h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

rev. paperboy: Yeah, he did. It's quite a strong bit of evidence for putting him into the "political fanatics" boat, isn't it?

- JD

"Apart from voting and telling my congressman how I feel, which I have done and will continue to do, I can't do a damn thing about it... The only power I have is the power of the vote."

Lentilla, why why why do you continue to say that? You should know that that attitude is merely part of the problem.

As I've said before, if it's not possible for the public to identify and expose corruption in government office, then take steps to remove it - then America's brand of democracy is inferior to that of every other democratic nation.

Yet your country insists on trying to force it's brand of democracy on other nations at gunpoint. Why??? if your system is so obviously inferior that it's only capable of removing corrupt and incompetent officials every four years at the ballot box. (And even then it's not guaranteed.)

Insane dictators like Bush can do a lot of damage in four years.

True, if bush were insane or a dictator he could do a lot of damage.

People who misuse their language can also do a lot a of damage. Propaganda hurts everyone empty sky, everyone.

dave

Absolutes have no place here. He is neither pure evil nor pure good. Name calling dilutes the point made, don't you think? I think IMHO we would better to look at the lack of understanding that might exist in imposing western ideals on an eastern country than to condemn the attempt out of hand. I believe that the issues in Iraq (to use one example of the spirit of this thread) are the fallacy of the original excuses to invade, the ecomonic benefit that may or may not be the result of the invasion, and the religious implications of a Judeo-Christian force imposing it's will on a Musilim nation.

As I understand it in your definition, Bush's existance as a so-called dictator hinges on this conflict so once again, IMHO your argument is specious. That is not to say that he is a model president, leader, or economist but his title should not be as radical as *dictator*.

Empty, you've still failed to make any sort of coherent point. What I keep trying to point out to you is that I have no legal recourse other than voting. Let me put this to you another way. I am NOT going to go and shoot the president. No amount of wanting this will make it be so.

> As I've said before, if it's not possible for the public to identify and expose corruption in government office, then take steps to remove it - then America's brand of democracy is inferior to that of every other democratic nation.

> Yet your country insists on trying to force it's brand of democracy on other nations at gunpoint. Why??? if your system is so obviously inferior that it's only capable of removing corrupt and incompetent officials every four years at the ballot box. (And even then it's not guaranteed.)

I think no system is safe. Name me one democratic system in the world today that can't be undermined by a man bent upon doing harm, with political connections and money to boot. Look at the good intentions of the Communist party. I think it says something for America that up until this point we've trusted our political leaders to be honest and truthful. Nobody expected Bush to take advantage of the system.

I think there'd be a lot more ways to get rid of the President if the original writers of the Constitution had intended him/her to have this much power. When the office was created, the president was a figurehead. With Lincoln's actions, the centralized federal government became a lot more powerful, and with it, the President. Teddy Kennedy also had a lot to do with this; read Theodore Rex, if you're interested.

So our original concept of a democratic society was undermined by Supreme Court decisions and constitutional amendments over the years, until being President became a powerful position. However, the original structure still stands - it's not equipped to deal with a coup from within.

If you've got any bright ideas for solving this problem, speak up! Don't continue to badger me. It's like teaching a pig to sing... wastes your time and annoys the pig.

Originally the Speaker of the House of Representatives was the most powerful person in US politics...this is the lower house, the only one from which appropriations bills can originate. The speaker therefore had the power over the budget...In theory, with more well-disciplined parties, it could go back to being that way.

dave

> I believe that the issues in Iraq (to use one example of the spirit of this thread) are the fallacy of the original excuses to invade, the ecomonic benefit that may or may not be the result of the invasion, and the religious implications of a Judeo-Christian force imposing it's will on a Musilim nation.



> As I understand it in your definition, Bush's existance as a so-called dictator hinges on this conflict so once again, IMHO your argument is specious. That is not to say that he is a model president, leader, or economist but his title should not be as radical as *dictator*.

Empty and Bush have some things in common; they both think in terms of black and white. Axis of evil = evil insane dictator. Maybe Empty Sky is Bush's alter ego... wouldn't that be funny!

Sounds !

Lentilla, have yopu heard the fuss about the electronic voting machines? I read something in our local paper on Monday - I'll try and come up with the details sometime soon.
Apparently, they turned a Democrat state into a Republican one.

I'm not actually sure of any way in which the british public can get rid of a PM except by voting them out at the next general election, well not legal ways anyway. Sure MP's have methods they can use, such as a vote of no confidence, but I don't think the public have anything like that, of course I'll have to dig out my copy of Dearlove and Saunders' Introduction to British Politics to check it.

"Don't continue to badger me. It's like teaching a pig to sing... wastes your time and annoys the pig."

Lentilla, I'm not really sure you should be referring to yourself as a pig. I think that's a little harsh.

I can't believe that in a democratic country it's not possible for members of the public to at least start up a petition to get an irresponsible, criminal leader impeached. There must be at least 100 million members of the great American public capable of doing that. Not you, obviously. Your fatalistic servitude has rewarded you with exclusion. But all it takes is for some caring person to make an effort not to be quite so blinkered and nationalistic.

" Maybe Empty Sky is Bush's alter ego... wouldn't that be funny!"

Not a lot of people know this, but we're actually twin brothers separated at birth.

Thats odd cos Bush Senoir had an evil twin Skippy in the Doonesbury cartoon strip

Empty, obviously you haven't done much research.

http://www.votetoimpeach.org/

Here's a few lines from Ramsey Clark's articles of impeachment. I won't post them all here, because it's quite long...

1) Seizing power to wage wars of aggression in defiance of the U.S. Constitution, the U.N. Charter and the rule of law; carrying out a massive assault on and occupation of Iraq, a country that was not threatening the United States, resulting in the death and maiming of tens of thousands of Iraqis, and hundreds of U.S. G.I.s.

2) Lying to the people of the U.S., to Congress, and to the U.N., providing false and deceptive rationales for war.

3) Authorizing, ordering and condoning direct attacks on civilians, civilian facilities and
locations where civilian casualties were unavoidable.

4) Threatening the independence and sovereignty of Iraq by belligerently changing its
government by force and assaulting Iraq in a war of aggression.

More in here:
http://www.votetoimpeach.org/articles_rc.htm

That's great news! Now why didn't YOU think of that?

Actually Empty, why didn't you? You insist bush is a dictator; that he's violated countless US & international laws; and that he should be impeached. You blame the american population for all these crimes because they stand by and watch, doing nothing.

Yet you have done nothing yourself. Did you write to any of your representatives in government complaining? Why don't you insist trade sanctions against the US? Is it because then you wouldn't be able to buy all those american made goods you love, namely the american made sports car you drive?

dave

He he.
Della

"the american made sports car"

What I thought they only made sports cars, proper sports cars, in Italy, France, Germany and the UK? I've never heard of one from else where.

Any way, we've already gone over how Americans don't know how to make cars faster and more powerfull, well not properly anyway

Hello Dave.

"Actually Empty, why didn't you?"

I presumed you knew this, but I do not live in the United States.

"You insist bush is a dictator; that he's violated countless US & international laws;"

He is and he has. We've established this. Try to keep up.

"Did you write to any of your representatives in government complaining?'

Yes.

" Is it because then you wouldn't be able to buy all those american made goods you love, namely the american made sports car you drive?'

Dave, nobody outside the US takes American cars seriously. They're virtually not imported into this country at all (I think the Jeep Cherokee is the only, one and no-one buys it). American cars are absurd. They're over decorated, under engineered pieces of garbage.