h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

There is no compulsion in religion. Truth is clear from falsehood (Quran 2:256)

Let him (her) who will believe, and let him (her) who will disbelieve.
(Quran 18:29).

You are in no way a compellor over them; but warn by the Koran him who fears my threat
(Quran 50:45).

Adib

Hi Noggin. I guess we have to say that purpose has both temporal and logical antecedents. It is to be explained by these rather than its future intended functionality. I have mentioned GEM Anscome's 'Intention' previously, I think. It is a slim but closely argued volume which has to be the 'locus classicus' for this topic. Purposes, like reasons, have to be 'had' by someone, as you so rightly suggest. There is no such thing as their being in the object. Let's recall that 'psychologism' is no longer a dirty word in philosophy.

Hi Math

I think I said that nature is indifferent to us and that it provides a backdrop for BOTH joy and pain.
It is a place to experience and as you say most people see it as a thing to be used and abused, then cry 'look what God/nature has done to us!'

Math
I thought pitiless to mean not interested in the emotional aspect of the function of nature.
diversity

You're all almost right. Well, Noggin is exactly right. Nature isn't pitiless or anything else less. Nature is neutral, incapable of concern about pity, care, compassion, hope, altruism or anything else. I guess nature is what we find out about the world and project back on it.

Very interesting, Hasselfree! I usually draw the line at alien abduction, though I will accept NDEs, and telepathy - where it come ro the 'paranormal'.

Jordan; his later comments explained it a lot better.

Some websites useful for taking action re Iraq:

War on Want - campaigning for focus on ending injustice and oppression which are the roots of conflict rather than enhancing military spending:

http://www.waronpoverty.org/html/mainframe.html

Amnesty International - requesting that the UN Security Council considers the human rights and humanitarian consequences of a war against Iraq and ensures appropriate monitoring (site includes reports and news statements on Iraq):

http://www.amnesty.org.uk/action/iraq/securitycouncil.shtml

Christian Aid - calling on the UK government to seek a peaceful solution:

http://www.christian-aid.org.uk/campaign/action/0302iraq.htm

Bod

Thanks for the links, Bodhisattva, I am following them up!

thay are very informing
i am a junior member of amnisty and even i dident know
most of that
its quite worrying

Who is this God person anyway?

Here's one for Toxx and Noggin.

On the time infinite / finite theme.
time is not _______________

Time is a O.
It had no begining and no end but it is not stretching into infinity

Alright then, Hass. If time is circular, does it make any sense to wonder whether we are going round for the first or the nth time? The nth time would have to be a time outside time, would it not? But if we only go round the once, then it might just as well be linear! Not to put too fine a point on it, there's a built-in contradiction with that idea.

Ah but then it depends on how fast we travel around it doesn't it?
What if we're only at 3.30 and then it begins again with no discernable beginning or ending.
linear and circle are not the same thing.
you see a beginning and an ending with linear, you do not in a loop.
voila no contradiction

Plus we 'draw ' the time line on a loop, but it isn't really there.

I'll take you on. I'm a charasmatic Christian who is currently righting a novel about the sheer insanity of religion. I mean, none of it actually makes sense! All I know is that my faith FEELS right and that's it for me.

OK, Hass. Let's suppose we're at 3:30 - somwhere about halfway down the right hand side of the circle. Suppose it's the second time we've been there. On what scale do we record the fact that it's the second time around? Our time scale itself doesn't have the extra dimension required. Therefore the loop model isn't up to the job it's supposed to do! 3:30 for the second time is clearly distinct from 3:30 for the first time!

Hi Hasselfree .

Close but no cigar.

Time is OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO cyclical, it goes around and around, but each time a little different from the last.

Blessings,
Matholwch the non-math /|\.

As I said it's only clearly distinct because we make time up. #It doesn't exist. We have just put 3.30 into the equation and already we're thinking of a clock face and therefore it must travel around and around.
what I should have said was say we're at '3.30' on the circle but it but we've never been around once as yet. (by We I mean all of humanity) any 'previous ' there is no first time or second time or previous when things don't have a beginning and an end.

Math
At least a cigarello for this poor demented , making it up on my own, soul.
A cylinder has a beginnning and an end???
A circle doesn't ?
Or how about a mobius?
I'm working this theory out on my own,since time doesn't exist the collective conscious of 'all that is, that was formed with or before the big Bang) can produce the big bang (through consciousness in the form of thought) at any time,since time doesn't exist. So the big bang is happening now and then and in the future and We all caused/created it. A time paradox?