A Conversation for LIL'S ATELIER
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Z Posted Mar 4, 2006
Amy - I have to admit that sometimes in life you just have to defer to people who are more senior than you. Yes your approach may well be more successful, but persueing it may lead to you loosing your job, and a few more students passing. If a student is intellegent enough to deserve to pass they should be able to pass whatever quality of the teaching materials. If the student needs to be spoon fed then it's not your problem...
The pass rate of the course isn't your problem to be honest - it's your supervisors problem. If she wants to do something to reduce the success rate of her job, then that's her problem. I would just shrug my shoulders think 'silly woman, I could do my job better than she could' and get on with doing it the way she wants.
I sometimes have that problem when I disagree with the way my Bosses want to manage some patients.I can put my point of view across, but at the end of the day it's there descion so I have to get on with it and treat the patient in the way they want them treated.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
mikerhike - guardian of the wa, and now also of WA Posted Mar 4, 2006
This seems to me to be a problem in the evaluation system.
I remember when doing a soft subject, everything was assessed by the course co-ordinator, but to allow freedom of thought and not penalise people who viewed the world differently then about 10% ofthe work was assessed by a separate departmental bod. If there was a major discrepancy, then it was ALL reviewed.
There was also an appeals system, the details of which I can't remember.
It dismays me to hear your story, as it seems to confirm my fears that we are moving more away from expanding people's thinking, and more towards rote learning of accepted 'facts'.
This really hasn't worked in Japan, and really won't work here.
I think I might go and make a snowman.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
mikerhike - guardian of the wa, and now also of WA Posted Mar 4, 2006
Good point Dr Z.
Amy, I should point out that you are talking to someone who left an educational company to start his own because he didn't agree with the way things were done, or the views of his supervisors.
I was lucky in that it was easy for me to do that. Most people have to think about consequences.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Agapanthus Posted Mar 4, 2006
for Amy.
Umm, does anyone know if something has happened to google? I can't get to it or to any blogspot pages either. Is it just me? Or have I deleted the internets?
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Amy the Ant - High Manzanilla of the Church of the Stuffed Olive Posted Mar 4, 2006
*mulling over the advice given*
I've just been having problems with Google too, Ag.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence Posted Mar 4, 2006
*comes in holding kleenex to her nose, waiting for a nosebleed to peter out*
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Hati Posted Mar 4, 2006
Happy Birthday, FG!
Nice scribing, Ben. And nice house, WM. Not nice things with Amy. And Lil, this nose...
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence Posted Mar 4, 2006
This has been a protracted nosebleed -- over 45 minutes now, although it's tapering off.
I have a feline refugee out in the courtyard, a black cat whose coat tells the tale of living outdoors recently, and who is desperately famished. We have established a rhythm where I come outside, it runs and hides, I put down the food dish and go indoors, and, after several beats, this cat comes to the food and scarfs down the food, licking the dish to death, before then rousting Tigger from what's left of her food. Unfortunately, it's the only way I can protect stupid Tigger's food; she takes 5 times as long as any other cat to finish her own food.
It will take about a week to get this cat out of starvation behavior. Then I'll see whether it can be socialized. But I'm suspecting that it's been dumped (sex can't be determined just now, because it carries its tail so low). It has clear eyes and a thick coat, and I think it would look more diseased if it had been outside all its life.
Yes, the nosebleed seems to be over, and I can have a cup of tea. Thanks for the towel, Hati.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") Posted Mar 4, 2006
Morning all.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Hati Posted Mar 4, 2006
Nosebleeds can freak me out. Once I almost bleed to death and that was not a nice experience.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Hypatia Posted Mar 4, 2006
Today I should finally be able to start painting in my kitchen.
Lil, the strangest nose bleed cure I've heard of is to tie a string around your little finger to stop the bleeding.
I will have time to scribe this conversation - unless someone else is just dying to do it, of course. *doesn't think anyone else has volunteered yet*
We have had about 10 drops of rain so far this morning. Our chances increase overnight and tomorrow morning. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Hati Posted Mar 4, 2006
It has been snowing here through all the day and the winter is suposed to stay through all the March. Unfair, if you ask my opinion.
I have been living in my new place for 3 weeks and I still have quite some stuff to unpack. But in 3 weeks time I'll be in Denmark and hopefully meet some hootooers there. Something to wait for.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") Posted Mar 4, 2006
We got a touch of snow last night. Most has melted already. I will continue this weeks tradition of wearing shorts as the weather during the day is still warm.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence Posted Mar 4, 2006
Hypatia! You are now the official scribe for this conversation.
