h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

< In the Bible the names and dates were encoded together. In War And Peace adn the two other books they were not. And the odds of finding the encoded info by RANDOM CHANCE were ultimately found to be 1 IN 10 MILLION. And as I said before, this is DOCUMENTED and PROVEN. Where are YOUR references, IF you take your discussions so seriously? If you can't back up what you say with facts instead of heresay, then this isn't, as you say, a 'serious' discussion at all>

Look up the page a couple of post you will see I have put in some links to a webpage which then links to the 45 page paper explaining why the work explained in the initial 1994 paper is both poorly formulated and that the odds are a lot lower than 1 in 10 million.



It is documented but certainly not proven as can be demonstarted by the numurous explanations on the web as to WHY the 'Bible Code' work is incorrect.

You may be interested to know that this is how research and advancement in knowledge happens. There are plenty of peer reviewed papers, work and theories that are later shown to be incorrect - it happens and this is one of those cases. However, in these cases the people behind the research are trying to advance human knowledge and will accept that their theories are incorrect when shown why. In the case of the Bible Code it is being held up by people who want to cling onto a millenia old cult and remain comfy and warm in their little cocoon of fairy-tale bliss.

Jungle_Stud. I see you have expanded your personal space entry to include the line



Are you Jewish or Christian for starters?

And you believe EVERY…EVERY word in the OT?

So, presumably you must believe that gods order of creation was that humans were created after the other animals and the first man and woman were created simultaneously. Oh AND that the order of creation was ALSO humans were created before the other animals. The man was created first, then the animals, then the woman from the man's rib.

How can you believe every word in the Bible when it contradicts itself in the first few pages?

Also, off the top of my head, do you not talk to your wife during her period? Do you not wear clothes of mixed fabrics? And if you were in the armed forces at all did you insist that any soldier having a ‘nocturnal emission’ go out side the walls of the camp for a day(or what ever time period it was).

And The Great Flood: do you really Noah collected up all the animals on the Earth and put them into ONE ark for over a month?

And I’m not even going to get into the *really* vicious nasty stuff that’s in the OT I wo9uld be here all day.

But, at least I can see why you believe the Bible Code is true and accurate.

<<"As athiests you must believe in the truth of math, right?">>

Now, that's interesting...

Atheism means you don't believe in God or Gods. Nothing more, nothing less. Its very often associated with the viewpoint that the world can potentially be rationally understood, but it doesn't necessarily imply it. It doesn't even have to imply a disbelief in the supernatural, although most people would take it that way.

Well, let's see if my Uni gives me access to this journal shall we...

The rebuttal paper in the same journal in 1999 is here, probably most of you won't be able to look at it, but just so you know its there. I wouldn't recommend wading through its all (stats is dull, isn't it?), but the editor's introduction explains the situation:

Kass, Robert E., 'Introduction to "Solving the Bible Code Puzzle" by Brendan McKay, Dror Bar-Natan, Maya Bar-Hillel and Gil Kalai' in Statistical Science, Vol. 14, No. 2. (May, 1999), p. 149, http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0883-4237%28199905%2914%3A2%3C149%3AIT%22TBC%3E2.0.CO%3B2-H

Brendan McKay; Dror Bar-Natan; Maya Bar-Hillel; Gil Kalai, 'Solving the Bible Code Puzzle' in Statistical Science, Vol. 14, No. 2. (May, 1999), pp. 150-173, http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0883-4237%28199905%2914%3A2%3C150%3ASTBCP%3E2.0.CO%3B2-D

'Abstract: A paper of Witztum, Rips and Rosenberg in this journal in 1994 made the extraordinary claim that the Hebrew text of the Book of Genesis encodes events which did not occur until millennia after the text was written. In reply, we argue that Witztum, Rips and Rosenberg's case is fatally defective, indeed that their result merely reflects on the choices made in designing their experiment and collecting the data for it. We present extensive evidence in support of that conclusion. We also report on many new experiments of our own, all of which failed to detect the alleged phenomenon'.

<
yes the original Torah WAS written in Hebrew w/ no spaces between words or punctuation. >

Ah, so you were there then?

Those interested in the history of the Hebrew language should pop over to http://www.adath-shalom.ca/rabin_he.htm and learn a little about the history of the Hebrew language from a paper written by a professor of Hebrew language at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem-I think he knows what he's talking about.

Secret codes in the bible-what hogwash!

<>

Good points all, Bouncy. Maths are one of several rational things that make sense precisely because they are logical and rational, though. Maths are objective, unlike the Bible, which seems a bit subjective to me.

I was being SARCASTIC because that is quite a contradiction, isn't it? Much of what I wrote is tonge in cheek, because I didn't really believe that anyone would read it. And no, I DON'T talk to my wife during her period. And I pity the person who does! I really got flamed here for stating my opinion and what I believe, but hey, I've never been one to let what others think or say about me to influence my beliefs. I prefer to examine facts and data for myself. And I have researched the arguments against the Bible Code and must say that until recently I didn't even have ready accesss to the internet so most of this was new to me. I apologize if I came off offensive to anyone, because now I truly feel I was uninformed. In the same breath, I never purposely said anything to insult anyone, and I kept my mind open. I've never said anything was "hogwash" because even though our opinions may differ I still respect yours and have no reason to belittle you. And this isn't just a reply to you, it's a reply to all the ppl on here who took it upon themselves to teach me a well-deserved lesson. Bravo.

