h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

little miss nicky: you'll continue looking to God for answers and guidance. This is the same God that put my nadgers on the outside?

http://newsbiscuit.com/article/external-testicles-proves-unintelligent-design

"i was given the information to be praying for the christians there. there woiuld be no point in them getting me to pray for a situation as was reported to me."

I'm sorry, your use of English has deteriorated to the point where I can't understand you.

My point was that you had been told, and told us, that the Christians there were "being persecuted for trying to help people". It makes sense that one of those people would tell you that, because it makes them sound like they're wonderful people being victimised. The facts - the REAL WORLD, nicky - seem somewhat different.

I pointed out that it is not surprising that these people would edit the facts... no, let me be more blunt.

Those people LIED TO YOU nicky, lied to you because then you'd think better of them, and pray for them. Do you understand?

"i dont feel foolish by the way."

Perhaps not. You LOOK foolish, though, to others, when you are the willing dupe of people with an agenda.

"i will continue looking for God for answers and guidance."

Oh dear. Can I suggest that, perhaps, just once, rather than looking for your god, you try opening your eyes and looking at the real world outside your head? I realise I'm probably banging my head against a brick wall...

"i will be relying on him more then ever over the next sixth months as i write a dissatation"

You should be relying on yourself, nicky. And funnily enough, by "relying on god", you are in fact relying on yourself. You're just telling yourself otherwise...

"i have got a greater faith themore science i study."

It continually baffles me how anyone with more than a fleeting education in science can persist in having any religious faith, particularly the wilfully blinkered kind you display. Baffles, and disappoints me.

I only hope you are never allowed to teach science to children, as you will likely do them a great disservice.

SoRB

well i have already been involved in classes to teach science to children and i have an application going through to stat a course to qualify me to teach science to children.

there is no where on the form that asks for my religion. its obviously not important to most people when looking for someone to teach.

but as per usual you are so anti christian that you think my religion will affect my ability to teach.

the reason why i get closer to God the more science i study is due to the amount of "we dont know why..." comments. creation is amazing. its baffiling how everything in the human body is coded for by a molecule which is coiled up within a organelle in a cell. its so tiny but look at the variation in humans. there is alot of things within science which they either dont know how it does/did happen or they only have theories which there isnt enough evidence to confirm. so the case of humans and DNA all they have is a theory called the THEORY of evolution. ther isnt enough evidence to completly make it a fact. i believe evolution did occur and was the method God used in creation. scientists cant determine for definate how it happened. or why. God can.

little miss nicky, I think that using a god to explain the unexplainable is a cop out and ultimately damaging to progress, and that creation is all the more wonderful because it was a happy (for us) accident. To quote DNA (which was inevitable!):

'Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?'

You've your take on it, I've mine. I think it's a shame you waste time 'praying' to something that I don't believe is there.

but o m praying to God is part of the relationship which will get me eternal life.

Eternal life? This is why theists and atheists will never agree on this stuff. I'm going to die. You're going to die. That will be it. Live the life you've got 'coz you ain't getting another.

i live my life now. day by day. i dont know when i will die but when i do i will go to heaven and be with God.

You've been cruelly misled by possibly well intentioned people.

You are going to be teaching science but you trot out that awful "just a theory" claptrap.

Nicky once you know what school you are going to work at any chance you could post it here as I will make sure that none of my friends send their kids there.

"well i have already been involved in classes to teach science to children"

This does not improve my mood.

"and i have an application going through to stat a course to qualify me to teach science to children. there is no where on the form that asks for my religion. its obviously not important to most people when looking for someone to teach."

It is well known that there is a disastrous shortage of science teachers. Clearly, on that basis, standards are lowered to allow people into the profession who, were it not for the shortage, would never be allowed near it. This is simple supply and demand economics.

"but as per usual you are so anti christian that you think my religion will affect my ability to teach."

Hmm.

Two things: I'm not anti-Christian. Please do not categorise me as such. I make no distinction whatever between Christians, UFO enthusiasts, Jews, spirit mediums, Muslims, crystal healing enthusiasts, Hindus or dowsers.

