h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I just had to but in here, with a little anecdote about roundabouts.

When I was sitting my driving test, many years ago, one of the sections involved being shown street signs and having to say what they meant. A sign indicating a roundabout was shown to me and I confidently said - "A circle!" (thinking, 'of all the simplistic signs to be shown!'). However, the examiner looked at me blankly and said "A what?"). I said "a circle" (slightly less sure of myself now). and she said "What?". So I said "A circle...?" (even less sure of myself now, and visibly turning a nice beetroot colour). Finally she said "you mean a roundabout?" and I said "YES!".

OK, not a very exciting story, but my point is that we tend to call them circles a lot of the ime in my part of the world (Dundee, Scotland).

88425

But did you pass?

When I was learning to drive, my instructor was qualified to teach other people to be driving instructors. He told me about one pupil he'd had who, when approaching a roundabout, would give the instruction 'Go straight over the roundabout', instead of 'Take the second exit' (or whatever). My instructor got more and more annoyed by this. One day he decided to do something to break his pupil of this habit. So, next time he was given the instruction 'Go straight over the roundabout', he drove straight forward and on to the roundabout, stopping in the middle of it. When he stopped he said 'O.K., now what?' His pupil never did it again.

On a similar note, a new roundabout has been added to Manor Way, between Junction 3 of the M5 and Quinton (near Birmingham). A couple of weeks ago Richard came home and told me that there were some tyre tracks leading up to the roundabout from the Quinton side. Obviously somebody didn't know the roundabout was there and locked their wheels in an attempt to stop before they hit it. They probably didn't succeed and literally went 'straight over the roundabout'!

Of course I did! Now I'm also a member of the Institute of Advanced Motorists, but I still call them circles.

OK - just had to but in here.

Where I live (Dundee, Scotland) the city planners have great fun designing and redesigning junctions. The main strategy is to first install 'part-time' traffic lights. These are allowed to confuse people for say 3-4 years, because they're never switched on. Then they build a roundabout (or circle if you will), in order to see how tight the corners leading up have to be in order to create the maximum problems, especially for large artics. Then, after another 3-4 years, they convert it to the most complicated of junctions, with multiple sets of traffic lights, whilst cerating a number of new developments nearby in order to feed the maximum number of new roads into the area, thus ensuring the absolute maximum of confusion. I traverse all three stages of the traffec planners' jests whilst travelling to University on a morning. Great fun!

I think it's really a University psychology department/town planning department collaboration, perhaps researching into road rage???

88425

*I* think it's because most of our modern urban road systems (especially one-way systems) were designed in the sixties when everyond was stoned. I seem to remember a comedy sketch on TV at some point, with this hippie guy saying "I think it would be really amaaazing, right... if, like.. all the traffic just went... round and round... yeah...!"

The hippy guy was Ben Elton in a wig. he said it would be "really, like, challenging ..." and the programme was The Man from Auntie.

I've never forgotten him saying that either.

Roundabouts in France win hands-down. Not only did they have the (now-defunct) priority to people coming onto the roundabout, but local governments got a grant from central govt for every roundabout they built. Hence an absurd proliferation of mini-roundabouts at the smallest of juctions eg to someone's driveway, or sometimes where there was no junction at all, just a roundabout with 2 exits in the middle of a straight road.

What's more they signpost the exits to lead all traffic in 1 direction (usually because they've put a roundabout at the end of someone's driveway), so as you approach a sign will point left saying 'Toutes Directions' (all directions). Kinda makes you wonder where the other exit roads go. . . .

Strangely, a road I often drive down which had a three-way mini-roundabout has just had it removed - causing not a little confusion.

Ok, just out of curiosity: what's the biggest number of exits anyone's seen at one roundabout? I can manage 6.

Anyone for a round of "Mornington Crescent"?

I'd love to! But I'm having difficulty keeping up with the rule changes.

Thanks! I've been wondering who it was..

Just thought I'd resurrect this thread to note a news item I heard this morning.

It seems that in Florida an attempt to introduce just one roundabout has led to confusion and numerous accidents. They're not sure if the roundabout is too big, the lanes too narrow, the fountain in the middle too distracting - or just that my American cousins really don't know what they're expected to do.

