h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

oh and, even more than with disposables, you really need to be organised with a handy shelf or something near where you're going to do the changing.

I used to get the nappies dry and then fold them (kite shape) and put a liner in ready, fold them in half and stack them up so that I just had to lift one off the pile and unfold it under the baby.

One other thing I didn't mention: baby wipes. I used them sometimes, sometimes I used kitchen roll & water to clean the bums (usually used wipes when out & about). One thing I used only once and then never again was cotton wool.

Oh yes, and... poop, can't remember what it was called... instead of nappy pins, very early on, my mum sent me a nappy fastener which is basicaly a rubber thing - three arms, and at the end of each arm sort of teethed hooks. (like those things you can use on crèpe bandages, in German it's a Stiefmutterchen but I'm not sure in English) which you stretch and hook into the nappy (the teeth are shallow, they come nowhere near the baby's skin. They kept the nappies nice and snug and were a gazillion times easier to use than nappy-pins (and you can do it one handed with a bit of practice)

sorry.

I'll stop now.

Funny you should mention the meat craving - for 15 years I was a veggie, and never thought about meat. Then about 7 months into #2 pregnancy I had to have meat, I drooled even thinking about it. So I gave in and ate Greek food every other day. And filet steak.

<--- rare useage of that smiley connected with something other than men

They are called nappy nippers (or something like that), nice to hear they are good!

Most of the ones I've looked at so far have been shaped like the disposables so you don't have to fold them or anything complicated.

Will post a link if I can find a non-commercial one...
http://www.bummdiddybaby.co.uk/nappy_results.asp?Manufacturer=9
There is a picture here, but it is a commercial site. I haven't linked to the page with the add to shopping basket page so should be ok. This was one of the more expensive sites...

http://familyfrench.co.uk/nappies/

non-commercial fairly comprehensive site - especially about the outer wraps

and those grippy things are Nappi Nippas (come in packs of 3)

man, between you and my newly pregnant friend,you're making me broody (and I don't actually like children)

*arrives fashionably late with out of date advice*



I started out with cloth diapers (nappies) for the first baby, and continued using them almost exclusively until... oh, she was probably about age 2 when I switched over to disposables.

I didn't have any of the shaped ones, just huge flat rectangles, single thickness (I think they were called gauze diapers), and I had to fold them to the appropriate size for the child. That's not as bad as it sounds, I just did it when I got them out of the dryer, and that way they were quite versatile, as I could fold them in several different ways to make thicker parts where they would do the most good, and adjust the size as necessary.

(By the way, for obvious reasons girls should have the thickest part towards the back, boys should have the thickest part in the front)

I did have a few "pre-folded" diapers, which I'm trying to recall exactly how those were made (moment). I think they were double thickness, with an extra layer or two down the middle third of the diaper. Overall, they were about 1/3 the dimensions of the flat diapers.

My reason in telling you all of these details about old fashioned pre-folded and flat diapers is that I know from personal experience that the more layers there are in the diaper, the longer it's going to take to dry after being washed. I could hang the flat diapers out to dry and they'd be sun-bleached and dry in a few hours, but the pre-folded ones would probably still be a little damp after hanging out all day, even in the heat of the summer. In the dryer, the pre-folded ones always took longer too.

I have a friend who made very thick shaped diapers with velcro closures for her 2nd baby, and she told me that it would take at least 90 minutes to dry a load of about a dozen of those diapers in the dryer on high heat.

So if you're thinking of buying shaped diapers that have several layers to them, you should probably consider just how long it's going to take the things to dry before you can finally use them again.

Another thing is that I'm still wondering is how in the world a shaped diaper would fit all sizes from newborn to age 3, as my friend who made her own shaped diapers had to make several different sizes as her little boy grew. If you compare the sizes of newborn disposables and toddler size disposables, you'll find that there's a huge difference in the size.

As far as how to handle the diapers, I think I washed them nearly every day, because you tend to notice that the diapers are wet a lot sooner with cloth diapers, so you go through tons of them, at least a dozen a day. The plastic pants help to protect the baby's clothing (and yours!), but they still leak a lot more readily than disposables would, and also hold in a lot of heat that can exacerbate any diaper rash.

I think I handled cleaning them very similarly to how was already described. We didn't have any kind of special diaper grippers back in the dark ages though, so I used real pins - you just have to keep your fingers between the pin and the baby when you're pinning them, and make sure they're securely in the clasp.

Speaking of disposables, when they started making them super-absorbent, I found it was sometimes possible to go half a day or more without changing them, because they just keep absorbing more and more and more and more... if you've ever seen a baby in a super-absorbent disposable diaper at the pool/beach, they just keep getting bigger and bigger!

Also, they started making disposables with linings that stayed dry to the touch no matter how wet the diaper was. This has good and bad points. The good is that it keeps the wetness from causing or irritating a diaper rash so easily, something important especially when they're little. The bad news is that if you're trying to toilet train a toddler, they probably won't even notice that they're uncomfortably wet (and will figure why bother to go to the potty?), so that's a good time to switch back to cloth diapers if you have them, since there's no denying the cold wetness and irritation.

