h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

That's one of the reasons I said that religion always complicates things...

In my younger long-haired and beardy days (yes, I'm an aging hippy) a number of my friends were Hare Krishna devotees. They foreswore all manner of intoxicant, including tobacco, as well as alcohol, tea and coffee, not to mention all manner of recreationaL pharmaceuticals. Most of the smokers didn't stick it out long, I have to say.

I have heard many good reasons for giving up the weed - religion is not one that usually springs to mind. I certainly never came across anybody who successfully gave up as a result.

I'm with MaW on this - it just confuses the argument. I'm not a pagan, it simply doesn't apply to me.

Very well-spoken and COMPLETELY accurate and 110% to the point. Don't worry about those respondants complaining of "stupid comments", etc.. Inconsideration such as theirs (and lack of something called common sense) is the primary reason today's world is in the condition it is. Your letter rests on the solid foundation of the undeniable truth that NO-one can escape from, no matter how much they may try to contradict it.

'should we all kill ourselves?'

some people always go for the easy solution, don't they?!

Ah, but it depends what happens when you die...

Hi Xylaria,

Could you explain post 63 for me, because I didn't understand what you were trying to say. No problem if you don't want to; just thought I'd mention that I didn't get it.

Seeya
Spiff

Spiff, if you click the "In reply to this post" link, you'll see that Xylaria was commenting on the first post in the thread... Hope that helps clarify...

First of all, I'll declare my interests.
I'm a smoker, my partner's a smoker, and apart from people at work, I know very few people who *don't* smoke.

Having said all that, I have to say that I think people are on very dodgy grounds claiming smoking should be banned simply because they don't *like* it. The smell making you feel rough, or whatever. Health grounds maybe.

Point in case: I'm allergic to bananas. I throw up if I eat them, and the smell of one in a 10' radius makes me feel violently ill. Does that mean I 'have the right not to feel like sh*t because someone's eating a banana'? Hey, might not be hurting me, but I don't like it, so can I campaign for bananas to be banned, just so I never have to encounter one again? No, I don't think I can.

Dog ends left lying around can also not be blamed entirely on the smoker. The streets of England have very few litter bins anyway, and the only place you ever see ones with ashtrays on top are places like airports. Granted it is possible to nub the end, and I try and do that, but sometimes if you're in smart clothes, there ain't no place to put the nub until a bin comes along.

Smokers are no different from the rest of people, they are not demons, they are not evil selfish bast*rds, just people. Some smokers are selfish, but then so are some non-smokers. So don't tar us all with the same brush.

The only place I'd say you've got no right to complain is pubs. Sorry chaps, pubs are a normal place to smoke. you don't like smoke in pubs, off you go to California, it's just about the only place you'll find a non-smoking pub.

KerrAvon,

"...I know very few people who *don't* smoke..."

I suspect that's a symptom of the polarising aspects of this debate. Many, if not most non-smokers prefer not to hang around with groups of smokers. You say you are a smoker, and all your friends are smokers - this automatically makes it less likely for you to meet and strike up friendships with non-smokers. I know many smokers, but I choose to hang out with people who don't smoke for the majority of the time.

There's a good sound history of banning things that people don't like - noise legislation is a prime example. You can argue that is on "health grounds" to prevent stress, but then the same argument goes for the by-products of indiscriminate smokers.

I'm sorry Kaz, I this won't cause offence, it's certainly not meant to, but:
Sorry, it's a nasty world, there are plenty of things in it that cause offence and injury.

But you are one person. You seem to feel, and correct me if I'm wrong, that just because someting causes you great discomfort, it shouldn't be allowed. I really wish the world worked that way. If it did, there wouldn't be any hairspray in the world, because I don't like it, it smells vile, and gives me intense asthma attacks that don't settle properly for days.

There'd be no bl*ody cats in the world because *I* happen to think they're selfish evil creatures that bite, scratch, and make my eyes itch.

Some people however, seem to need hairspray before they can leave the house, some people also adore cats, and treat them like precious little babies.

Getting shot of something just because it inconveniences you simply is not an option.

You're right, I agree that it isn't - if this was the case, there would be a lot of things that are in this world now that would be gone because they really, really irritate me. Although luckily I don't have Kaz's reaction to smoking, or your reaction to bananas - oh, and peanuts should be banned as well.

My major objection to smoking is that the smell clings to things like my clothes (one member of my project group this year smokes in our informal meetings, and subtle attempts to get him not to, including attempting to meet in non-smoking areas, don't work), and that I don't see any reason why people would want to smoke, because it's something I find so repulsive.

However, I'm also aware that some people enjoy it, and although this totally baffles me, I can respect that... but I still don't understand it, and I still hate coming home smelling of smoke. I wouldn't mind it so much if it wasn't so pervasive (I don't feel that I spend enough time in smokey environments to be at any real risk of passive smoking-related medical complaints), if I could leave the pub and not still smell it when I got home.

