h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Zyrak what do you hope to achieve with this behavior?

"Well, I'm just telling you. It's not Jim's responsibility, I'm sure he doesn't have the time"

"You can ask Jim to contact Telewest, but I wouldn't expect him to be able to set the running of h2g2 aside for a few minutes while he communicates with Telewest the issue which they've already closed."

You shouldn't make assumptions about what my responsibilities are, aka. Or my time management, for that matter.

If there were a chance that TW shut down the service because they thought that's what the BBC wanted, then I'd certainly make every effort to get it reinstated. But if you're correct and TW never intended their boxes to access all of BBCi, then there would be nothing I could do.

So tell me, aka, what do you think would be the right thing for me to do in this circumstance?

he's unsubscribed Jim. and i would be a bit wary at the moment, he's a bit tetchy


*clears throat for the official bit*

if i get in contact with Telewest and basically grovel to them about this situation, would you be willing to 'endorse', in a manner of speaking, my request to them. i am going to get an online petition started for those affected and those who care to sign

If an online petition is started I shall be glad to sign. I for one would also like the Email details for telewest, so I can make my veiws clear. At least to someone who has the power to do something.

i tried aquiring them but as you see, no response here

all i need to start it is someone who can make one i have no idea how.

Don't tell me he has unsuscribed...

I wanted to add something to his explanations about the repeativeness of this thread and all the others...

Oh well, just in case he decides to lurk, here we go:


>For: Says on thing
Against: Says how disgusted they are at 'banning digibox users'.
For: Reiterates first point, to which...<

aka...

You forgot to mention about those who [like myself, for example] are disgusted about the way you went about it..


loup[in mourning]

"would you be willing to 'endorse', in a manner of speaking, my request to them"

I couldn't endorse it on behalf of the BBC - not without checking with a few people at work. But I will be pursuing this tomorrow, to ensure that it isn't a gigantic mistake. As I said earlier, the chances are this is Telewest simply clarifying the service they wish to provide, but it's best to be sure.

well, any effort is appreciated as you are probably aware. but unfortunately i believe we will now be swimming upstream with this.

i asked aka for some contact info via email. i got a rather shirty reply he did say several times to email him didn't he, or was i just dreaming that

viva la resistance!

my ..

..as far as I can see, many arguments in this thread basically boil down to two stems of reasoning.

a) X and Y are {insert adjective} for cutting off digibox access to h2g2

(paraphrase as appropriate to incarnation)

This argument isn't really an argument so much as an assertion, and doesn't really do much other than villify and cause bad feelings, so I won't comment.

b) Lots of people used the digibox service, it wasn't causing telewest any trouble, it was their means of social support, etc.

The fact that people were able to access h2g2 through their TVs is great; ironically, since h2g2's attempts to get h2g2 working via WAP or Avantgo were unsuccessful and never got off the ground respectively, digibox access seems to me to cut the closest towards some of the ideas which are at the core of the site's reason for being. That, however, isn't the point; the point is that this is *not* what those individuals had their digibox access for, and it isn't what they were paying for, and why their access to h2g2 has been cut off isn't the point - they were 'living on borrowed time' to start with, so to speak; telewest were under no obligation to provide them with this service, and it wasn't the intended purpose of the service.

That said, I think that allowing people access to h2g2 (whilst I find using the internet using TVs extremely painful) via their TVs is a fantastic idea, and if some sort of deal can be brokered with TeleWest whereby this is enabled, then (in a way), Digibox users are better off than they were in the first place, since now they have a warranted and guaranteed service.

But yeah, I'll toddle off now.

Sorry that you're being given so much hassle over this, Jim; with the nature of the job I have at the moment, I can fully empathise.

Wow...Still going.



Unfortunately I dont think a petition will help this situation.
However if people think it would help I would be glad to sign.

Phew. Finally got to the end of the thread, past the bickering and the vitriol, the fair arguments against what has happened (because there are fair arguments against it, and yes, I do listen), the vindictive hypocritical nature of certain people that started the thread despite only wanting to flame myself and aka, and the rather delightful/suprising contributions of njan and Jim Lynn (who, believe it or not, I am quite happy to agree with).

Now I have nothing more to say. Isn't that pleasant!?

Well, it's certainly a novelty...



