h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I went out last night in Manchester's Gay Village and my favourite club has now got signs everywhere announcing how it is 'hetero-friendly' and everyone is welcome, which makes me like the club even more.
I have a real hatred for gay-only clubs, most of my friends are straight and I want to be able to have a fun night out with them. I'm also sick to the back teeth of being challenged about my sexuality when I try to get into these clubs. Unfortunately it seemed it was a trend that was spreading, it's just great to see some places going against it, perhaps we can see a trend going in the opposite direction.
Anyhoo, enough of my waffle, anyone else got opinions on this?

Hmm, now I'm living in the UK I suppose I'll have to think about this stuff a bit more. Living in Bangkok was rather different. Even in a 'straight' club, it could be a bit tricky figuring out what gender people were...

I think gay people have been seperating themseleves too much by trying to have an identity, and gay clubs is one of the things I didnt like because you cant take your straight friends in with you. My opinion that I have often being lectured on including how I obviously havent suffered etc, I could do some heavy lecturing back but I cant be bothered with these sort of people. It just builds a wall. So I think this is a great step anyway

I'm all in favour of just treating people as people, myself. I don't like the one and only gay club in this city because it's tacky and overpriced, but even if it was stylish and affordable I'd be annoyed by it. I'm much more comfortable down the (generally straight) pub, where nobody's making assumptions about what goes on in my bedroom or how desperate I am to get someone else into said bedroom. So hurrah for 'straight-friendly' gay venues; I like the idea of places that welcome people, regardless of what they like doing with other people.

I hope that makes sense; it's hard to tell at 6:30am.

Gay folks can be just as vicious towards 'hetties' as straight folk can be towards gay folk.

None of it is necesessary.

For a pint and a chat I generally end up in straight pubs because gay pubs can be so, well, *gay*. I don't really do the club thing (never really have) but find that gay clubs are a lot of fun and it would be nice to take my straight mates along but, lets face it, most people in clubs, be they straight clubs or gay clubs, certainly aren't there for the conversation (you'd never hear it anyway) and aren't just there for the dancing.

I suppose a mixture of straight-friendly & gay-exclusive venues is the way forward. A lot of my straight mates have expressed an interest in coming to a gay club/pub and it would be nice to take them along, but there are some places I wouldn't dream of taking them to, and I think I'd like to retain that air of mystery.

(roymondo, air of mystery, does not compute...)

I aim for an air of bemusement and confusion, myself. It's easier to manage.

And yes, there are some times when a gay-only venue is what's wanted, but that's another matter.

When I was up in Manchester, I found most of the 'gay clubs' pretty nice friendly places (I think I went to two or thre eof them), and for some reason found them an awful* lot cheaper than the 'hetro' clubs just up the road But then again, Mancehster just does have a nice vibe to the place, being so big and mixed culturally there I'm not generally a club kinda person anyhow though and I'm more liklly to be propping up the bar in teh local real ale joint than a club where the music doesn't exactly fit my 'style' Segregation is pretty much always a bad idea as far as concepts go, it just tends to perpetuate the idea of 'them and us' and differences though the gay club does I guess have its place, but as I said in general I've never gone into one with straight friends and had em turned out at the door Generally I've also found em more ameanible places than 'ordinary' clubs which just tend to exuede an air of pent up violence and agression

Ive never had any issues with taking straigh friends on the scene at home in brighton. Lets face it Brighton is famous for having some of the best nightlife in the country and no-one actually cares who/ what sexuality/ gender/ species you are. Its the most relaxed scene ive ever been out in.

I suppose, though, that because theres such a huge variety of clubs, not many straight people go to the gay clubs in brighton. It's very rare to see hetties gettin off in the corner of a gay club... but still, if they want to come in I find that they are pretty much welcome to.

Each to their own but I find it never quite works both ways. In the city where I live, heteros degay gay spaces and it's happened twice in recent years and the gay venues dropped from six to four as a result.

In an ideal world we really would be "all friends together" but I could never show any form of affection to my same sex partner (if I had one) in any other venue apart from those four gay bars which are still gay in the city in which I live.

Out of interest, Honestlago, which club are you talking about?

Poptastic. Stupid, cheesy and cheap but I love the place

ah right. Yes, Poptastic was a good night out when it was a gay night out around 2000/2001. Trouble was that in the city i live in, it really DID straighten out as it became just another cheap night for heterosexual students. Word got around that it was a student night rather than a gay night and the gays stopped going and Poptastic withdrew from the city in question in 2003. They did try again a little while later, albeit on a Sunday which isn't the best night of the week. We went a couple of times and on one night, out of the 50 or so in the club, myself and my friend were the only gays in there. We left almost immediately because we were surrounded by heteros doing their thing to such an extent that we both felt uncomfortable. Again, it closed a few weeks later.

I don't know what it is like in Manchester and whether it is gay, mixed or basically hetero but I personally wouldn't go because I can go to proper gay places in Manc, be the majority and not feel intimidated by heteros as is the case when heteros invade gay spaces. Theys eem to feel the need to basically have foreplay with their opposite sex partner to make the point that they are there which is disrespectful at best and out of roder at worst. Heteros have 99.999% of bars and clubs to do their thing in but feel the need to disrespect gays by doing it in gay spaces as well.

