h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/south_asia/newsid_1556000/1556117.stm

> "The UK-based Christian Aid charity says the diminished aid distribution could leave thousands dead before the spring."

The best thing we could probably do for them is topple the current regime. They've been jailing foreign aide workers and people who befriended them.

Yeah - but how could we prevent an equally bad regime from coming to power in its place?

i dont know what the solution to the problem is, if i did id be a genius, but i do know something. Innocent people are suffering out there in afganistan, at the hands of terrorists. Surely this 'war' is meant to stop that, rather than pressurise the UN to stop feeding the innocent? just a thought. innocent people are dying out there at the hands of terriosts. something needs to be done, and soon.

The Afgan people are suffering for the guilt of their masters - and they are just that, masters, not leaders or officials, rule is imposed, not asked for. And even if they do rise up to defend their country when it, and they are threatened, that does not mean they support, or are even aware of, the murderous policies of their government.

But spare a thought for the plight of another nation, in a similar position, whose people are often villified for the actions of their rulers, where again the government supports murder and terror, against the will and without the knowledge or consent of its people, but who when threatened will rise up in arms to defend that government who they are told is protecting them. I refer of course to the United States.

We're better informed, and we have the option of participating in our government. Furthermore, we have a volunteer military. We're not going to be ordering 300,000 people into a battle without them volunteering at some point.

No. but none of those guys in the WTC had any choice when your government started making the threats that made them resonable targets.

its a little ironic that we speak about the alternative to the Taliban, when in fact the US had a more bloodthirsty tyrant as an enemy 11yrs ago (Sadam who was simply dragging his ppl from war to war for different reasons, occupies another country, experiments chemical weapons on his enemies (the Iranians) then on his own people,.....BUt the US who was really able to take him out, by at least supporting the uprising that was taking place in the south of Iraq, they never did, they let this guy come and crush the uprising
Now i know this is a different situation, we are trying to help these poor people from the Taliban right? YES
its wroth to point out that the Taliban came to power by a green light from the US to Pakistan, they controled most of the country and they brought some peace to it, the situation of refugees has been like that for almost 25 yrs since the invations of the USSR, then the civil war, and now this :<
let us not forget the Iraqi children who are dying by the thousands every month coz of the 'economic sancations' which have only strengthend the grip of Sadam on his poor people....

I agree. Wars are started by the people at the top. They should be a legitimate target. If we had taken Saddam Hussein out, it would be better for us, and the Iraqis.

Those of us on the ground were ready to go.

As were the Kurds, who had been informed that if they rose up we would back them up in a civil war, then we left them high and dry to face the nightmare of persecution and hunger that followed.

Just as we did throughout the middle east following our pacts with the Arabs. Rewarding them in fact, with Israel.

Ouch! I think if you look at history, every nation of "power" has some black spots in it's background. I'm an American and don't think it's useful to bash one country or another about past atrocities. It's sad to hear this talk that seems to "justify" what happened on 9/11/01 based on government policy. What would you do in response? nothing? Nearly 7000 lives doesn't creat outrage and a forthright effort to find who did this and bring them to justice? Until some concrete action is taken, it's useless to speculate what will be done and how that relates to one country or another's past discretions or complicity in regime supporting that's gone bad. It appears we're moving in deliberate and methodical steps, gaining international support and consensus and any action probably won't be completely known to the public. All the forces going to the Gulf region is a lot of sabre rattling. The real action will probably never be known. Let's pray for the dead, injured, rescuers and the world's collective leadership to remove terror from our lives - regardless of who we are, where we live or what our government stands for.

Now the Taliban has asked Osama bin Laden to leave. If we he does leave, and we start capturing or killing him and his organization, what do we do about Afghanistan?

Should we leave that repressive regime on its own? That place sounds pretty awful. Do we let them fight it out? Should we provide aide?

Flich

Are you saying the people who were working in the world trade were legitimate targets (not accidental deaths) becasue of rightly or percieved wrongs by the US government? Now the target are schoolchildren in playgrounds, are those also legtimate targets? What about the 1000 foreign nationals who died?

Also no one ever said what those were. I have heard all the way from Kyoto Treaty, Mcdonalds, Middle East to driving on the wrong side of the road.

