h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

You have summed it all up very well Math. The bottom line is that they all *worship* different branches of the same tree.

And what is this *worship* anyway? To my mind it's meaningless. If God wanted us to worship him he would have given us clearer instructions. I might as well *worship* dolphins. At least they won't do me any harm.

Yes, I refuse to take any religious instruction/s from a bunch of drugged-up, flipped-out prophets and so-called seers all stoning each other in the desert and having hallucinations, or any other self-satisfied, self-adoring, pious, hypocritical band of secterians or non-secterians whether they be in Rome, Salt Lake City, Jerusalem, Peking, Mecca, or on the Moon.

In fact when I first came to the land where I live now I refused to fill in the box on the form demanding my religion. It was the 3rd question after my name and date and place of birth.

The intelligent man must believe and seek in "reason and truth" and accept the plain fact that all relgions are merely people-control systems and have nothing to do with the reality of the universe or it's creator if such a being exists - which is something we cannot know during our earthly sojourn.

<>

Oh the cynicism! Yes, there *were* women along, the men were married (and not to each other... )
I also don't understand how you get a large number of homosexuals out of 12 people! Kinsey said 10% I believe, but his figure has been shown to be comprehensively wrong - a more accurate figure is 1%... so that's a tiny fraction of one person out of 12...

Vicky

Yes I am a cynic at times.
I was probably thinking of the amount of money - more than hundred million dollars (or equivalent) in hush money it must be by now - paid out by the Vatican. Another good old boy's will be boys club?

Well as we all know marriage to someone of the opposite gender is no idication of sexual desire, there are loads of MPS, Judges and everyday types who are found ot to be doing something quite unexpected when they think no one is looking.

Dont forget that as well as this civil same sex partnerships were not an option for homosexuals during Biblical times.

Here are the views of one widely respected British organisation, Age Concern, who no one I have spoken to ever saw aspushing an agenda either way regarding morality around sexual relationships.

http://www.ageconcern.org.uk/AgeConcern/C12E7658DF594B09B18EB699ED319ED7.asp

one love

Hi Lucky

The Abrahamic God has given very, very clear instructions on how, when, where and by whom he should be worshipped. Sixty-six books full of instructions and examples to be precise. Strangely his description of 'why' he should be worshipped boils down to "Because I said so".

The problem for me is the whole concept of worship. This degrading ritual of abasement and appeasement reflects upon the whole nature of the Abrahamic deity. This God has created the entire universe and humanity simply to adore himself. It really is as simple as that. The punishment laid down for those who don't give him his required level of adoration is extreme - death and then eternal torment.

Is this really a deity you'd want to dedicate your life to? No, not me either.

Many religions have been used by the powerful as social control mechanisms, this is true. Though those at the top of these particualr trees rarely have religious reasons for doing so. As always one should follow the money... These same men have also used philsophy and politics to achieve similar ends, especially in the 20th century.

That said billions of people have found solace in developing a relationship to something greater than themselves, and for many it represents their only hope in a very grim world.

Until you can come up with something that is actually better, religion will remain.

Blessings,
Matholwch .

Math,
Yup, that God must be really pleased to see his followers whipping themselves with chains, banging their heads against stone walls, throwing stones at the devil and at women, decorating palaces of worship in gold baroque, appointing a God's banker, paying hush money in lieu of child molestation, wearing purple silk socks, driving all expenses paid Mercedes, having a 3 year homosexual rule, daily bombing each other, discriminating against the fairer sex, dancing in the streets with a book in one hand a gun in the other, committing suicide and taking the innocent with them, trying to wipe out rival religions, etc., etc., ad nauseum. And all for a warm welcome in Paradise where they will all meet each other again!

There's a primitive tribe somewhere that thinks Prince Phillip is God. There could even be another one somewhere that thinks aeroplanes are angels. At that level it's all relatively harmless.

We certainly live in interesting times.

Three-year homosexual rule.

There's a primitive tribe somewhere that thinks Prince Phillip is God.

1.
Ratzinger's new 3-year rule: Applicants for the preisthood have to declare that they haven't had any homosexual leanings for the previous 3 years.
2.
There was a film, perhaps on BBC years ago, about some remote islanders. It seems that following a royal visit they began to worship the prince.

Prince Phillip as a god - it's the island of Tanna in Vanuatu. It's also the location of the Jon Frum cargo cult.
http://www.southpacific.org/text/finding_vanuatu.html

Re: homosexuality and the priesthood - looks like it could finally split the anglican communion - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/02/20/nchurch519.xml

"The liberal American branch of Anglicanism was last night given seven months to prove that it has fully reversed its pro-gay agenda or face expulsion"

although not sure 'expulsion' is exactly right.

"Some people think you're responsible."

"ME?"

"Well your name keeps coming up."

Hi Iccy

"Re: homosexuality and the priesthood - looks like it could finally split the anglican communion."

Imagine my distress...

Blessings,
Matholwch .