By the way, this is the first that I saw you were expecting - congratulations Kelli!

Yes, forgot to say congrats! When's the new arrival expected?

My eldest has just turned 15 so that gives you an idea of how long ago it was

Blimey, it's true what they say about growing up fast.

Used the liners, definitely. Can't remember the name of the nappies - sorry.

And there's no rule book on parenting - every Mum and Dad susses out what works for them and their kids. Every parent is different - and so is every child. Prepare for a large amount of trial and error

I can't help much from personal experience here, as we did disposables, but I know a couple ladies here in Crescent City who swear by Fuzzi Bunz. I'm sure I'll run into either Brooke or Amy Lynn (fastest name memorization ever on both our parts) soonish, so if you want, I can get some info from them

And there's new cheap reusables and accessories for reusuables on eBay--that's where I popped over to check the spelling of Fuzzi Bunz

Trial and error huh? So we might have some idea what we should have done for #1 by the time #2 comes along?

Due in early march, scan next friday, holding breath until then...

I will check out ebay for cheap and new so I can give them a go without it breaking the bank. I found a really good website that compared all the different types and rated them on things like absorbancy, ease of use, drying time and a bunch of other things. The fluffles one came out rated excellent on most things, but we may need 'boosters' for over night. Alternatively could get a bulkier overnight nappy - no reason why we have to have the same ones to do every job!

I'm pretty sure we'll try them, and if we or the baby don't like them I'll be sure to come back and post here about it

Ooops, forgot to say - yes please Amy, do ask them how it is going and let me know if they say it is an utter nightmare...

Reusable washable ones, definitely! (Keep the disposable ones for when you're going out). My third son was born on the cusp of the switch to disposables, and I followed that strategy... saving a small fortune in the process. If you use the like of Napisan, you don't even have to wash them, just rinse extremely throughly, and after two years (when he was toilet-trained) the nappies have survived (or 50% of them had) to be used for other purposes (even covering a ripped chair temporarily!)

That's my experience.

Here people have been known to chuck used disposables out of their car windows when driving around. ! And yeeeuuckk!

Um, I havent read all the replies, but I can reply to the initial query.
No, you're not kidding yourself. I know plenty of people who have used real nappies birth-to-potty, frequently with more than one child in them at the same time! There are sooooo many different kinds of shaped nappies, the real trick is finding the ones that best suit your child in terms of fit, absorbency, etc and that suit you in terms of price, ease of care, etc. There really are some birth-to-potty nappies out there, one of them are an organic cotton shaped nappy called, I believe, Green Baby - it snaps down to a smaller size for infants (was a bit bulky but fit my godson when he was about 4.5Kg) and then expands, I know someone who used the same 10 nappies till her daughter was 2.5.
In terms of eco-impact, it is NOT TRUE that washing cloth nappies is as bad for the environment as dispos. This: http://www.unicorn-grocery.co.uk/nappies.php is a good place to start for a basic intro.

FWIW, many people who use cloth, actually use terry squares still, or at least a combination. Terries are way cheaper, for one thing, and many people say that by experimenting with different folds, they can get a tighter fit than with shaped nappies. But it's really about finding the solution that works best for baby and you. (BTW, even if you do use shaped, having a few terries is handy because with older kids you can use them as booster inserts for overnight, etc.)

I apologize if someone has already posted this, but just in case, this is the most comprehensive site for the UK: www.thenappylady.co.uk - you can get personalized advice. If you want to talk to someone in person, I suggest your local hippy co-op, or some cloth companies have salespeople who will come round and give you a demo.

Thanks for the links - I've had a good look around the nappy lady site already but hadn't come across the other one We have got a fair bit of time to investigate all this so am hoping to come across someone IRL who is trying them at the moment so I can go and have a nosey.

DA - What? Were they changing the baby one-handed while driving along? Sheesh, there is no need for that sort of behaviour! Have you seen that happen often?

The environmental impact will depend on a number of variables. Notably, these include the efficiency of your washing machine, what is happening to your rubbish (eg - Combined Heat and Power incinerator, or landfill), whether you live in a water shortage area, how your power is generated... as well as product related issues.

I forgot to mention child care - if you plan to use a creche, will they accept to deal with a disposable nappy?

sprout

Many ladies at http://www.hitched.co.uk/sbforum/forum.asp?forum_id=7
use cloth, and I know at least a few of them are also nappy reps (you can organize nappy parties like tupperware parties, and then can show you all about stuff), plus I know they frequently organize meet-ups in different areas around the UK.
But, as I said in my previous post, if you are near to an organic co-op type place (like the unicorn one I linked to), go in and talk to them, they will certainly have staff who have direct experience.

As it looks like I'll get made redundant while on my maternity leave, that may not be a problem sprout - another reason why cost is a factor

In our area everything goes into landfill, which is why I try to recycle or compost as much as possible. I wouldn't describe myself as 'dark green' though!