I hope no one ever targets your children for death while playing in a playground. I Know that I can not expect the same human compassion from others,

I'm saying that if it was the US who first made specific and direct threats of war against these countries, then it has to accept retaliation for that, in whatever form. And the WTC you must admit, in a time of war is a just economic target. The fact that the US didn't tell it's own people that it had just made them targets doesn't alter that fact.

Personally i abhore violence, and war, and terrorism. The events of the 11th are an anathema. As are the 1/2 million Iraqi civilian casualties inflicted by Britian and the US since the end of the Gulf War. It doesn't matter if you watch it on tv or not. Collateral Damage, or whatever you wish to call it, is still murder by any other name.

Face it. I was your government brought this on themselves. But they didn't pay. You did.

I'd also like to point out that i am both suprised and pleased to see the restraint that has been shown by the US government in not acting immediately in the way they did in Sudan and Afganistan a few years ago. Even if some of the posturing is a little unreasonable, i can't see any government having the bottle to respond so well to such a difficult crisi as yours has in the wake of this event.

"Now the Taliban has asked Osama bin Laden to leave. If he does leave, and we start capturing or killing him and his organization, what do we do about Afghanistan?
Should we leave that repressive regime on its own? That place sounds pretty awful. Do we let them fight it out? Should we provide aide?"


It's so funny to hear such diverse views in these threads. Some people say that the USA should stay out of other people's fights, and others say that we shouldn't let other people suffer. Which is it?

While I think it is most people's first reaction to want to go help these poor oppressed people, what do we really gain by doing anything? Bin Laden and other radical muslims want us to stay out of Islam. I think that if they are going to do things like bomb the world trade center, kill our sailors, bomb our embassies and kill 7000 people on planes, in the WTC and in the Pentagon, we should cut off all relations and give them exactly what they want. Let them be completely self reliant. We should stop feeding them and letting their rich keep their money in our banks. But we won't do that in the long run, because we are too nice and we hate to see people suffer.

If I had the money, I'd fly in there right now and bring back as many Afghan women as I could and try to show them that they are not vermin, but I can't, and no one else is going to be able to save these people. Their life expectancy there is only in the low to mid 40's (compared to the US's which is in the high 70's, low 80's). People in the middle east and in western asia have been fighting for thousands of years. They were fighting when the bible was written.

The only hope for change we have is that the people of Afghanistan will rise up against the Taliban and create their own government based on some sort of democratic republic constitution. I think this whole ordeal is an example of what happens when the people don't rule.

I don't think you can really expect much of a revolution in a country without a middle class. Their only cause for hope would be foreign intervention or the success of the Northern Alliance. I don't know how much better that would be.

I've expressed some divergent views. In my heart of hearts, I'm an isolationist. I don't care to meddle. I don't want my country to meddle. All I want its trade and exotic vacation destinations.

OTOH, I've sort of been moved by the plight of the Afghanis. The best thing that could probably happen to them would be an actual invasion by the United States. It might be a ugly for a little while, but in the end, they'd be better off.

Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron
I wonder if I can rent, The Mouse That Roared?

> "Some people say that the USA should stay out of other people's fights, and others say that we shouldn't let other people suffer"

I feel you're rather misrepresenting that viewpoint - perhaps it could be better put that the USA should avoid intervening in other people's fights in a way which makes a bad situation worse, and that in an ideal world they should intervene in a positive way. What is essentially desired is an unselfish, non-isolationist foreign policy - where it often appears in practice to be both selfish and isolationist.

The US does provide $70 million worth of aid, including food, to Afghanistan... but then they also require interest on their share of Afghanistan's $5.5 billion of external debt (according to the CIA website). I've not been able to find anything to suggest that rich Afghani's use the USA's banking system - any ideas?

Btw, life expectancy is 46 years in Afghanistan, and 77 years in the US. (according to the "People Facts" website)

Flinch

Since you have a list, could you please tell me what those people want who crash a plane into a International building in NYC? Or is it just a list of sins? I see now that London might be a target as well so please let me know. You mentioned Iraq? what others? I am sure you have a list my dear...

Flinch never mentioned a list, that I can see... Am I going blind?