<>

As a female, I'm pretty shocked by this. Are you saying that for 6-7 days out of every month, you do not speak to your wife? Is that possible? I daresay men are a lot more difficult to deal with every day than one woman on her period.

Hands up who says we live in a new age for women ... I didn't think so.

During those 6-7 days I only speak when spoken to.

You reminded me of a funny bit of a comedy sketch, that a friend of mine was telling me about @ Uni today. About two brothers, whose names were "Jesus Christ!" and "Damnit." I don't remember all the specifics, but the punchline part is where the parents get upset/mad, and mix the two of their 'names' up.

0->: "Yet, is there any possible, socially correct way, to disagree with women, -on anything _ left?" I pipe up, as a ed teenager, on the ups & downs of 98-99.5-ish % rejection (meant to be taken as, pointedly, in tone).

Lesson 1: WE do read personal space entries because they are a) sometimes funny! and b) can give an idea of who the person is.

Unfortunately people do believe in everything the OT says so I was not surprised that you stated it.



You have not got 'flamed' but you have had some people challenge what you have siad quite robustly. Mainly, due to the fairly overwhelming work carried out showing the Bible Code is a poorly defined piece of 'research'. I hope you have looked at the links I posted showing the statistical errors in the basis of the work.



Maybe you should - that's how we learn. I would also challenge that statement as ANY Christian/Jew has had major influences over how they see the world.



The net is great isn't it? The best way to get info on anything you want.



I would not say you have been offensive or insulting so do not apologise.



And PLEASE do call peoples views hogwash but always back that statement up with why you think they are. ANd don't start respecting every ones views or opinions because sometimes they ARE absolute, uninformed tripe. The majority of people on this site have had their views changed and their whole take on life. There are a few good articles on why we stick around here and what it has done to us.

Ben (Of the Wierd sexual practice entry) has a few articles she put together about h2g2s position in the real world. It will hopefully put somethings into perspective.

But don't assume you will get an easy ride!!! We do not expect it.

But please have some fun as well - this thread is one of the more...erm...robust and open threads due to its very nature. You really jumped in at the deep end.

http://www.imgag.com/product/preview/flash/wsShell.swf?ihost=http://www.imgag.com&brand=/product/preview/flash/wsag&cardNum=/product/full/ap/3066708/graphic1&mtype=0&&NameFirstFrom=&NameFirstTo

Ben's entries are @ A3764063A3795131A3822086 and A3845469

alji

I should have put commas between them!

A3764063, A3795131, A3822086 and A3845469

From http://www.advicemeant.com/flame/12-commandment.shtml

The Golden Rule of Flaming:
May your flames be witty,
insulting, interesting, paradoxical,
funny, illogical, caustic, sarcastic,
even inconsistent - but never,ever, let them be boring.
[rule #42]

alji

< I daresay men are a lot more difficult to deal with every day than one woman on her period.>

Your opinion will change if you're employed by a woman. My wife's opinion changed when her supervisor retired and the new one was female, and it remained the same in the four jobs she has had since as well as that of other female AND male employees she worked and works with.



Hand's up. If you don't think so then perhaps you're due for a review of recent history-this thread spends a lot of time on very, very, very old stuff.

Well said Alfster
Once in a while I think everyone here has 'run into the room' rattling a saber, only to find that the whole room is full of other people with their own sabers already held high-it can be a very eye and mind opening experience.


^a good thing to have

As I believe in reincarnation, yes as a matter of fact I was there when the bible was first written. At first it was handed down orally, but as time went on, it'd take people up to 25 years to memorize the whole thing correctly plus keep up to date with all the revisions, so God decided to write it down. I was His white-out. (Creation-wise, God made no mistakes, but His spelling ain't too good. Notice His greatest creations inherited this.)

<>

This is a bit of a tangent, but I'll explain more fully what I meant here. At my school very few of the girls I come across seem to be at all interested in the fact that women are supposed to be *equal* to men nowadays. Many wear Playboy bunnies on their shirts, assuming their roles in life as sex objects and not as people. Others bow down to their boyfriends' wishes, from letting the guy pay for dinner to saying that she loves him and will do anything for him. The theory that women are equal because they can get jobs and vote and whatnot is entirely superficial. I suppose that, visibly, we've come a long way in even the past hundred years, but a deep prejudice towards women is still firmly rooted in Western culture.

Anyone know where the thing about Jewish menstruating women had to sit up on the roof comes from? (heard this years ago - not sure if there is any truth in it).

Menstruation taboos are rife in all non-modern societies. The idea being that the woman was somehow 'unclean', though weirdly was not allowed to bathe or even wash her hair during this week.

So, why do you not speak to your wife when she is menstruating, JS? Just because it's an OT thing? How does she feel about this?


az