If I'm anti-anything it's irrational superstitions - all of them. ANYTHING that makes you turn away from rational enquiry with a satisfied sense that "I know why - god did it" is to me an abdication of humanity. But that's just me.

"the reason why i get closer to God the more science i study is due to the amount of "we dont know why..." comments."

Ah. Your religion is based on ignorance. That, at least, makes some kind of sense.

"creation is amazing. its baffiling how everything in the human body is coded for by a molecule which is coiled up within a organelle in a cell."

No, nicky, it is baffling TO YOU. Just because it is baffling to you, please do not make the mistake of assuming that it is baffling to everyone.

"its so tiny but look at the variation in humans. there is alot of things within science which they either dont know how it does/did happen or they only have theories which there isnt enough evidence to confirm."

Well, duh. The universe is a big place. Mankind only emerged from the long, benighted ignorance of superstition what? Three hundred years ago? Four, maybe?

The universe is of the order of fifteen BILLION YEARS old, and you're in some way surprised that we don't have all the answers after a few measly centuries of study.

It makes me actually *angry* that you don't see the progress we've made as positive, but rather see the gaps we've got left as in some way "proof" of the existence of your imaginary friend. That you might impart this intellectual bankruptcy to children I find horrifying.

"so the case of humans and DNA all they have is a theory called the THEORY of evolution. ther isnt enough evidence to completly make it a fact."

It is nothing short of appalling to me that you are considering becoming a teacher of science, that you may be ALLOWED to become a teacher of science, while being demonstrably ignorant of what the word "theory" means in a scientific context.

Nicky - evolution is a FACT. It is as much as fact as gravity or magnetism. Anyone who tells you different is either lying or undereducated. You, at the moment, are the latter. I hope you rectify this situation, and if you don't, I hope you never, ever qualify to teach.

"i believe evolution did occur and was the method God used in creation. scientists cant determine for definate how it happened."

Yes, they can. To a large extent, they have. You, however, simply don't know yet. Yet you have the depressing combination of arrogance and ignorance to say what you just have.

"or why. God can."

And there lies my problem with your choice of career.

"God" is not an answer to any question worth asking about the world. The reason is, the answer just begs another question. It really is a very simple process.

If a child asks how life began on earth, you have two options:

1. you can tell the truth, and say "I don't know - but here are our best guesses", and go on to explain about organic chemistry, nucleic acids, replicating molecules, etc. This answer holds out the possibility to the child that although there's not a definitive answer now, there could be one - one they will understand, one they may even be responsible for finding themselves, if they choose to dedicate their lives to the pursuit of that knowledge.

2. you can pat them on the head and say "God made the world and everything in it". This is the worst kind of cop out answer. You might just as well say "Shut up kid, you bother me." It gives them NO useful information, and encourages them to stop thinking about the question. Worse still, when the kid says "well, OK, but then who made god?", you have no answer that makes any sense.

I repeat - I am appalled that people like you might end up as teachers of science in this country. I expect it of the USA, but I had (foolishly) hoped that education in this country was coming out of the backward dark ages. People like you will drag us back there. Bod help us...

SoRB

This is going too far.

A while ago I wrote something in my journal about the rise of secular illiberalism, and this kind of thing is exactly what I meant by it.

People have the right to their metaphysical beliefs, whatever they happen to be, and I don't think it's reasonable to hector or heckle people about those beliefs. It is fair to have open debate and argument, but frankly some of the last few posts here aren't debate or argument, but assertion, assumption, and borderline ridicule.

I really don't understand what a Christian cannot be a science teacher. I don't want to discuss individuals, because it's not fair, but can someone please explain it to me as a general principle? Are you aware that mainstream Christianity accepts evolution? The Catholic Church does, the Church of England does.

But why let the facts get in the way of attacking some straw targets?

Two things;

1) I find I have had a post yanked and, if memory serves, it was a post in which I suggested that Reddyfreddy, far from being as bad as everyone else, was, in fact, worse. If I have caused freddy any offense by this remark, I apologise, it was only intended as a joke.

