h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Toxx
"Can't see how you could create something you're already part of! Dagnammit, you wouldn't exist until it did!"
That was my badly written paradox thing.
What is here and now creates what was.
Since there is a feeling that nothing can come from nothing, how else could it be explained.
there's a twist in time and space we call a mobius,
where time becomes a loop,
where time becomes a loop,
where time becomes a loop .
where time becomes a loop
where time becomes a loop
where time becomes a loop
where time becomes a loop
where time becomes a loop
where time becomes a loop
where time becomes a loop
where time becomes a loop
etc.

Rain
so what is dark matter do you think?

Hi Diversity

"It is also nice, because it seems no matter how many different posts no matter how many different authors, the ones that believe in a god can usually give him the final option on anything at the last minute "

Except, of course those of us that don't believe in the Triple-O, Monotheistic God, but in a more pluralistic nature of the divine.

Blessings,
Matholwch /|\.

Hi Pixie .

"The God i describe and so do all religeons, encompasses everything that exists, will exist and has existed..."

Not so my dear fey one. You will find that once you wander out of the confines of the Abrahamic religions the view is much more complex than that.

To some God is indeed the Universe, to others there are a thousand Gods, each a separate strand of the universal whole. In some religions the God or Gods created the Universe, in others they are part of it, a natural progression for all sentient souls.

There are even those of us who follow what science postulates quite closely and see no contradiction between that and the innate sacred nature of being. Who see life and spirit in all things and accept that a relationship with the divine is inevitable if you will only open your eyes and walk through the universe as a child.

Blessings,
Matholwch /|\.

Hasslefree’s theory on Life, the Universe and Everything.
Formed from experience and reasoning.
Part of that experience is this conversation !
Warning contains loopholes.

For eons man has identified himself as having three main components.
Body, mind and spirit .
I will call spirit consciousness from now on.
This is not a new revelation, this has been what mankind felt himself to be.
Mankind recognises himself. Mankind reaches that point in evolution where he becomes aware of himself and asks the questions. Why am I?
I think therefore I am. But what am I?

I am talking about two different levels of the human condition.
Physical and what we refer to as the spiritual. ie something we don’t comprehend but feel exists within us.

The Body

When the body dies, it is never completely gone. Nature recycles the physical.
The decomposition to the worm, the worm to the bird, the bird to man.
Each atom, molecule, cell is changed into a new form through the process of digestion and following growth.
It could be said that every death in the world has re made the physical world.
We are what we eat and we are what eats us.
This is a model of renewal on the physical plane..

Conscious.
Using the model of renewal.
The conscious exists as minute particles, smaller than anything we’ve ever managed to split. At the bottom of all the splitting is consciousness.
Consciousness does not spilt into smaller components, it has the ‘will’ to expand. Consciousness is matter in it’s smallest component.
When the physical body dies, these small particles are free from the body.
They join up to form a greater consciousness, which we call dark matter/energy.
Dark matter is the fabric of the universe. It is thought to function more like thought than physical matter.
The fabric of the Universe is made up of particles acting like thought, not matter.
As consciousness grows, from the experiences gained in the physical body, and ‘joins’ the larger consciousness, the gravitational pressures build up.
Science has shown that dark matter has a cause and affect on the gravity that holds the Universe together and apart. It shows a reason for expansion without the physical law of explosive contraction.
When consciousness grows and expands and evolves it creates gravitational pressure on physical bodies. We could say thought effects the physical.
These pressures create a scenario on the physical where a supernova occurs.
The supernova creates what science calls a black hole.
Consciousness/dark energy is sucked into this hole in the fabric of time and space to emerge into another Universe composed of consciousness acting more like thought than matter. It exists in the fabric it has created for itself.

