h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Thanks for the explanation WD - what you are describing sounds familiar from what my friend said to me all those years ago. I do remember that I found the whole thing horrific, though my friend appeared to take it all very calmly.

B

Oh, that Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron posted again while I was typing. hehe.

I think if you are correct about that, then it will be struck down by the courts. Perhaps this particular law was not a wise move by those who wrote it. Hmm.

Re: Terminology

It's merely the accuracy of the words that you use to describe termination of pregnancy.

'Abortion' means both a miscarriage and the medical/surgical procedure.

'Miscarriage' is the spontaneous loss of a pregnancy before the 24th week.

'Termination of pregnancy' (ToP for short) means the medical/surgical procedure carried out before the 24th weeks, which I think is what you wish to discuss.

These are the official medical terms (in the UK anyhow) and are very precise in their definitions, as ToP is also a legal term as well as a medical term.

I absolutely LOVE some men's spin on abortion sometimes. Seems to me, Nerd, that you think women take this issue lightly. Quite honestly, no man is ever going to dictate whether or not I have an abortion. The rights of the father are important, yes, but it is down to the woman at the end of the day. It is HER BODY (until the day that guys can be bothered to carry an alien being in their body : suffer physiological/hormonal changes AND THEN GIVE BIRTH!) And try having
a little empathy. You seem to be standing firmly in the opinion that women just go around slaughtering unborn babies without a care in the world.



There are three ways of looking at the issue of abortion. It's not a liberal standpoint (ask everyone ON this site, I am in NO way a liberal)...

1) Pro Life (regardless of what other issues they stand against)
2) Pro Abortion
3) Pro Choice

"I just think we should ban abortions"

Ok. I have to say this. Nerd, my friend. You are not only a moron, but a disgrace to the male species. Get a clue, get some education, and more importantly, get a life.

>I also think that even if most people do not agree with this, no matter what party we're with, or what religion we are, we should at least be able to agree that partial birth abortion,

That's the appeal that the pro-life croud is pushing for with PBA bans. We can't convince a majority of Americans to outright ban the whole issues, so we'll come up with some extreme that everyone can agree on. The Anti Gun people do the same thing with so-called assault weapons bans, waiting periors etc.

>I just think we should ban abortions. Everywhere. Whether that means passing this particular law that the website is talking about, or going to all 50 of the state legislatures,

I care very much about the law and the Constitution. I think it's a shame that Republicans support non-sense like Senate Bill 3 when they should know better. They keep complaining about liberals and the ever encroaching federal government. They should respect the same bounds when it comes to something they want to ban.

Ben - no probs

>>"I just think we should ban abortions"
>Ok. I have to say this. Nerd, my friend. You are not only a moron, but a disgrace to the male species.

Wait a minute, S@urnine. Why is this not a legitmate position? If he things that a person is a full-fledge human being right from conception, then his position has merit. He is trying to keep human beings from being killed.

Personally, I'm always disgusted by people who say abortion is murder, but they will accept abortion in the cases of rape or incest. Now there is a position that doesn't make any sense what-so-ever. If the fetus is a person, then it's totally immaterial how it got in there. It's a person with rights who is innocent of the crime of rape that created it.

Banning partial birth abortion is not an extreme. The thing itself is!

"You seem to be standing firmly in the opinion that women just go around slaughtering unborn babies without a care in the world."

That is just soooo rediculous! I've spent my time volunteering at places that help pregnant mothers who have had or might have an abortion and don't have a place to stay. Some of them leave and do, some leave and don't.

Also, thank you moron. I was also going to respond to that last thing, but you did so so well that I now don't have to.

Well. Let me see. Why is it not a legitimate position.

*thinks*

Could it be because men have no right to dictate what women do with their bodies?

Yes. That could be it.

There seems to be some kind of warped ideal that certain men seem to have when it comes to abortion. I am not the most liberal person in the world : nor am I anti-male. I am not a feminist either.

But until certain individuals of the male species start realising exactly WHAT pregnancy and abortion issues are...not just a toy to play with, not just a lunch time appointment, but responsibility, the possibility that the operation (or the birth) could go wrong, and ruin the womans body for the rest of her life....until they do, not one of you have the right to stand there and say "Oh, it's killing the baby...what about the rights of the father...blah blah blah". In society, women are STILL the main providers to children. Until some of you lot start realising the whole picture of what it all is really about, you have no right to offer an opinion.

And shoot me down if you wish. I don't care. No man is ever going to dictate what I do with my body.

OBVIOUSLY IT IS AN EXTREME!!!!!

Jesus Christ, do you even know what you are talking about?

Do you think that women have it for superficial reasons?

*bangs head against hard surface*

You really have no clue. And you never will, because you will never ever EVER have to make that kind of decision.

Re "superficial reasons": Rarely I grant you, but yes, when it's for their careers, or the mother is insane, which has happened, believe it or not. But that is very rare. When have I said women normally have abortions for "superficial reasons"?

About "their own bodies": Women can do whatever they want to their own bodies. It's when it affects their children's bodies that I draw the line!

Also, many believe that abortions are more risky than other alternatives such as c-sections and simply giving the child up for adoption.

later:
I've found another page: http://www.w-cpc.org/abortion/index.htm
About abortion health risks: http://www.w-cpc.org/abortion/physical.html

About "What is PBA?": http://www.w-cpc.org/abortion/dx.html

Guess what, Nerd - As long as the child is in the body, it's affecting the mother's body. Therein lies one of the largest flaws in your 'ban all abortions' stance.

I'm not going to say any more on this topic, because it's a rather sensitive one for me and I'd rather not, suffice to say I agree with the fact that men are welcome to have an opinion on abortion/termination/whatever you want to call it, but they've got no place trying to dictate what a woman can and can't do to her body - and that includes terminating a parasitic organism that may cause her physical or mental harm...

You are implying that the choice to have an abortion : whatever version, is superficial and in your words "should be banned"...that kind of view can only ever come from an uneducated individual.

I don't care about YOU drawing the line. Until you can suffer (yes! Suffer!) the outcomes of pregnancy, of unwanted children, or of having an abortion, you have no right to comment. You are on the outside looking in, and I don't believe you have the ability to experience empathy. I would never even consider asking a man to have a vascetomy : it's nowhere NEAR to being my choice to make.

You aren't one of those men that think that when women wear sexy clothing they are asking to be raped, are you? Because you are certainly coming across as one of those kinds of men.

Guess what KittyCat, in a partial birth abortion, the child is halfway outside the mother's body.

Hmm. Ripping a foetus out of the body...risky? Who WOULD have thought it.

Nerd, you are making yourself out to be a bigger idiot as you go along. Once again you back up my ideal that you think of women as being stupid and irresponsible.

How about you stop while you are ahead?

Guess what Nerd42 - pretty much EVERY woman knows the details of abortion before the age of 18...

"Guess what KittyCat, in a partial birth abortion, the child is halfway outside the mother's body."

Guess what, Nerd, I was addressing your blanket statement that all abortions should be banned, so please consider the context of the statement before making ill-informed and pig-headed assumptions about what's being said.