Isn't it amazing that something so common here in the UK can cause so much havoc in supposedly the world's most 'advanced' nation!

In my town I think the planners have run out of sensible places to put mini roundabouts, now they spring up every once in a while in a places where a perfectly good T-junction has managed perfectly well ffor decades. Is this because they have a certain target of new roundabouts to reach per annum or something? What's gonna happen when they run out of 3 road junctios? Roundabouts on sharper than average curves?

Mind you, if they keep busy building mini-roundabouts, maybe they wont build as many of those 'sleeping policeman' things.

From Kaeori: "I've noticed that cyclists generally ignore traffic lights"

And you just _know_ they're the ones who say 'Motorists never look for cyclists'.

I do have sympathy with motorcyclists, though. They obey the rules (mostly), but still get knocked off by cars to be told 'Sorry mate, I didn't see you.' My theory about this is that you can only check for a bike so many times before your brain says to you 'There's never one there. Just pull out.' The fact is that 99 times out of 100 there isn't a bike there.

Those reckess enough to cycle around London must be prepared to take a few knocks!

No cycle lanes on roundabouts!...

Reply to Phil.

The Magic Roundabout near the County Ground at Swindon is brilliant!!

It looks a complete dogs breakfast, sure, but it can have several advantages over conventional roundabouts.

The signs of the road-layout as you approach the Magic Roundabout make it look rather like a cake with white icing and 5 half-cherries plonked onto the top. Each half cherry where the five approaching roads arrive at the large outer circle.

The very centre of this circle has a traffic island with arrows showing the flow to be TO THE RIGHT. Anti-clockwise when viewed from above. This centre island is the one that causes confusion as it is SO counter intuitive.

It works like so:

Each of the 5 smaller roundabouts can be treated as simply that, small conventional roundabouts. Go clockwise, give way to those already on.
Each small roundabout has 3 exits.
If for example you are arriving from one of the feed roads, the small roundabout can allow you to:

1. Move to the roundabout on the left,
2. Move to the roundabout on the right,
3. Go all the way round and head back the way you came.

If you choose 1. you are effectively treating the whole thing as a very large roundabout and going around the outside in a clockwise direction (viewed from above).

If you choose 2. you effectively are now passing onto the next small roundabout but near the centre of the whole big one. If you continue to choose to go to the small roundabout on your right (option 2) you find yourself going anti-clockwise around the centre island.

If you choose 3. you are simply doing a "U" turn as can be done at any sensibly sized roundabouts.

The upshot of all of this is VERY dynamic traffic flow. This is (or was, I haven't lived there for years) a very busy meeting of 5 roads. This junction arrangement did not delay the traffic substantially and appeared to have no bias of flow as can happen with "conventional" roundabouts. It offered more than one route around or across and as such was much quicker than the norm.

When it was first built (early 1970's I believe) it caused absolute chaos with the holiday traffic. They had not seen it before and therefore reacted with extreme caution.

The locals, once they had got used to it, took it to their hearts.

Does anyone else known of this place or is it just you and me Phil?

TTFN

Freddie

Yep, 6 as well. North of Newcastle Upon Tyne. Somewhere near Cramlington.

What do they do in the States, if by some chance, 3 roads should meet and all cross together? This could cause powerful grid-lock with minmal effort.

TTFN

Freddie

Hi Freddie. I think there have been comments here about the Swindon one (and the one in Hemel and the other one). Having to go part way round one made everything else on the test seem easy
It certainly does seem to make the traffic flow and as long as the keep any lights well out of the way it should do OK.

A while back in this discussion, somebody said that they weren't sure that anywhere else had roundabouts.
The French have suddenly developed a rather unhealthy love for the roundabout: I went to Avignon and then on to Narbonne on the South Coast last year. In built up areas there weren't any roundabouts, but in the country, there seemed to be a roundabout every 500yards, despite the fact that the roads coming off the roundabout didn't actually go anywhere. Has anyone else come across this, or is it just me?
Personally I think roundabouts are a good idea - working out which way to indicate can sometimes be a bit confusing though. You could do what a friend of mine does and just put your hazard warning lights on whilst negotiating the roundabout.