You don't have to be a Chrisian to accept there is a FORCE about that different 'tribes', different cultures etc call - in their own language - God. The characteristic which seems most prevalent in mankind is egotism. We simply cannot get to grips with being unable to explain the magnitude of the solar system and all it embraces - despite our advances in technology and science. We cannot even devise a way of making a helicopter hover like a blue-tailed tit can without even thinking about it! This doesn't mean we shouldn't try but when we get to the answer, perhaps we may glimpse God. . .who knows?
dawnrobertnewall

Anybody can approach the 'mind of God' if they can think beyond the quantum world and somehow get the mind into the virtual world. I'd recommend How to Know God by Deepak Chopra. It's the best book about religion I've ever read. It's recommended by the Dalai Lama, Mikhail Gorbachev Vasudevanand Saraswati, and lots of other deep-thinking people. The God beyond quantum mechanics is who you're looking for.
You don't need a 3rd person or agency to come to this. In fact a religion per se is a hinderance.

Hi Lucky

Religion is a hindrance - couldn't agree more. To find the divine one must look within. For a lucky few this seems easy, but for most of us regular shmoes it can take a lifetime (or several).

Blessings,
Matholwch .

Dont think we've met before dawnrobert, welcome to the party, well itys not really a party as such there's no pineapple and cheese cubes on sticks but sometimes it feels a like a party here...or maybe I dont get out enough

Anyway god and all that....I dont know who is telling you all this stuff, dawnrobertnewall, but its porkies if you ask me.

"The characteristic which seems most prevalent in mankind is egotism."

I thought this was the prevalent characteristic in all animate creatures on this planet. Watch blind pups competing to suckle fromt heir mother and you'll see putting yourself first is not an uncommon trait. Sure we have other characteristics us animals but without that one we wouldnt get very far at all, to be very succesful other characteristics play their part only after we have established a self that can function as part of a group.


"We simply cannot get to grips with being unable to explain the magnitude of the solar system and all it embraces - despite our advances in technology and science.

We havent met before so although you *do* know that I cant fully comprehend the workings of the universe what *dont* know is that Im not terribly fussed about it at all. This is because I know that I dont have to understand it, all I have to do is live in it. I have to understand how to make my central heating system work and how to get water out of a tap but how stars are formed is pretty much an irrelevancy compared to getting food in belly and that is the sort of thing my mind evolved to make happen.

ONce our bellies were full and we had a roof over our heads we did spend a lot of time wondering about stuff but to be honest even without the insights provided by Newton I would know about as much about gravity as I neede to know anyway.


"We cannot even devise a way of making a helicopter hover like a blue-tailed tit can without even thinking about it!

Yes but Ive seen a two year old pick its nose and eat the bogey without even thinking about it. A native abiltiy does ot indicate intelligence or a lack of ability indicate lack of intelligence. Im sure if enough people were going hungry we would work out how to make a helicopter hover the way you say if workinhg it out helped us get food into our bellies. We could if we cared enough feed everyone on the planet a healthy diet but we just arent smart enough or thoughtful enough, amybe its both.

My pont is the things you talk about our minds didnt evolve to do we evolved to work in a tribe and this whole global awareness is not something we as a species are ready for mentally. Some people have minds which can acheive mental turns that take them beyond our pe-historic paradigm but some people still cant understand that the earth orbits the sun.

"This doesn't mean we shouldn't try but when we get to the answer, perhaps we may glimpse God. . .who knows?

Whatever makes you think the bigG might be glimpsed there, Im all for speculation based on what we already know but we havent even established with any lele of certainty that there is a bigG to glimpse or did I miss something.

So far the bigG has been: one top of several mountains, in rocks and trees, beyond the clouds, in the Sun, inside everyone of us and according to some of my drinking buddies down the U-bend. He or she hasnt been found in any of these places and neither has anyone actually seen the devil in the detail.

one love

He's getting better, you know, but he still has his moments.

"My pont is the things you talk about our minds didnt evolve to do we evolved to work in a tribe and this whole global awareness is not something we as a species are ready for mentally."

>> My point is, the things you talk about our minds didn't evolve to do. We evolved to work in a tribe, so this whole global awareness is not something we as a species are mentally ready for.

TRiG.

Hi dawnrobertnewall. Your message is a reply to post 4. And yet your post is number 26232. There's been a fair bit going on in the meantime.

New members of this conversation are set the task of reading the entire backlog and providing a précis of each page of twenty posts. Get to work!

TRiG.

Precis:

"he does exist"
"no he doesn;t"
"yes he does"
"no he doesn't"
"whaddaya mean 'he'?"

I believe there is a God or a "Higher Being". Generally I guess you'd call me a Christian but ... there is always a but ... I do not fit into any of the Christian denominations. They are just mans interpretations of the Bible and as humans we change them to suit us.

Personally I follow the 10 commandments and I do pray and just want to be a good, kind, loving person.

People need something to believe in. I do draw the line at pushing my personal faith and beliefs onto other people - even my children, they will make their own minds up when they are older.

Regarding "There isn't a God cause of all the disabilities, war and killing" - they are all man made and God gave us "free will" we are the ones abusing it. Genetics, medication - causing disabilities through the ages, Wars started by governments and religions arguing they are the one, and in the right.

and if you read all the posts inbetween post 20 and yours you'll find we've had that line of argument as well. It gets quite interesting at some points if you're into such discussions.