Mind
There are things which are outside of the minds physical comprehension.
What happens when the mind is presented with the unrecognisable is that mind fills in the gaps with the substances it knows and recognises from the five physical senses we all are familiar with.
Hence we give this system of creation a name and form that we recognise. We call it the father. We dress it in robes and give it a long wise white beard. Or we call it other names and dress it differently. We can inspire it with the wrath or the love of a father which ever we recognise in our own experiences.
Hence people with near death experiences see what the mind makes of the incomprehensible. Jesus, family members, friends, lovers. The devil.
In my experience, the creator is the total sum of all consciousness. Animal, Vegetable and mineral.
All these particles of consciousness on the physical plane, merely vibrate at a frequency to reproduce the shape the mind tells we see with our senses.
When we are new born and consciousness is empty, we see a shape we do not understand. Our parents tell us ; “This is a dog”.
From now on this shape is a dog to all mankind.
If, instead, our parents were to tell us this shape was a cat, this is how we would perceives dogs to be. Until we grew and learnt to follow the majority decisions on what certain shapes are called.
The mind is a recorder of information, sent back to the consciousness to form evolved experience.
The mind is also ego, something that makes us feel as an individual, when we are not that when outside of the body.
When body dies and consciousness moves on, the recorder of experience we call the mind, is not longer required.
Death has a frightening moment when realisation that the mind will cease to record – the death of the ego – until we realise that there is more to be gained than lost in the transaction. Sometimes the mind hangs on after death out of habit and receates the habitual things we know and found comfort in. this may particularly happen if death is unexpected or violent and the mind struggles to keep itself as ego. We may call these ghosts if we wish to.

Time and Space
Since the consciousness makes black holes in all of it’s new Universes and spreads into the fabric of time and space it has created with itself, it can also spread back into our own universe again and create it’s beginning. Remember there is no time and space running chronologically. The light from the stars you see in the sky at night is probably a billion years old. Or more. To look in the night sky is to see the past in the present. What is happening before your eyes happened long, long ago and does not represent what is happening to that star in the present moment.
This is the closest example of how it can be said that time is happening all at that same moment.
This is the version of infinity which works for me. For me to describe it previously as a circle is not completely correct because circular indicates a physical shape we all identify with (there goes the mind again)
The Universe duplicates it’s self in all directions, but the sense of it as circular in terms of having no set beginning and no ending, as in a circle.
Without hard evidence of this paradox, we have decided that time is linear (I think a Christian concept if I read correctly) because with very little experience of physical time we see that on a physical level it runs that way for us on a small day to day basis.

Hi Math!
"Except, of course those of us that don't believe in the Triple-O, Monotheistic God, but in a more pluralistic nature of the divine."

That's cool I'm going to go science-based religion on that one. But what I'm wondering is, did the Druids ever think 'flat earth, center of universe' , and then upon finding out otherwise, how did they reconcile their new found information with their old time belief. There is not a lot of tolerence historically in those type areas by the Catholics.
diversity

Hi Diversity .

"did the Druids ever think 'flat earth, center of universe' , and then upon finding out otherwise, how did they reconcile their new found information with their old time belief"

I expect that at one time they did. However, the Greeks considered the Druids they encountered to be amongst the foremost astronomers of their time. It is known that contemporary Greek and Egyptian astronomers understood the earth to be round and the planets to move in a heliocentric manner, so it reasonable to expect that the Druids did also. Certainly the astronomical accuracy of Brythonic sites suggests a high order of accurate astronomical understanding.

How they reconciled the changeover from flat earth theory to spherical theory we shall never know. No records exist even in the oral histories. I have no illusions about my esteemed ancestors so with human nature being what it is I expect that it got bloody at some point .

Blessings,
Matholwch /|\.

Wow Hasselfree .

We now have Hasselfree's Unified Consciousness Theory, excellent.

It's gonna take me some big time thinks on this one so apologies if I do not reply immediately.

Blessings,
Matholwch the overwhelmed /|\.

Not good enough, Hass. We're talking about where time and space came from - and the twist too, if you like. Please nobody say 'Chubby Checker'.

Toxx
If you read it, it explains where time and space came from.

A quick note - schizophrenics are often fully aware that they are delusional, and can be quite lucid. However, that doesn't reduce the realism of the situation. Imagine our fear of entering graveyards at, say, midnight. A lot of people are terrified, and not because of the living people that wander them. (I'm among the few that enjoy graveyards in the evening.) However, they are often certain that ghosts only exist in horror films. I myself was aware that it was nonsense to believe that my stepfather wanted to drown me, but that didn't stop me from developing elaborate escape plans for getting out of the house if he did. I know people can't control the weather, but that didn't stop me from being sure that I could. Just because you're suffering delusions doesn't mean you don't know you're suffering them.

- Jordan

Things come in threes.

Thought, word , deed.