Unfortunately a solution to that problem has not yet been found.

Now that I *can* understand. I admit that the smell of smoke can be a pain- all I can suggest is Febreeze- contrary to what someone (I forget who) said earlier, it really does get rid of smells, not just mask them.

Not perfect I know, but until someone finds something better, it's the best going.

This is the point where I get to be smug, as people have told me that rolling tobacco doesn't cling as much, and I smoke roll ups

That's something I've not ever noticed, probably because most places people are smoking rollups many other people are smoking normal ready-rolled ones, so it sort of drowns the whole thing out...

I'm not offended KerrAvon, I guess we just will never understand each other. You think of my asthma attacks as an inconvinience. Obviously I think of them as a lot more than that, they are mainly cause by smoking, and they could well be the thing that ends of killing me. To me, that is more than an inconvenience, but I can't make you understand that, if you choose not too.

Kaz
I'm not a smoker, and I feel no need to defend it. BUT... are you saying that your condition is only brought on by tobacco? I find that hard to believe.

There are serious issues here, but over-exaggeration benefits nobody.

Kaz............. I'm sorry to have to say this, but asthma is so much more than a physical problem.

I'm an asthmatic too, and I know of several other people who suffer with this debilating and frustrating condition, but my grounding in traditional chinese medicine and other 'spiritual' disciplines has taught me that the inability to either breathe in or out is somewhat due to the emotional issues of not being able to 'breathe'/take in the world and its pain, or the inability to 'exhale'/let go of emotional attatchments of some sort.

I'm not saying that asthma is not triggered by other things, such as tobacco smoke, hairspray, cats, horses, car fumes, physical exertion etc., but that there may well be other reasons behind the asthma itself. One reason (apart from being addicted of course) that smokers carry on with their (my) habit is to enable themselves to block out the world with their smoke and be able to hide behind a smokescreen................and because they enjoy the sensation of taking tobacco deep into their lungs.
I know that when I am undergoing some emotional turmoil or re-living past trauma, the first thing I want to do is smoke, otherwise I tend to spiral into a dramatic asthma attack. Sound familiar??

I know someone who is allergic to nuts in quite a dangerous way. Obviously this limits his ability to eat certain pre-prepared foods. But the fact remains that most other people do not share his allergy - does that mean that nuts should be banned?

My first asthma attack was at 18 months, so I really don't think so. I used to own a pagan/new age/spiritual health and healing shop, so I am well aware that asthma can sometimes be caused by such issues. But luckily I am not so narrow-minded as to paint all asthma sufferers with the same brush.

Do not tell me what is really causing my asthma, until you know my full medical history.

Hi Leopardskinfynn,

"...sounds familiar?" No not really.

Your point about nuts is an interesting but off the mark a bit. People with this allergy, in the same room as nuts, don't come down with the symptoms. It is fairly easy to avoid the problem. It doesn't mean that you can't even meet people down the pub coz there's nuts about! It doesn't compromise your social life in the same way. Nuts are not inherently invasive (unless you've found a new kind of super nut!!). With smoke, any kind of smoke, one source of smoke will effect anyone going near it and it's not always possible to keep out of it's way. That's the point trying to be made.

Hi Geoff
I had repeated asthma attacks from the age of 18 months to 5 years old. I started having asthma problems again, when I was of age to go to pubs. Since age 18, the only thing that has given me asthma attacks is tobacco.

I am also allergic to animal fur, feathers and certain chemicals such as those found in new carpets. Whilst these things make breathing very uncomfortable, they have never given me an asthma attack.

I am not lieing or exagerating. I constantly find myself justifying my health problems here. So bearing in mind that I do not feel like writing anymore of my medical history to strangers, and also that I have a hospital apointment tomorrow for my asthma ( they are changing my medication to something even stronger), I will be unsubscribing from all the smoking conversations.

I am fed up with being called a lier, walk a few steps in my shoes mate and you will find out the truth.

Kaz
You don't want to talk about your medical conditions but that's been the basis of your argument all along. Make your mind up.

And since when has questioning someone's assertions been tantamount to calling them a liar? I *still* find it hard to believe that asthma can be brought on solely by tobacco. I'm willing to accept the concept, but not without questioning it first; that's what robust debate is for, isn't it?

You want to unsubscribe; to take your ball and go home? Fine. Goodbye. Perhaps then I'll find someone who'll answer the points I've raised about public/private places and who will accord their adversaries the respect due. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they're a bad person. Just because you ignore what someone says doesn't mean that they haven't said it or that their point isn't valid.

On my alter-ego's homepage I've taken an oath to avoid offending people on these forums. However, I reserved the right to ridicule silly people. Guess which category I've earmarked for you.

I don't want this thread to descend into a flame war, so if anyone wants to join this little spat, please post on my home page. Cheers.