2) Is Nicky being relentlessly hounded on both these threads or am I getting confused? Either way she and other christians believe stuff that, to me, seems rather silly, but I don't really care and I certainly don't intend to go around haranging her, or anyone else, for it. Incidentally, it's interesting, isn't that a) people complaining about religious prejudice are quite so intolerant and b) 'rationalists' who would prefer science over religion ignore that fact that scientific theories are exploration, study, reason and burden of proof has a grand old traddition of being hopelessly utterly wrong'. I'm not using this as a defence of faith, especially, but it wouldn't do any of us any harm to wonder what future generations will laugh at us for ever having regarded as scientific fact.

I think things have got a little out of hand.
To make my position clear though,

Evolution - speaking as someone who has studied palaeontology, and is conversant with evolutionary throty, I have to say it is not a fact, but a working theory. Natural selection drives adaption - that's all we need to know - I would be happy if the word 'evolution' was dropped - it's loaded with misunderstanding and bad data - the theory of adaption is more accurate and can be argued against less. Bacteria evolve fast, to the point where new anti-biotics have to be created to combat them - this is adaption - nothing is getting better (as the term 'evolution' now implies), it is changing due to pressure from outside influences.

The Anglican and Catholic churches have realised the futility of arguing against such an obvious and observable phenomenon and have instead adopted it, placing their god as the source. This was inevitable. You can argue with faith, but don't expect to win, because the goal-posts are magic, and move all by themselves.

Ironically, the arguement that god started life and used evolution to tweak it along is itself a wonderful example of evolution - an adaption of a story (or meme to get all Dawkensian) driven by external pressures.

It sounds to me that Little Miss Nicky needs some love, sympathy and attention rather than being shouted at.

Of course not having a faith probably means that I arrived at that conclusion accidentally, in a dumb and fumblingly brutish manner, because if non-believers can be understanding and kind at will, there is no need for god.

Life *is wierd*, but there's nothing wrong with saying 'I don't know how it happened. Really. Beats me. Do you think it matters? Let's have a nice cup of tea."

"throty" = theory.

Have any of you walked through the woods,found an ant heap, then,poked it with a stick?It teems,they repair the damage,bluster, then complain as to who allowed the breach etc.they even kill each other because there has been a breach of trust.Does anyone think that this planet is so important and so different to any other ant heap? I am a grain of sand situated in a bucket full of sand,anything i have to say will be of no relevance whatsoever,either now,or in the future.
What i attempt to do,in the meantine,is,to try to understand the point of it all,as ,after sixty odd years,plus VAT.I still 'aint got a clue, i have also learned,after a couple of terms of imprisonment,shouting and complaining,achieve zilch

I feel very little sympathy for Little Miss Nicky and her ilk. Gays have been persecuted and treated quite appalingly for hundreds of years due to people holding her views. And so in a little bit of cyberspace people confront her toughly with some rigorous rationality, which she refuses to acknowledge intelligently.

And yes I still feel concerned that someone like her is going to be in an intimate relationship with REAL LIFE vulnerable youngsters. If she starts being a bit more intelligently and honestly upfront that her personal faith will always be put aside when dealing with young people, I might just about let it go. I may think she is balmy for some of the things she comes out with, but its people holding those views being responsible for young people with all the conflicts and difficulties that entails, that ultimately is so concerning.

So over to you Little Miss Nicky. What are you going to say to the youngster who comes to you one day after class and tells you he/she is gay?

Oh get of your damn hobbyhorse Fanny. Gay people may have been persectued but they weren't all persecuted by Nicky were they? If all you're doing is storing up all your anger and hurling it at one person then you really aren't helping anyone very much and if it's tolerance you're preaching then maybe you should get some practise in. by the way, tolerance isn't 'except for these people I don't like them because...' it's an all or nothing deal.

>>if it's tolerance you're preaching<<

I'm not a great fan of preaching actually....Intelligent honest response to some straightforward rational questions would be nice though.

Seeing as how this is a generally theist-based thread, how do people feel about theists getting special treatment in NHS hospitals? A University Professor is arguing for patients to be asked their religion on admittance to ensure they receive the appropriate care.

So long as my tax doesn't pay for their faith I would have no problem with it, but I doubt that would be the case.