Thought = idea
Word = matter
Deed =creation

A biblical interpretation;

In the beginning was the Word,(matter) and the Word (matter)was with God, and matter was God."


"So shall My Word (matter)be which goes forth from My mouth; it shall not return to Me empty, without accomplishing what I desire, and without succeeding in the matter for which I sent it."

The WORD is the name we have given to the incomprehensible nature of matter
Beacuse The word is the material form of the thought.
The word is the thing that gave mankind his awareness of self when first spoken.

Hass. I was replying to your brief post #5121. I take it that the explanation is in your full theory posted later.

"Ug"

Sorry toxx. Time slip on postings
UG.
but that could be a grunt, since words have a meaning and my neanderthal (or whoever) is rusty

Well Hass, I guess that 'ug' probably means 'I am here'. Self-awareness in a syllable, as you suggest. But why would anyone say it, if they didn't first think it?????

Thats' correct Toxx. Thought, word , deed.

although I always thought 'Ug' was "could you please pass me that jaw bone of an ass. " or "hey have you seen that great big black thing, that I have no words for, in the desert?"
"Oh you mean that monolith "
Which I suppose means a singular lith !

Well, of course it does Hass. 'Lith' being short for 'lithos'='stone'. Kinda like 'megalith' a ginormous stone, or 'coprolith'='a lump of fossilised dinosaur excrement'. Bet you really wanted to know that.

i jokingly tell you now that you won't be able to escape this post...so don't even try!! =) it'll be my last.

When i was a child of @ 3 y/o my mom told me that little prayer b4 i went to bed..."now i lay me down to sleep, i pray the lord my soul to keep, if i die b4 i wake, i pray the lord my soul to take"...besides sounding beautifully morbid i had my questions about it. i asked my mom, 'where do we go when we die?' To which she replied, 'Heaven.'
i asked her, 'if we die do we ever get to come back?' She told me, 'no.' i'm sure you all can see the logical question forming in my little 3y/o mind! for it doesn't take genius to see the next question. 'if we don't come back, how do we know there's a Heaven?'...at which point my mom pulled out this 8 foot long double sided broadsword, (coincidentally named "Faith"), and leveled it straight across my backside! One of the things that my parents did to me as a child growing up that annoyed the piss out of me was to NEVER give me a straight DEFINITIVE answer! i always got the same standard response: "what do you think it is?" At which point i'd reply...'uh? nevermind, i don't want to know now!' Of course mothers can never let things lie when there's a point to be made and told me to sit down and figure it out! Now...i love my mom and think that she did a great job of raising me even though she got knocked up at the tender age of 15 1/2, we're best friends, but that occursed way of never giving me any answers irked me to no end! But it stuck. As a child growing up she left the choice of religion completely up to me...so much responsibility for a kid of 7 years (now)...that i had to find out for myself by staying with grandma on saturdays to go with her to church on sunday....And despite what anyone else tells you...IT WASN'T BECAUSE OF THE FREE ICE CREAM THAT I GOT OVER AT GRANDMAS HOUSE EITHER!!! =)
...as a child my need for religion was only to complete that unanswerable question of death and nothing more at that point. As i grew older and entered adolescence i found that first true love and of course lost it (which had a profound affect on me as i'm sure some of you may have felt as well)...and subsequently went thru the teenage angst-suicidal stage. lucky for me i was too afraid of death! (even at that point in my life) the logic of Heaven still managed to keep that knife away from my wrist...(i still didn't believe), but paradoxically believed that during those times that God had a guiding hand upon my shoulder. even had a few NDE's. It was those teenage years and experiences that made me feel that there was a God and i felt very close to him (sorry, for reasons i can't explain, i pictured God as a man). My NDE's were miraculous to say the least...(for brevity's sake...HA HA...i won't go into them!)
...One of the hardest things for a person to do is self analyze who they are and why...but if you can do that, it opens up a total and completely different way of reasoning...After all that, i was still looking for concrete evidence and continued to search for answers through reading thousands of books. One of the things i learned while educating myself is that i don't like narrow mindedness! The biggest one being egocentrism...people who think that their experiences and realizations are the only ones that matter and that they are the center of the universe. which leads to people who read a book and say that this is the way things are because i believe them to be so! ...and ALL the religious people i've met IRL have firmly backed up this opinion that i have! Egocentric people who are bible thumpers or qur'an thumpers or what-have-you...if you're offended by this statement maybe you should ask yourself "WHY?" you are offended. if you aren't offended then you fully realize that i'm not talking about you and that you may call yourself my friend and the shirt off my back will always be there for you as well. now, i tend to believe in a different trinity...the one of philosophy, psychology, and logic. though i can't stand philosophy! Each field has great bearing on who we are and what it is we're trying to achieve. except maybe logic (how ironic!)
...People are emotional and as such are fallible...indeed to have emotion will always equate to mistakes. Therefore, it can truly be said that God is neither a man nor a woman because that would mean that God would have emotions and would therefore be fallible and that isn't possible! it would also entail that God is neither vengeful nor does he <-(generic sense) love you!
Psychologically speaking...religion was made up (equally) in order to answer the "Biggie", but also as a means of controling the populace by imposing moral rightness onto the masses as a guideline thereby punishment or reward in the "after-life."...don't believe me? (read Epicurus, Bentham and a little of Kant...if U like) ...Back me up here Rainy...do you think B.F. Skinner had some sense when he said that we are all products of our behavior with respect to pleasure vs. pain? Do we not create, cognitively, worlds and opinions of thought that please our raison D'etre?
...A while back...probably @ post 100 or so somebody asked what "Satan" meant...i replied that it was Hebrew for "The Accuser"...and not ONE of you ever asked why!!! (as an aside: i don't think ANY of you are /really/ looking for answers!)...again, if i offend you...
...in my considerable readings i happened upon a nice work of fiction that had, to me, more religion in it than the entire 2 readings i threw down on the bible! "Memnoch The Devil" by Anne Rice...seethingly simple and yet brilliant in its logic pointed out something we've all missed........(pp209-398)
Angels don't have free will. they were created by God to serve God. that is their lot, they have no choice. not one level of angel from Serphim, Enephalim, Archangel, Cherub, Choir was given free will. Not even Lucifer has free will, he still serves God. Ergo Satan cannot be EVIL because it's not in his nature to do so nor to entertain the way of "evil"-ness. But what did satan "Accuse" God of???.....

