h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Grey Desk I'm not saying that Brent East Result will be translated across the country. However when a Government is in trouble the second placed party in a by-election should be able to challenge the governemnt candidate not the lowly placed thrid palced candidate.

However oposition to overruling the UN Security Council

Tories no Lib Dems yes

To Top up fees

Tories belatedly Lib Dems for years

To council tax

Tories no way Lib Dems this is undemocratic need ability ot pay local tax

To post office closure

Tories what is a post office Lib Dems stop these now.

That's what I was saying, the Liberals for once are looking credible at a national level. This is a good thing, as the Labour Party needs some kind of credible opposition and has needed one from its first day in office.

The bit that I can't work out is the left/right/centre split nowadays. There are elements that are all pretty much jumbled up as all parties fight for the centre ground of political opinion. This is currently held by the Labour party, but I see the Liberals maybe taking some of this away. The Tories, suffice to say, are nowhere and will remain so for some considerable time.

Ken Clarke is *not* a credible possible Conservative leader. He is a miserable embittered old git who doesn't think he had a fair enough go last time around. Or the time before that. You think he would have got the hint by now. He's got a five year old's attitude of "well if I can't have it that I'll make sure no one else can have a decent go".

I think that bit about left right centre is gone. Am reading Tony Benn's last diaries at the moment and getting his viewpoint on that as well he see's it being eroded away too.

I'm not quite sure how the Lib Dems are being a credible opposition? What makes them so?

As far as I can see there is no credible opposition to a party that has 408 seats in parliament and shows such contempt for parliament given such a huge majority.

The Lib Dems are IMHO just picking up (some) votes of the dissaffected, not winning votes on merit. And as for Brent East, that was never going to swing to the Conservatives now was it? Not even the greatest leaders in the conservatives past could have pulled that one off. So a swing away from labour there is more telling in the disaffection of labour not who they swung too.

At this stage i'd put money on a hung/coalition parliament after the next election.
Good forbid though another Labour government.
DD I hope the Lib Dems get it if the Tory's don't

Tenaka

The tories have got policies on all of those things mentioned though please dont ask me what they are, but there again I couldn't have told you the lib dems either.

Ken Clarke has the ability to be an excellent leader and a good conservative, however he is not credible in the respect that he is not acceptable to the membership as he is pro Europe.

And as to going nowere for the foreseeable, if we get a good leader (not likely considering the options) we could start to regain ground quickly enough to make inroads at the next election.

Tenaka-

The Tory leader is elected by the party activists, who are a relatively small number, they tend to be the dying breed of retired majors and home counties blue rinse brigade. IDS no doubt appealed to them because they are obsessed with one issue - Europe. If they continue to dominate the Tory party choice of leader the party will go the same way as all single issue parties - into history. The Labour government is stagnating, one reason being they are having such an easy time of it in Parliament the Labour executive, which effectively means Tony Blair, are not challenged to justify what they do or come up with fresh ideas to appeal to the electorate. A mass defection of centrist Tories into the Liberals to infuse some life into them is the only way I can see any creditable opposition appearing. Some chance!

I think KC might do well because right-of-old-labour labourites that I have met seem to have the impression that he is not a right wing nutter like most of the others, and if disappointed enough with tony they might switch sides to vote for him.

Not me though, I remember him as Health and Education minister *mutters darkly*

Actually the leader is elected by all members of the party no matter what their political swing within the party, be they pro or anti europe.

Tenaka

Tenaka most of the Conservative policies on the issues I listed are identical to either Labour or the one case I mentioned above the Lib Dems. No orignal though there no wonder they are suffering.

Just to keep you up to date on the betting, IDS is now at 1/16 to lose the vote - I think that translates as he's toast.

Michael Howard is now the clear favourite to replace him at 4/5.
With David Davis and Portillo at 7/2 and 6/1 respectively.
Ken Clarke is now drifting out.

Can i but a pound of marmalade on the taost please.

bit of a sweet tooth there I think!

Davis I could cope with, although he is a touch right wing. I think I've made my feelings on KC perfectly clear. Howard is both too right-wing and harkens to the Party's past too much. Portillo?

I hardly think that the Lib Dems can get to excited about policies when they come up with some very poor ideas such as Lib Dems Policy Paper on volunteers, which has the laudible aim of making this "the basis of a revolution that can allow communities to tackle crime, watch over the elderley and vulnerable, engage more of our young people in purposeful activity and humanise public services" while at the same time creating a strategy which allows us to "find the right balance between protection from exploitation and danger and the freedom to pursue voluntary work without excessive constraints or bureaucracy."

Oh God. It reads just like a Labour position paper all waffle and great snetiments with no substance. The majority of that report (some 8 pages) dealt with what the govenrment were doing not what Lib Dems suggest. Also if they really believe that this can be a succes to the degree stated above, then we should be of no doubt that the Lib Dems really are living on Ballantyne's The Coral Island.

Tenaka

Ken Clarke's been too bust promoting smoking to the youth of Vietnam for this particular plot to be his fault, Kerr. I'm afraid you have to look at people like the hilarious Michael Fabricant (and his amazing dancing wig)to find who are the embittered old gits this time around.

KC won't even bother running this time. If he does anything except point and laugh from the sidelines he'll back Tim Yeo. The hilarity of it is that what I can see happening is another 'compromise' candidate emerging from al this who will last two years as they don't really represent the party on anything.

Come on down, Teresa May!

Michael Howard is only favourite because of the time of year. By the time the elections come around, this years revival of the Monster Mash will be over and the party might have come to it's senses enough to nail the old sod back in his coffin.

Oh, and who *does* Anne Widdecombe think she's fooling with that ridiculous alice band?

Tenaka boy that is one heavy policy discussion document you sent me off to read. However there is a lot of Lib Dem actions in there it is laid out in very proper language though which is the way with all these things. Hence the what Labnour have done and what conservatives belive section and also the look at best practise. This is the boring side of politics I know and the musing over the phrasing takes an age.

Sorry, i just happen to have read that one.

Hope you enjoyed it. It was just one that came to mind. Like I said before I hope if the Tories dont win the next election that the Lib Dem's do. I at the moment support the conservatives (even though that support is waning), but I do enjoy politics and I will always be a member of which ever party I support at the time. As it so happens I also think that voting should be a civic duty rather than a right.

Tenaka