h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

RE: vegetarianism

My dad's a vegetarian because of the prodigious amounts of grain needed to feed one cow to produce meat for the table. It's what I think of as intellectual vegetarianism. In societies that have their food problems pretty much solved, we have the luxury of deciding whether or not to eat meat because of the wide variety of foods available to us. It's definitely motivated by 'bourgeousie guilt!'

Countries like India started avoiding meat not because of the scarcity of it - there's plenty of fish, crabs, frogs and eels in the lakes and rivers - but because of religious dietary restrictions. These probably arose because meat couldn't be stored or prepared safely - the same reason for the Jewish dietary laws. In a land where water covers the ground three months out of the year, it's hard to keep bacteria and other organisms out of the food. So they because vegetarians out of necessity.

"My dad's a vegetarian because of the prodigious amounts of grain needed to feed one cow to produce meat for the table. It's what I think of as intellectual vegetarianism."

This is a verty provincial attitude to have. There are places were the environment is suited to cattle and sheep ect. After all these are natural animals.

Here there are vast feilds and sloping hils and no need for grain.

Personally I think that the fact that our eyes are not on the sides of our heads, we have sharp canines and short insestinal tracks are clues to what is natural.

Thanks all for the , BTW

Okay this is "What is wrong with Americans" not "What is wrong with vegetarians/carinvores" so lets get back on track.

At this point it is not official or anything but CNN,AP and Reuters are all saying Arnold Schwartzenneggar will be the next governor of california. If this is not a walking, talking, groping, lying, flat-out bone-ignorant, no-necked example of the epitome of what is wrong with Americans, then I don't know what is.
If a novellist were to write a political farce in which someone like Arnie were elected governor it would be decried as too far fetched.

Don't blame me. I voted for Larry Flynt. The man may be exploiting women, but at least he's honest about it, and about where his money comes from. I also voted against the recall.

I blame Darrell Issa. And I think that now that California has opened the door to recall, Arnie's got a year, tops, to fix the budget. Or we're going to recall him, too.

Thank goodness I am here temporarily!

> This is a verty provincial attitude to have. There are places were the environment is suited to cattle and sheep ect. After all these are natural animals.

I agree that these are natural animals. However, it's not natural to force-feed a cow to produce fatty, rich underexercised muscle tissue. A cow in the wild would certainly be edible, but it wouldn't be the grain-fed beef that we're used to getting in the supermarket today. Americans eat much more meat than is necessary for a balanced diet. We only need one meat meal a day, and most Americans get three.

> Personally I think that the fact that our eyes are not on the sides of our heads, we have sharp canines and short insestinal tracks are clues to what is natural.

Oh, we're definitely omnivores. No doubt about that! We evolved by cracking bones for their marrow and stealing meat from under the noses of larger predators. Now that we no longer have to do that, squeamish human beings can eat what they choose, instead of what's necessary for survival. I'm an omnivore. I don't know that I'd be able to kill a mammal and eat it, but I know that I can catch a fish, skin it and eat it - which I would expect of anybody that eats meat.

Okay, back on track with the a**-grabbing Republicans...

> At this point it is not official or anything but CNN,AP and Reuters are all saying Arnold Schwartzenneggar will be the next governor of california. If this is not a walking, talking, groping, lying, flat-out bone-ignorant, no-necked example of the epitome of what is wrong with Americans, then I don't know what is.

What makes it funny is that Arnold is Austrian! I certainly hope that California won't vote Schwartzenegger into office. Not only will it throw off the balance for Democrats, but Arnold is not an experienced politician, and California needs somebody that can rebuild it.

Yeah, I just read that it's official. Sorry! It could be worse, I suppose. (I'm not sure how!)

It's going to be entertaining, if nothing else.

While I agree that it is amusing that the Terminator is apparently governor, what's the big deal?

Is it that he's Austrian born? Should people of Austrian descent not be allowed to run for public office? Is it that he's an immigrant? Should immigrants not be allowed to run? Is it that he's an actor? That he's a bad actor? Should actors not be allowed to run? What about lawyers? or soldiers? or nuclear engineers? or peanut farmers?

It seems to me that it is potentially a good thing about the U. S. that people from any background and profession are able to be elected to high office.

Of course, if the groping Nazi stuff is true, maybe there's an issue.

Well he's hardly the first actor-become-governor, how is he? Nor would he be the first president. He'd have some trouble running for that office though, as I last heard immigrants can't become president by law. I would however think it more likely to happen than say, a woman or a coloured person to become president.

Nazi stuff, haven't heard of that. What's he done?

