h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I've remembered what was going to say!

Tw things. There is a lot of talk over the course of this thread about fundamentalism. I just wish to point out tat Christian fundamentalism is as dangerous as any other fundamentalism eg. Islam. I am not discriminating against Muslims, I am using this as an example because Islamic fundamentalists have been in the news a lot recently.

Also, on the matter of the literal truth of the Bible (which is the point of this thread) I have a few things to say. As Ned Flanders said in The Simpsons, "I've done everything the Buible says, even the stuff that contradicts the other stuff." Many people quote small sections of the Bible in order to support their cause. There are parts that though not actually contradicting others appear to do so at first but on closer examination reveal the underlying truth.
For example, the Bible speaks of Adam being the first man and Eve being the first woman. It doesn't say they are the only man and woman God created so the idea that everyone is descended from Adam and Eve is unfounded. They had a son called Cain and , to quote the Good News Bible,"Cain and his wife had a son and named him Enoch." If Eve was the only woman God had created then Cain would not have had a wife! Therefore God created other women and presumably other men, so the belief that we are all descnded from Adam and Eve is unfounded. Some Christians take the view that all people were descended from Adam and Eve and some atheists I know use the argument about Cain's wife to support there idea that the Bible is a lie. The Bible appears to contradict itself but AT NO POINT DOES IT SAY GOD ONLY CREATED ADAM AND EVE. This is assumed by people but never said in the Bible.

I am a Christian and I believe in evolution (believe is probably the wrong word since it makes it sound like a religion). I see no problem with Genesis since it still does not contradict my scientific beliefs. As was pointed out earlier day does not mean 24 hours. The Bible never says Adam and Eve were the only man and woman, Adam means first, possibly the first to evolve sentience.

its a myth: it conveys the glory and sovereignty of gods creation, and says that he did create, but it has nothing to say on how he did it.

its a myth: it conveys the glory and sovereignty of gods creation, and says that he did create, but it has nothing to say on how he did it.

Exactly!

at lkeast, thats what it was meant to convey by jews who believed that god had created the world...

I am very interested in mythology. What I meant was just it being a myth, I'm not bothered about it being wrong. But if I was taking the Bible literally, I might be a bit concerned.

>> ...it has nothing to say on how he did it. <<


A good magician never reveals the trick. And a good mystery reveals the answers to all the clues in a parlor scene in the last chapter.

~jwf~

I believe the mystery is "built in" if there is a master plan. It has it's own purpose

http://www.jcf.org/works.php

Ooops spelled Joseph Campbell wrong before

not to step on anybody's toes, but I've always felt that Joseph Campbell was just a poor man's Mercia Eliade.

Thanks for the tip!
I see they have covered similar ground

really need a proper smiley..

I love Joseph Campbell. He didn't write for the intellectual elite. He wrote for his students and for the general populace, using language everyone can understand. He encourages and stimlates further study. And he was a wonderful person.

I love Joseph Campbell. He didn't write for the intellectual elite. He wrote for his students and for the general populace, using language everyone can understand. He encourages and stimulates further study. And he was a wonderful person.

I realize that people use the word fundamentalism to describe people who are way out in left field for their beliefs and are essentially crazed maniacs, intolerant of anyone else's beliefs, but the actual definition of fundamental is more along the lines of beliefs based on basic (elementary or foundational) principles.


The word raises my hackles every time I see it describing hateful zealots of any religous background, because in it's simplist definition (above), I consider myself to be a fundamentalist, but certainly don't want to be identified with the commomly accepted definition.

It's my problem, not yours, no need to change the way you describe them for my sake.

>> really need a proper smiley.. <<

Indeed!
I used to think that was a pretty good'un, indicating, as footprints do, that someone had been present and quietly left their mark before wandering off. As if they knew that you would want to know they 'had been there', but they had 'nothing particular to say' at the moment and 'might be back'.

But I have since learned that 'feet' are considered rude in several cultures and any presentation of them is seen as an insult, most particularly by Islamic Arabs.

I recall that feathers have often been used as bookmarks so perhaps or
Or would that be considered "giving someone 'the bird'"?


~jwf~

Perhaps we could ask Amy to design an actual bookmark with a tassle.

Good Idea! An actual bookmark

I have no desire to insult anyone!
Better than the *bird* <<<cute bird!

"There is a lot of talk over the course of this thread about fundamentalism. I just wish to point out tat Christian fundamentalism is as dangerous as any other fundamentalism eg. Islam. I am not discriminating against Muslims, I am using this as an example because Islamic fundamentalists have been in the news a lot recently."

In the west, I'd say its more dangerous, simply because many moderate Christians seem to simply accept any Christianity as good and ignore the dangers of fundamentalism and because its easier for Christian fundamentalist groups to get legislators to listen to them than it is for Muslim fundamentalist groups. Fundamentalism is more dangerous when it wouks through legislation than when it works through terror.

"For example, the Bible speaks of Adam being the first man and Eve being the first woman. It doesn't say they are the only man and woman God created so the idea that everyone is descended from Adam and Eve is unfounded. They had a son called Cain and , to quote the Good News Bible,"Cain and his wife had a son and named him Enoch." If Eve was the only woman God had created then Cain would not have had a wife! Therefore God created other women and presumably other men, so the belief that we are all descnded from Adam and Eve is unfounded. Some Christians take the view that all people were descended from Adam and Eve and some atheists I know use the argument about Cain's wife to support there idea that the Bible is a lie. The Bible appears to contradict itself but AT NO POINT DOES IT SAY GOD ONLY CREATED ADAM AND EVE. This is assumed by people but never said in the Bible."

Another explanation for the need for God to create other humans is that, clearly, if Adam and Eve were the only ones he made, incest would be the only way to continue humanity for a few generations after that and I think the Bible says something about incest being wrong.