h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Link war!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2012/mar/18/video-games-propaganda-tools-military?INTCMP=SRCH

Do link wars cause violence?

No - but smartarses do.

Why do the Guardian publish articles when the question posed can be answered with two letters?

No.

It's like saying "Hollywood made a film about war - is Hollywood just a military propaganda machine?"

Of course it's not. Unless I completely missed that particular subtext in Finding Nemo.

Well, "finding", why would you want to find anyone if not to *save* them? And then, Nemo, a four-letter name like Ryan?

So finding Nemo = Saving Private Ryan, hence, yet another war movie.

There we go!

I hadn't thought about it that way...

A quote from Ed's link:

"Every branch of the US armed forces and many,
many police departments are using retooled video
games to train their personnel."

With the possible exception of an argument over
the meaning of 'retooled', I rest my case.


~jwf~

Why are you resting your case before arguing for it

Just lazy I guess. Like those who didn't
read the backlog where I was jumped upon
for even suggesting video games can be used
to re-condition our urge to kill.


~jwf~

What means 'relooted'?

sorry, mixed up the letters still, what does that mean?

I guess that reading the backlog is overrated, and squiggles jumping is popular entertainment

I'm sure that video games can be used to re-condition people's urge to kill. But, cannot books be used to brainwash people as well? And does it make literature a dubious form of entertainment?

Re-tooled = re-purposed or re-worked.

And this is just it. I have seen the gaming engine used to create games used, for example, to create a tool to teach Royal Navy recruits learn their way around a nuclear submarine. I have seen the tools used to create realistic virtual environments used to create realistic virtual environments used to teach soldiers how to drive lorries in a convoy.

Obviously it does not follow that all uses of the same technology turns gamers into trained killers.

Ah, I can see how some games can be good for that because they provide the possibility to create very accurate 3d models of pretty much everything. The big advantage is that the technology of the games (or the engine) already exists and the army just has to load their 3d models into it.

But this hardly has anything to do with the original games, it just uses the software, doesn't it?

It's like writing a manual for building a bomb and then claiming it's the same as a fantasy novel because it uses the same letters. Maybe a bad example. Can't think of a better one I fear.

A better example, perhaps, is that many ancient weapons were developed from hunting and farming implements. But it does not follow that using a billhook in the fields is the same as traning to use one in a block of men-at-arms.

Back when I was an undergraduate, there was an undergraduate Management degree module which involved playing one of the 'Civilisation' series of games using various strategies, and (presumably) writing a rather less entertaining report.

If anyone is seriously arguing (and it's hard to tell) that computer games turn people into killers, or repress various empathy things, or desensitise, or whatever.... then why aren't there more killers or violent crime, given the number of people playing computer games? Why aren't we a more violent society than before the widespread availability of games?

Yes, pretty much like that - except that obviously there are certain games which already have the military bits and bobs in place.

Those I know in the field suggest that the training value is pretty much untested and probably overrated. There's been a rush into the technology partly because it looks like a convenient solution - real training is expensive, especially when you consider you need things like tanks to chase, and also more dangerous - but also partly because of the Toys For Boys appeal. I know enough about training and training technology to know that anyone who tried to use it to dehumanise soldiers would be an idiot - although this doesn't not necessarily mean that it hasn't been done. It just ain't how training works.

The same technology has uses that even Squiggles might feel are more benign. For example I've seen a 3D texture-mapped model of Glasgow that has been used for things like evacuation planning and planning the security for VIP visits (snipers' angles of fire, etc).

I've also seen the technology used for medical simulation, so maybe it's not *entirely* dehumanising.

The buzzword to google is 'serious gaming'.

My last @Tavaron.

"used to re-condition our urge to kill. "

It's a big jump from 'training' to 'conditioning killing urges'.

That said, I can't think of any on-the-job training I've done that's not resulted in a strong urge to murder those around me.

Fortunately I've always been able to relax with a computer game instead.

Squiggles 'retooled' is quite a key word there: it means the games have to be changed before they can be used for military training. It means the games as currently available can't be used for such purposes.

It's very noble of you to highlight the section that proves you were wrong in the first place. Well done.