Yes, I cannot believe that Big Arnie was elected! We sat stunned, amused and amazed as he made his all but incomprehensible victory speech - and this morning the radio news was full of it. A newsreader on our local commercial FM music station what we listen to in the morning always calls him "Sworzy-n****r" which is funny in itself. (Or in case of nannyware, I'll say "sworzy-n-word". (It's just her pronunciation, like yesterday she referred to a "cachet of gold" (cache I presume, and today pronounced "success" as "su-ssess"!)

I think the issue is that he hasn't got a clue! He (apparently) has no policy,no political experience and no ideas about what to do to fix the ecomony. People elected him purely on name recognition it would seem.

"However, it's not natural to force-feed a cow to produce fatty, rich underexercised muscle tissue. A cow in the wild would certainly be edible, but it wouldn't be the grain-fed beef that we're used to getting in the supermarket today. Americans eat much more meat than is necessary for a balanced diet."

Maybe misstreatment of animals related to this thread then. Try looking for the "New Zealand Beef & Lamb" sticker. It's not force fead but I'm told it's expencive over there. Try some.

"It seems to me that it is potentially a good thing about the U. S. that people from any background and profession are able to be elected to high office."

Maybe a 'What's Wrong With Americans' is the xenophobic clause in their constitution that forbids an immigrant from running for el prez.

His immigrant status isn't what I take issue with. He's got no political experience and he's a republican, albeit a liberal one. I tend not to like republicans, given their propensity for poking into people's lives.

The issue of immigrants becoming president had to do with the American Revolution, actually. The framers of the US Constitution were deathly afraid that someone from somewhere else (read: England) would return the US to British control, since fully 1/3 of the residents of the colonies at the time of the Revolution were supporters of the king. (The other 2/3s were pretty equally split between revolutionaries and folks who didn't care) Is it outdated? Sure. But I don't know that changing it with a view towards giving Arnie a chance to run for president is the best reason! It's not xenophobia, it's leftover practicality.

" It's not xenophobia, it's leftover practicality"

how many of your rights are ammendments? does an immigrant not deserve the same rights. Surely to leave things as they are is taxation without fair representation.

What is a democratic process it people are barred from running?

Oh, now, don't go getting all huffy on me. There's never really been an immigrant who pushed the issue, and it's not really looming large on the American political agenda (although the things that *are* looming large may or may not be things *I* personally think *should* be important).

And what do you mean about taxation without fair representation? If one is a legal immigrant to this country, and becomes a citizen, he or she is more than welcome to vote. Illegal immigrants can't vote, and if I were to move to England and get a job, I could be taxed, but unless I become a citizen, I can't vote. Is that taxation without representation? In fact, I don't know of any country that allows non-citizens to vote. Nor, in fact, do I know of any countries that allow non-citizens to be in public office. If your question is, why can't non-nativeborn citizens run for the office of president, I think I explained that...it's a holdover from the 18th century, and while it may be old-fashioned, it's not exactly some sort of concerted effort on the part of the US to discriminate against immigrants.

You might want to look at immigration history before assuming the US is a country of raging xenophobes. The US is *made* of immigrants, including Native Americans who eons ago crossed a land bridge from what is now Russia. Arnie's kids can run for president, and that man has more rights, by virtue of his wallet, than I do!

Actually, just to correct one misnomer about human digestion - your intestinal tract is too *long* for digesting meat. Meat rots in your gut as opposed to being properly digested.

Look up the stats on the avearge amount of rotting meat found in an American carcass sometime.

As for Arnie, well, the people of California will get the government they deserve. They have no one to blame but themselves if another Proposition 13 robs them of fire services again and all their houses burn down in the next lot of forest fires.

Again, don't blame me. I wasn't here when Prop 13 was passed (only moved here last year), and frankly, I think it's the most screwed up thing ever. It robs the state of literally billions of dollars. While I think first time home buyers, or people who buy homes in areas that are "high crime" or what have you, should be protected, the fact is, I think anyone who buys a home that costs a million or more (and there are lots!) shouldn't get the benefit of Prop 13. Call it a luxury tax, or whatever. But tax people!!!

I think that's part of the problem here, and I've seen it in Britain, as well. People want all of the services, but don't want to pay for it. I think a lot of what's wrong with the US would be solved if a graduated flat tax was enacted....those making X would pay 5%, then 10%, then 15%, then 20%, finally topping out at 25%. I mean really, would Bill Gates actually miss a quarter of his income? And shut down ALL corporate loopholes!

Very socialist Montana, but be careful you dont get pigdeonholed a communist. What you're saying sounds very like "from each according to their abilities too each according to their needs" Monty.

You tell 'em Montana. I believe Arnie comes from Graz in Austria which is a nice provincial town. People there, in general, are catholic and conservative. He would not pass the test there because of the womanising bits Arnie has allegedly been upto. I say good luck to him.