h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

No, no, no..... I was talking about the questionable foreign language posts being *forwarded* to a volunteer for translation, who would then forward the translation back to the mod who would then render a decision - totally unnecessary to give the vols any kind of access - Ok, the mods need to go to all that trouble, looking on a list of who can translate what language and hitting a send button, which takes extra time and effort, especially if they don't know what language they're trying to translate. But it's either that or no foreign languages. Guess that's what we're stuck with, as long as they don't trust us to the bad stuff.

There used to be a Translators' Scheme at A617320. This would have allowed the Powers to accept at least some foreign language content in the Guide. I'm so sorry to hear that they did not accept what some of us have offered to them.

For my part, this is it. I have met some very lovely people here at the Guide, and I would never want to have missed one single minute of my h2g2 presence. I have learned a lot, I have had the opportunity to polish my English (which still is a foreign language for me). I'm sorry to see it end like this.

Goodbye, and thanks for all the .

Jeremy

Hi all,

The difficulties that arise logistically when trying to moderate foreign language postings have already been discussed extensively in a number of previous conversations on h2g2. I've bookmarked many of these conversations on my work computer and I'm happy to look them up on Monday, when I get back to the office.

The main issue is time; the transvol scheme was a pilot project which we tried out to see if we could moderate foreign languages postings in this way, but it wasn't feasible, it took up an inordinate amount of office time. Every solution we take on has to be scalable, and emailing translations back and forth just wasn't workable. The previous conversations explained this fully. I'll hunt them them out as soon as I can, and I hope that they'll explain the problems and the issues we'd need to be able to resolve before we're able to offer a foreign language facility on h2g2.

Hope this helps, hang on 'til Monday!

Hi people,

please grow up!

remember you can express your opinion and write articles here. millions of people can not express their ideas and they get imprissioned for it!

the BBC will soon see that they can not stop the progress, but them give them some time! the progress of most researchers goes mach 2, but at BBC they go as fast MiniCooper.

remember your freedom! use your energy positive!

WOW - greetings,
pheloxi

WOW - Wish Only Well
see meme webguide A573040

I second that pheloxi, and while we're waiting I'd like to say that I believe the use of English only *is* unfair to everyone for whom English is not their first language.

But I'd also like to chuck in another way of thinking about this. English, for historical reasons (I'm not claiming any merits for it over other language) has become of the most 'common' languages. I believe only Spanish rivals it's usage around the world. You find it spoken in the depths of Tanzania, in the far east, in the exsoviet countries.....even in the US ().

With the best will in the world the vast majority of us can never learn all the languages there are. Given that, isn't the best way to communicate all over the world the use of a 'common language'? Hate it or love it, for historical reasons, that common language is likely to be English or Spanish.

Surely we can find a way to live with the use of a common language if the BBC finds itself without the capability to deal with several languages? Perhaps we should ask the TPTB to give priority to finding a way to allow Spanish, or whatever the language is that, combined with English, would make this site accessible to the most people. (Or should we opt for Esperanto as being fair everyone?)

Waz (I don't speak Spanish. Or Esperanto.)

I would not like to live in the world where everybody speaks English. I don't think any language should have this kind of position. I am quite happy living in a multiligual and multicultural world. I used to think that h2g2 is a small model of this world. It is not. Being grown up in a totalitarian society I hate any this kind of symptom. Sorry.

why are people always think negative first?
being negative costs a lot more energy!

for while and let heart decide
- thomas dolby

the glass
some people see the glass half empty or glass half full.
I see that there is something in the glass and that is a lot more important!

say WOW! think WOW!

working together is a lot better, than against each other!

you create society and only negatives will let themselves run over!

WOW - Wish Only Well
more on WOW see meme webguide A573040 under WOWzone

pheloxi
your mindmentor
who never grows up either, but thinks positive about H2G2 future, wich is very bright with lots of eye candy.

I understand that Hatifnat. I cannot decide, myself, between the amazing benefits of everyone the world over being able to communicate easily (as dreamed of by the Esperanto creators I think) and the enormous cultural loss of a language dying. My native language should be Gaelic - I don't know a word of it and that matters to me.

*sigh*

People far mor erudite than I have said things far better than I can now but here goes:

Ironic isn't it? Hitchikers Guide to the GALAXY? Anyone? Hello?