Out of interest, how do they publisicse the night in Manchester? Do they call it a gay night, a mixed night, "we're all friends here" kind of night or what? and do you get heteros doing their thing in the way they do in the so-caleld gay venues in the city I live in?

It's advertised as straight-friendly, which means the club is mostly gay, but with a few straight people brought in under the supervision of sensible homos. Never seen the breeders breeding in Pop, or more or less anyway on Canal Street, with the exception of Baa Bar which advertises itself as mixed.

I think the most important thing for me is that I'm not intimidated by hetros, as I've said most of my friends are straight and for me it's important that I can go somewhere where both groups feel comfortable and obviously I can't do this in gay only places. Added to that is the fact that I'm almost always challenged when I go into these places and I *hate* it passionately

I can understand your anger at being challenged over your sexual orientation but I guess they just wnat to maintain a safe gay space. What would probably help is to make sure that anyone who they think is hetero is told in no uncertain terms that they are going into a gay space and to respect it. At which venues do you get challenged in particular?

I think there is a difference between Manchester and Leeds. In Leeds, they literally come in and 'breed' and they do it in a disrespectful manner plus they (mainly women) come up and make indirect homophobic comments and when we tell them where to go they just whine "don't be like that." It causes great offence and they do it just to take they mickey out of us. How do the heteros (both couples and singles) behave in PopT in Manchester and do you get heteros doing their thing in your face and what do they say when gays do their thing in the supposed gay venue?

I always used to get challenged at Essential and the Thompsons Arms. Don't any more by the simple virtue of deciding not to spend my money there - it's their loss. I think one of the reasons I hate it so much is that it relies upon and reinforces stereotypes. I don't conform to the gay stereotype in pretty much any way, I'm not camp, I'm not fashionable, I can't dance well and I'm most certainly not some skinny little nothing.

The message I used to get was that if you didn't conform to these stereotypes, you weren't immediately welcome and had to prove your worthiness, something I don't enjoy doing.

I really don't mind if clubs put up notices that say 'You are entering a gay club, please respect this' or something similar, because it's a lot more welcoming but states in no uncertain terms troublemakers or those being jerks will be ejected, which is as it should be.

I've never had any problems in straight-friendly places but I think that's because straight people in Pop realise there is a social code of behaviour and stick to it. When I went out for my 21st just before Xmas, I had to take out my slightly homophobic housemate (I'd invited everyone else in the house and didn't want to cause an argument) and I told him if he acted like a jerk the bouncers would remove him and then I'd have my revenge when I got home. He behaved himself, even when a guy gave him a very explicit proposition (this made me ). I don't mind breeders doing their thing to the extent that public decency allows, doesn't bother me in the slightest, just so long as they don't mind me doing the same

Essential is just a place for pretentious queens, from what I can tell having been there - ie the stereotypical young gays who try to outdo each other. I have only been twice and found it was also full of heterosexuals 'breeding.' In other words, it was full of pretentious queens and heterosexuals, who i spotted 'breeding' every time I walked round the club.

I think doing as you suggest, by making it crystal clear that it IS a gay venue/club should be sufficient and as well as a notice, saying so on the door or at the payment booth making sure in no uncertain terms that heteros know they are going into a gay venue and that they will be ejected if they are disrespectful.

As for the public breeding, I fail to see why they find a need to do it in a gay venue. In one sense it's laughable becuase they are so insecure I see it that they come in on OUR terms and shoudl be respectful and keep it out of the way and allow us to be ourselves without being made to feel uncomfortable as is the case in Leeds as the last time I was in QCs a heterosexual couple were literally having foreplay right in the middle of the dance area and it was bang out of order. The vibe was not a friendly gay environment and one of my friends got homophobic abuse in the cloakroom. We've never been since as we considered it to be straightened out. Granted that was 18 months ago and it might have changed again then but none of us are inclined to spend the money to find out. What's your take on heteros breeding in gay venues/clubnights?

Just playing devil's advocate here, but do you ever go to straight clubs and make out with other blokes? I know I do every so often.

I think hets breed in gay clubs for the same reason they breed in straight clubs, because they are drunk and horny. It truly doesn't bother me, I like to see people having a good time and if that's how these people construe a good time, then fair play to them. Provided no-one gives me any grief for similar behaviour I'm quite happy to let people be and do what they want.

As for the getting abuse, that's bang out of order and I'd never stand for it, it's happened on a few occasions and I simply had a word with the bar staff and got the people booted out. Then I carried on (using the term loosely) dancing and forgot about it, no idiot ruins my night out.

I've never experienced a club 'straightening out' like you describe but I don't think it'd bother me that much, so long as the drinks were still cheap and the music was still good, I go to straight places about as much as gay places and feel just as comfortable.

I never go into a non gay bar period. Would just not feel comfortable and would always have in the back of my mind that if I looked in the rong direction I'd get a glass on my eye or a punch on the nose. My friends are the same and we stick to where we CAN be ourselves without fear of reprisal (apart from the homophobic hetero females of course).

I've never felt that I can't be myself in a straight place, I love some straight places. I'm probably always looking in the wrong places and I've yet to get into too much trouble