Not loving Humans.

....think about it?...Not one soul made it into Heaven until apprx 2000 years ago! Some people like to go back and "fudge" the facts....Noah and Abraham and Isaac were "good" people and so God let them into heaven without the blood of Christ to wash away their sins...come on people!..That's hokey!
The more you logically attack an argument and from as many different angles as possible the more fallible and human-made the arguments sound. And this is how organized religions sound to me!
...do i believe in any of this crap? Not on your life! There are no universal absolutes! don't mean to get metaphysical on y'all.
i think the end of James Clavell's "Shogun" sums it up nicely for me...my Christian soul hopes to be with you in the after life, my Buddhist soul wishes to be born again so that we may both meet again in this world. i truly wish that there is a Resturaunt at the End of the Universe and that we may all meet again and down Pangalactic Gargle Blasters forever...(man, i miss Douglas!) i lean more towards Buddhism because it's not really a religion as much as it is more a system of thought or non-thought, what-ever your poison?...and i would love to come back to this world over and over again cuz i love life, and if death means cessation of realized stimulus, i believe that even the worst feelings on this planet are still feelings that we'd miss! Do i still believe in God? Not as much as i needed to when i wasn't armed with knowledge! (i'm not being smug or crass) i don't need religion like i did when i was little because my fears have been taken away by my reasoning. Now i simply accept that there may or may not be and i'm o.k. with either instance.

..i want to thank all of you for the stimulating readings! You ALL sound like very intelligent people and i want to thank you for renewing my faith that there are people with over 100 I.Q.'s out there!...(WHEW!) =)...my name is Jeff age 28 and residing in Idaho, amongst thousands of other places i've lived! But let me tell you...there is NO intelligent life on this side of the planet! ...my I.Q. 136 Mensa tested!

Please don't trample on my grave while i'm gone, thanx! if you wish to crucify me i'll be around for 2 more days and then it's, 'hasta lasagna, don't get any onya!'

...Ladies...thank you for being incredibly smart and incredibly sexy! ....You too Toxx! Even tho You're a Guy....You had me at "Hello!"....(smooch!) =)