Guess not.



P.S Sprachen ze duck?
[Do you speak DUCK?]

Quack?


Quack? Quack?

Quack.

QUACK!

Alreet whey Hinny, ah'd bettor gan canny then!
Thon's ganna be aakwaad lyek. Ah'm agyen't.

Divvent fash yersen ye puir aad moderators, ah'm all clear as far as the ban answers - there's nowt bit English i' this post.
(Mind 'tis full o' nowt but blethor)

Noo hingoanrerr Jimmy, ah'm scunnert thit ye huvvin tae apoalagise tae awrae chantywrasslers itrabeeb ritdae nuthin bit stuff coke upthur noses, furrafact yurra Geordie blether. In fact ah'm merr rin affrontit, ah'm f****n beelin'. Therr's nae need tae apoalagise, uv course yur a blether, yur a wimmin, yiv evry f****n' right tae gab aw day, even if it is ra biggest loadakeech heard ootside arra BBC commnetary team itra fitba'. Gie it laldy hen, ah'm away tae crash oot furranoor ur two.

I'm sad.

I'm sad to see Jeremy go - I won't go, but I do understand.
I'm sad because I am now no longer allowed to share Danish poetry or songwriting with my Nordic friends, as I have done on occasions - whenever my English skills have allowed it with a translation or explanation underneath.
I'm sad because we're not trusted but must be proven OK at every single instance when we post.
I'm sad to be cut off from people who might not have the ability to write in English - people from areas in the world where history is happening and where you could get impressions of how the people there think and feel.
I'm sad because I think that the Internet is a global medium and this decision in my mind does not reflect - or maybe even deny - that.
I'm sad because corporate thinking once again is what determines the outcome rather than what a community thinks and feels.

I am sad.

sad indeed

Re: Post 98

The reason stated for not including it (in post 40) was that the Isle of Man is not part of the UK, hence my response that it should be included as the Isle of Man fall within the BBC's remit.


Re: Post 104

Peta, British Minority languages are NOT foreign language and should not be included in this sort of ban

Hi Wazungu,

"With the best will in the world the vast majority of us can never learn all the languages there are. Given that, isn't the best way to communicate all over the world the use of a 'common language'?"

It's not an issue of all researchers being able to communicate with each other all the time. It's an issue of whether some researchers can choose which language they want to communicate in, knowing that they may limit (or increase) their audience depending on how many people speak that language. H2G2 is not like a car that only has space under the bonnet for one motor. The only practical limitation to which languages are possible on h2g2 (outside of BBC's need to protect us from each other whether we want it or not) is the alphabet that h2g2 is currently able to display.

"Surely we can find a way to live with the use of a common language if the BBC finds itself without the capability to deal with several languages?"

A more accurate wording would be "if the BBC refuses to deal with several languages." Obviously the BBC is *capable* of dealing with several languages, because they have allowed other languages here before without catastrophes, and they handle multiple languages on other special sites. (Isn't there some special Gaelic or Welsh BBC site that allows public participation?)

This is only a "logistical" problem if one believes the premise that BBC ought to pro-actively censor us. The logistical problem would disappear if the BBC used reactive moderation, a system which is widely accepted around the rest of the web.

It is particularly sad and poignant that Jeremy of all people should leave because of this. He is, as far as I know, the only German researcher who has not used German on site. He actually said to me once in an e-mail that he found it wrong to have conversations that excluded others.

--

At the Summer Meet up, if a couple of Dutch researchers are talking together, or German, or Swedish, will people be walking round tapping them on the shoulders and saying "Would you mind speaking English"?

--

Having done a bit of Transvolling, I confirm that it was such that we actually "moderated" what we were sent. It would have been too much to translate it all, as there was just as much "waffle" as you get in any of the English language threads. It worked on trust, and, while I can vouch personally for most of the other Transvols, I can see that it is a risky thing for the PTB.

--

One further Question:

Does this ruling apply to the whole of the bbc website or just H2G2?

I don't have time to read the backlog but I am also sorry to see Jeremy leave.

See. my title didn't get moderated.

This is the upside of the thread titles being exempt from things.

Unfortunately they are also excluded from searches which is very frustrating. I can often only remember a heading but not a word from a posting when I'm trying to find something clever I remember one of my friends saying somewhere.

Didn't it?