make your case when vital evidence is withheld by the prosecutor. OK

    Bookmark on your Personal Space



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