B

i'm confused by what i have picked up here and there with regards to telewest,and the BBC inability to sort out whatever is stopping
digital users loging in.

if these users can use ceefax could not a h2g2 portal be used there for telewest customers or is it to complicated i would have thought
it simple enough.

Jim,

"You shouldn't make assumptions about what my responsibilities are, aka. Or my time management, for that matter."

Sorry. I didn't mean to come across badly in a 'This is what Jim's job description is' sense. Personally, I wouldn't have thought any member of BBCi staff need get involved in such a matter unless it becomes really serious - moreso than it /was/.

I was just trying to say that nobody should just expect you to e-mail Telewest on the matter because you're the 'technical guy' at h2g2. I'm fully aware that there must be tonnes of stuff that goes on behind the scenes at h2g2 that I'm not aware of, and my assumptions probably don't even come close to how things work there, I just wanted to inform the user who asked 'why doesn't Jim Lynn e-mail Telewest', that it probably, being out of h2g2's hands as I see it, not up to any particular h2g2 Staff member to make contact with Telewest -- unless of course they wanted to and did so in their own time, as a person who /happens/ to work for BBCi, not as someone who's making enquiries as part of their duty.

It's just that I wouldn't expect any other Website to contact a company over a matter such as this, and although h2g2 is not just 'some other website', I still wouldn't expect h2g2 to be so bothered, except for the fact that it seems to have lost a number of Researchers.

And thus restarts my unsubscription, by the way.

glad you could finally join us Sat, unfortunately your partner has left failing to answer many questions.

but ho hum, what did we expect?


as for wanting to flame you, the thought never crossed my mind, hence the un-naming. (like i needed to)

aka posted in another thread that he 'declares the matter closed'. could you answer me please, who exactly he was to declare this matter closed and who you both are to have opened it, decided it's outcome without consulting the community and then actioning it?

lets not use the word 'illegal' this time as it has been retracted and lets avoid the technical bits as they are irrelevent to the question. i want to know why you both hold yourselves morally more just than the rest of the community?
i also want you to state in your words what exactly it is you were trying to achieve and what you invisaged happening after?


please note lack of hostility in these questions and answer them accordingly. you would be one step ahead of aka if you did this.

aka,

A small point on your last post

> I still wouldn't expect h2g2 to be so bothered, except for the fact that it seems to have lost a number of Researchers.

In my opinion, H2G2 is all about the researchers. If it was just the EG I would very quickly left, as that would have got stale very quickly (also the fact that I don't believe that what the BBC is doing with it is in the nature of a great guide to life the universe and everything, but that is another conversation), it is about the interaction. As such the loss of a number of researchers in one fell swoop does have a great impact upon this site for a lot of people.

another

Right, I'm going to throw my welly in

Two points...

1. Someone said earlier about the cost of internet access via PC, requiring purchase of a PC being beyond the ability of digibox users, how the disability benefit doesn't stretch that far...to which I thought, hmmm, these people on low incomes have enough spare to pay for digital cable services, can't really sympathise with that. I believe Aka has actually posted an entry on how to buy a low-cost internet-ready PC on his PS.

2. Once upon a time, a certain new technology added a new service to their functionality, not expecting it to be used much. Initially it was free. People found out, and started using it. Growth exploded. The companies involved had two choices: (i) close it down; (ii) increase the bandwidth available, and start charging for it. It's now a major earner for the companies involved. See if you can guess what I'm talking about (hint: mobile phones)?

In the short term, Telewest have closed down the digibox access. If there's anyone with any intelligence working there (which I doubt, having dealt with them in the past - purely for legitimate TV and phone services, I hasten to add; I've had a PC longer, so no need to use digibox access) they'll upgrade their servers and bandwidth, and start charging for the service.

Njan? Who let him out of his box! I think it goes without saying dear that there is little in the way of actual argumentation here. What they did was neither right nor wrong, and thus beyond moralism. What the theme of this thread seems to be is that a lot of us have a sense of 'karmic duty' or whatever you'd like to call it. The question becomes one of how much bad Juju is thrown about as a result of one's actions, and how those around one respond to said Juju.

Another interesting thing - proponents keep noting the bravery of the transparency of the involved parties. I guess that's a valid point. On the other hand, I've never noticed that a******s have problems with being brazen .

Ooh. I love it when people demand I answer their posts. It makes it so much easier to put my feet up and read the paper.