h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

This post has been removed.

This post has been removed.

This post has been removed.

This post has been removed.

What a load of BS!*

(*Blues Shark)

Hey, no need to repeat yourself!

With regard to 'cowards and appeasers', if we are to have a thread devoted to the bashing of Americans, surely the Governments in Europe are fair game in this thread too? I'd like to start a thread 'What's wrong with Northern England' though I'm not sure the BBC has servers big enough .

Ooops.
Don't know how that happened.

Somebody already started one about London, so feel free.
But that's the point. The title of the thread isn't 'What's Wrong with Europe'.
Feel free to start one.

Well I'm back after working a local election, pointedly enough. It was a primary. 5:30 am -11:30pm (only because our crew is so fast.) Our town is so small we still use paper ballots. But I digress. I see I have a lot of reading to do to catch up with the conversation, so I shall just make a few points and get back to you.

I must agree :the two party system is a failure. George Washington warned against it in the beginning. In fact George Bush and Al (I invented the internet) Gore are the same dudes, backed by the same giant corporations, which, in fact ,are who are really running the governments.

Speaking of revisionist history. The U.S. was founded on Judeo-Christian ethics, and the founders did make the point that if it were not run by men following on these foundations it would fail. The purpose of the founders was not freedom FROM religion, but just freedom from one denomination taking over the gov't and persecuting the others. The very thing they fled from in Europe. Totally amoral, Godless individuals are trying to oust the last vestiges of this foundation and may very well succeed. The U.S. will be a memory, even as much of it is today for those of us who saw the way it was. No one is to be compelled to worship in a particular way, but then, no one should be kept from their faith, as long as it does not directly threaten the existing foundation. However it has become unfashionable to be of Judeo-Christian origins in this country. Any strongly held beliefs are labeled "hategroups" in the press, and the Moslem faith, though they explain it not, is being shared. It is not, in it's essence, at all friendly to our country remaining free.

The election I worked had 120 people voting out of 300some possible.Even though the issues affected their taxes. I suppose they were too busy to show, or home watching the mindsuck.

Oh, I'm not a teacher. I'm a musician. Though I did home school our kids for 10 years. I graduated the last one this year.(yippee! schools out!) Sorry ,I'll keep my responses shorter in the future.

coldjam

...don't quite follow... (so correct if wrong)
are you saying Islam as a religion is detrimental to your freedom?
Strongly held beliefs are only 'hategroups' if they involve, or advocate, intolerance and unpleasantness to another belief on the grounds of what it is (i.e not the same as theirs.) That sounds like the 'we encourage false beliefs and call it tolerance/we encourage perversity and call it alternative lifestyle' school, which is to say the least unsavoury.
Religion and morality *are* separable and separate.
Surely suggesting that if one's leader does not possess Judeo-Christian beliefs their country will fail, is 'one denomination taking over the government and persecuting the others'?
Who are these 'godless individuals'?

My Inlaws

disaster!
are you going to destroy them, or just keep them under surveillance?

Putting on a plane for UK tommorow. {what was your adress again?}

Coldjam,
why do you think godless = amoral?

I'm afraid if this debate is going to get religious I'm outta here, they only cause trouble in my experience.

Mel

The problem isn't religion, it's just a good scapegoat. Everyone keeps of each others toes for fear of offending each other, whereas if it was just political they wouldn't give a damn

The trouble is people don't keep off each other toes, I have had people tell me my beliefs are wrong even though I am believing them on a completely different part of h2g2 to them and wasn't trying to force my beliefs on anyone, why should I feel scared to tell people I'm religious, why should I worry that I will be judged?

I am a moral person who happens to be a believer. I know plenty of amoral people who call themselves believers, I know more moral people who say they have no religion.

Religion and morals are not equal, upbringing has more effect on your morals, but then again if one of the main parts of your upbringing is religion teaching you to love one another, accept and forgive, it is bound to affect your morals for the good.

Mel

The US is one of the more religious places in the world (it was, after-all, settled by those seeking religious freedom), but at the same time is often accused of being the most immoral country in the world, or at least one of them. Funny that. Personally I think that morals and religion have as much in common as politics and altruism.

It depends whether you consider a person who calls themself religious but who is imoral (according to their beliefs, christians who kill, mormons who mastubate, muslims who sleep around) to actually be religious. If everyone who said they were a christian followed the 10 commandments and Jesus' teachings maybe they would be more moral.

Mel

heres a first I actually agree with you on that one E G Mel.