Hmmm, quite a complicated business! I think there'd be room for a guide entry dealing with all the why's and wherefores of nappies. Which ones to choose, fastener gadgets, different ways of folding and changing. It's a minefield! All I did find was this: A203734

Oh, and congratulations Kelli! But...

"scan next friday, holding breath until then..." - Is that really wise for a woman in your position?

http://www.realnappycampaign.com
and
www.wen.org.uk
seem quite handy sites too.

Found a nappy laundry service in my area which costs £8.99 per week, so pretty expensinve and you don't get the saving of already owning nappies for subsequent children, plus less efficient if someone is driving out to pick them up.

King Bomba - yes, I'd seen that entry. It is pretty out of date now! I don't feel in any kind of position to write an entry on these without any practical experience though. Ask me again in a couple of years...

The biggest benefit to nappy washing services, is that industrial-sized washing operations are far more water-efficient than home washing.
But not only do you not get the benefit of using the nappies for more than one child, you also have to use whatever they have, and as I already said earlier, the trick is in finding what suits your baby best.

I haven't tried them myself but one of my friends uses them. She says they are great for during the day especially if you use the liners-anything solid just goes down the loo and the nappies just get chucked in the wash. She always uses a disposable for overnight though as now her wee boy is sleeping right through (7-7, bliss) it’s the only way to keep him dry. If you have specific questions I can run them past her for you.

Am I too late to join in?

I used proper terry squares for all 3 of mine - some of the nappies had originally been used for my siblings so had worn quite thin, which is ideal for newborns. I only stopped with number 3 because the plastic pants don't last as well as the nappies, and suddenly it became impossible to find replacements in our little corner of the world.

If the shaped reusables had been available, I would have considered them. But there is nothing quite like bright white nappies rippling in the sunshine

My procedure was very similar to Sho's - I kept my nappies ready-folded, too, and nappy liners are essential and mean that you don't need disposables when you are out and about. With No 1 I made a point of taking nappies and bucket with us when we stayed away, so people could see how little trouble it all was! However, by the time we had No 2, I was using disposables on holiday, if I was really ill, and when other people looked after her. Other people were always terrified of sticking a pin into the baby. I must have changed thousands of nappies, always using pins, and have never, ever stuck a pin into the baby - or indeed my own fingers, which were always between the nappy and the baby just in case.

Every night, before I went to bed, I carried the nappy bucket downstairs (30 secs), put on my rubber gloves (5 secs), squeezed out the soaked nappies into the washing machine (1 min), programmed a rinse (10 mins, but you can be doing something else during that time), and then put in the washing powder and set the machine to run a 60 degree wash with fast spin overnight (say 10 secs tops). If I was ill, then all household chores, including nappies, went by the board.

I had an extendable drying line over the bath for those days when drying outside was impossible - it held 12 nappies, which was a full load. (You'll need to weigh your dry nappies (once) to check the maximum load size for your machine). When we moved house, the bathroom window meant that I had to find another indoor drying solution and I bought one of those over the radiator, holds 12 nappies jobbies. Plastic pants I used to wash by hand and peg over the bath on one of those circular peg thingies. I suppose that added another 5 minutes to the daily routine. And then folding the dry nappies ready for use: five minutes? We're up to about 15 minutes in total here. Really, not a huge amount of effort. But people used to carry on as though I was spending *all day* boiling them up on the stove and then rinsing them out by hand before lovingly pressing them dry . I had about 3 dozen nappies on the go - 12 drying, 12 in the process of getting dirty, 12 clean for the next day.

With a terry square you can use a corner of the nappy to get baby clean so no need for wipes. No 1 had appalling nappy rash whenever she was teething, regardless of the nappy; No 2 had appalling nappy rash *only* when in disposables (her skin used to dry out). No 3 didn't do nappy rash. He was also in disposables full-time from about 9 months and I don't think it is any coincidence that he is still, at the age of 4, not completely dry during the day and not at all dry at night. As the children became older they used fewer nappies during the day, and (despite what the advertising machine would have you believe) toddlers don't give a toss how wet they are, they don't seem to find it uncomfortable at all. And when they start to find it uncomfortable, that's *good*, because it means they are becoming aware of their toilet function, and are likely to be out of nappies sooner. This isn't good for the manufacturers of disposable nappies, of course.

I am not convinced by the environmental equivalence argument. Water and energy are (or should be) renewable - landfill is landfill. And I refuse to believe that the manufacture of disposables is possible without water and energy. I did use the eco-friendly disposables for a while, they were good except that the tabs for sticking them on had a habit of ripping off while I was changing the baby. This was a few years ago, though, and might have been sorted now.

You've probably quite rightly skipped all that, because you asked about shaped reusables and I didn't use them! I loyally maintain that nothing is as good as terry squares ... but the shaped ones do sound good.

Good luck tomorrow, I'll be thinking of you.

Mol