I wish I knew what I could do about it, the nosebleeds, I mean. I've had a few more short bleeding episodes since I last posted, but now it seems to have stabilized. Always the same nostril.
I'm certain that a proper rainy season would be one cure.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
FG Posted Mar 4, 2006
Thanks for the birthday wishes and lovely gifts, all!
::eyes Lentilla's orange button nervously::
Though the best gift arrived overnight--a snowstorm! Seriously, yesterday was warm and sunny (well, warm for Montana in early March), so much so we started the party in a friend's hot tub. Today? It's been snowing constantly since 11pm last night. Everything is blanketed in white.
And despite my best attempts last night , I did *not* wake up with a hangover today.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
David B - Singing Librarian Owl Posted Mar 4, 2006
I wish to offer a round of to Amy's post on higher education, knowledge, learning and so on. It seems to me that higher education should be about learning to think, to reason, to question, to debate and to understand, not about following the beaten path or regurgitating half-chewed facts. Where I work, it is apparent that many students want to be spoon-fed - 'what do I need to say in this essay?' rather than 'what do I think about this question?' or 'how does such and such a theory stand up in this situation?'. A well-supported and intelligent reasoned argument that differs from the assessors own viewpoint should surely be worth more than a poorly-researched piece that happily agrees with the student's lecture notes.
But maybe I have unrealistic ideas about what higher education should be...I tend to think that the word 'higher' should actually mean something.
I'm just sorry I can't help Amy in a very frustrating situation.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Amy the Ant - High Manzanilla of the Church of the Stuffed Olive Posted Mar 4, 2006
Thank you, David .
Having digested the replies, I have an analogy to share that might clarify my view of the teacher's role.
Imagine that someone walks from Land's End to John O'Groats. That's a major achievement for the walker but the journey has been facilitated by the people who have provided the roads and signposts and maps.
As a teacher I provide the pathways, the signposts and the maps but this isn't the same as spoon-feeding, which would be the equivalent of giving the walker a lift in a car. The responsibility for carrying on to the end of the journey rests with the learner, and the achievement is definitely theirs and not shared with their teacher, but an encouraging word, the occasional guiding hand and perhaps the inspiration gained from being with someone who has already made the journey can't be a bad thing, can it?
My problem is that I've found a signpost reading '<-- Scotland This Way' pointing in the direction of the Lake District and I have to confess I am singularly unimpressed by the argument that the thick ones won't know the difference and the intelligent ones will probably realise the mistake and put themselves straight but if they don't, they don't and it's their fault, not mine.
Some of you may find this laughable but I believe I can and do make a difference to people's learning and to their grades (the two not always being connected). Having said that, I come across many teachers who believe that our Masters students come to the uni with a grade stamped on their forehead - primarily reflecting their ability to read and write English - and that nothing we do as tutors makes much difference. It's a good way of justifying coming in at ten, going home at three, planning your lectures on the walk from your office and cancelling two out of three tutorials.
I've got to get that signpost changed.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Z Posted Mar 4, 2006
The impression I got from your post - which may have been incorrect, was that the material prepared by your supervisor was not inaccurate - but not as clear as the information that you provided. Perhaps more difficult to comphrend.
To build on your analogy I thought that the supervisor was providing small signs that were difficult to read, but still pointing in the right direction. If she is providing misleading information then that's different.
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") Posted Mar 4, 2006
[GDZ]
Key: Complain about this post
84Xth Conversation at Lil's
- 61: Z (Mar 4, 2006)
- 62: mikerhike - guardian of the wa, and now also of WA (Mar 4, 2006)
- 63: mikerhike - guardian of the wa, and now also of WA (Mar 4, 2006)
- 64: Bagpuss (Mar 4, 2006)
- 65: Agapanthus (Mar 4, 2006)
- 66: Amy the Ant - High Manzanilla of the Church of the Stuffed Olive (Mar 4, 2006)
- 67: Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence (Mar 4, 2006)
- 68: Hati (Mar 4, 2006)
- 69: Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence (Mar 4, 2006)
- 70: Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") (Mar 4, 2006)
- 71: Hati (Mar 4, 2006)
- 72: Hypatia (Mar 4, 2006)
- 73: Hati (Mar 4, 2006)
- 74: Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") (Mar 4, 2006)
- 75: Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence (Mar 4, 2006)
- 76: FG (Mar 4, 2006)
- 77: David B - Singing Librarian Owl (Mar 4, 2006)
- 78: Amy the Ant - High Manzanilla of the Church of the Stuffed Olive (Mar 4, 2006)
- 79: Z (Mar 4, 2006)
- 80: Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") (Mar 4, 2006)
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