h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

So I am writing my CV (again) and am now wondering what to do about this little episode in my life:

After I had successfully finished the university, I went on to a special on-the-job training program. What with one thing and another and life in general happening to me, I did not actually finish this program. Or rather (and I am not proud of it), towards the end I more or less actively worked towards failing this program. Which I succeeded doing.

I have worked in a related field since then and am now looking for an upgrade in work (and pay). Hence the CV writing.

I am really not sure what to do about that two and a half year period of training. Of course, I would not want to leave a gap in my CV. But writing "2006 - 2009: on-the-job training (failed)" does not sound good, either.

So, do you have any suggestions about how to phrase that?

Thanks for your ideas.

Y.

Just stop thinking like a beggar. The firm is not interested in your CV, nobody will wade through all that stash of paper.
Just tell them what you can do, ask them what they would pay someone they obviously need.

Sounds like good advise. I might worry too much about it, yes. What does trouble me, though, is that my failed training regarded being a teacher - and this is what I am applying for now... (I *have* become better since )


Y.

Y - when talking to whoever interviews you... mind body language.
He already knows you´ll earn more than he and won´t have another one above him who has more clout, so lean back in your chair, keep looking him in the eyes, telling him "I´m the alpha animal". Works, believe me.

If it was "on the job", it's a job. Just put it on your CV as employment, put in few details, and neglect to mention the training aspect of it. If you weren't paid, then imply it's some sort of internship or volunteer work to help give you some experience while looking for other work.

That's not an easy one, I'll grant you.

In the CV don't state that you were working towards a qualification. Simply state the work that you did, the skills and experience that you gained, focussing on the skills that are required for the new job.

In interview, they may well ask you about it as it's related to the job you are applying for. Finally, definitely make sure that you have a simple answer when they ask 'why did you leave?' because they'll probably ask that if it's a similar job - they don't want to hear that you found the students too challenging or that you lost interest!

I always used to refer to the PhD I dropped out of (hated it at six weeks, stuck it out for 18 months before accepting the inevitable) as a research studentship - I was doing research, I was a student, I did it for a long time so can't gloss over it, I just never got the fancy title at the end. I never once wrote "failed PhD student" on my CV because they want to know what I CAN do, not what I couldn't do five years ago.

I agree with the above, list it like a job, if they ask you about it you can say you were in training, and tell them about what you learned. If they press you why you didn't stay on to do the qualification just say that for a variety of reasons you went off to do xyz and learned .

It is all about the positives - what you learned and what you can do for them

"He already knows you´ll earn more than he and won´t have another one above him who has more clout, so lean back in your chair, keep looking him in the eyes, telling him "I´m the alpha animal". Works, believe me"

Ermm, beg to differ. I have recruited a fair number of people in my time and when people try that "Alpha" move, then they fail right there and then. No point trying to outstare an interviewer until you have the clout to back it up - and that depends on the interviewer letting you in the door in the first place!

"when talking to whoever interviews you... mind body language.
He already knows you´ll earn more than he and won´t have another one above him who has more clout, so lean back in your chair, keep looking him in the eyes, telling him "I´m the alpha animal". Works, believe me"

Ignore this advice. Seriously, ignore it.

Your aim in a CV is to secure an interview, nothing more. Your aim in an interview, first and foremost, is to make a good impression in the first few seconds. You're trying to be the interviewer's friend.

Trust me on this - try to intimidate them, try to put one over on them or give them the impression that you think you're a bigger dawg than they are, and you'll be lucky to get to the end of the interview.

I had a boss who related a story to me of an interview he'd conducted with someone who'd been reading something about interview technique. In response to the question "where do you see yourself in a year's time", he'd said "Sitting in that chair asking more original questions". Despite a rigid HR policy which required a structured interview in which all interviewees were asked the same things, this particular character was immediately asked to leave. Furthermore, not only was he escorted off the premises, but the agency that had recommended him were fired, which cost them a lucrative line of income.

Make no mistake, when you're being interviewed, you are NOT the alpha in the room. The person in front of you, no matter how junior they may appear, has something you want - a job. You have NOTHING to offer them that they haven't seen seven times that day already. Alienate them, intimidate them, piss them off even slightly, and you can look forward to an interview somewhere else, if you're lucky.

Mind your body language, but make it open, friendly, and honest. I'm reliably informed that one of the main reasons I got my current job - for which I and the other shortlisted candidate were in all other respects equivalent - was that in the psychometric test and interview I did NOT give the impression that I was tailoring my answers to what I thought they wanted to hear.

Worst thing you can do on a CV is leave a gap... I've read enough of them and whenever there's a gap in employment history it shouts at me "LOOK AT ME! I'M HIDING SOMETHING"

The seriousness of the thing will depend on how long ago it was and what your experience is between now and then.
If I were you I'd put the absolute minimum information to fill in the gap

Lets face it, CVs are only ever used to weed out people you don't want to see and then as a basic starting point for conversation during the interview.

.. "He already knows you´ll earn more than he"

Um. No. I have never once been interviewed by someone who would have been more junior than me, and I've never, ever heard of that happening.

Unless your field is very specialised, the chances are that those doing the shortlisting (along with their day jobs) will at some point be staring with sinking heart at a massive pile of job applications.

A lot of them will be unsuitable, some will be very generic and half-hearted, often with little or no tailoring to the particular vacancy, and a few will be downright bizarre. Assuming we're talking about a large organisation, the chances are that those short listing will be skim-reading through each application looking to tick the boxes that are set out clearly in the person specification. If an application doesn't *demonstrate* (not merely assert) that they meet each of the essential criteria, it's going in the reject pile. If it does meet the essential criteria, then it's on to the desirable as the tie breaker if more than can reasonably be interviewed meet the essential.

If you want to impress the shortlisters, make their jobs easy. Make your application concise, clear, focused, and targeted *directly* at the person specification. That way, your application can be reviewed in double quick time, filed under 'possibles' or 'definites' for interview, and the shortlister can move on to the next one.

I'd love to say that I've pored over every last detail of every last application I've ever read for shortlisting purposes, but the truth is, I haven't. Nothing like. You've got two minutes to give me the evidence I need to make my recommendation, Application Form, and if I have to go looking or guessing or inferring, you're not getting your author an interview. And my patience and tolerance for spelling errors, sloppiness, folly, ignorance, stupidity and laziness is getting worse by the form....

I agree with Tiggy about being open and honest. For some odd reason, some job applicants seem to think that interviewers are a weird sub-species of human who are massively, massively gullible. Why else would people trot out such nonsense? I've never been shy about 'admitting' (if that's the right word) that I would have skills gaps, or would need more experience in a particular area - especially 'desirable' criteria. And anyone who straightforwardly admits that gets bonus points with me.

My favourite interview question, which I always use, is:
"Apart from a thorough induction, what other training, development and support do you think you'll need to be able to do this job really, really well?"

I like it because it tells me so much:
Does the candidate understand the job?
Do they understand its relation to their current skills and experience?
Are they being honest with me?

A quick look at your space, shows a gap that coincides with the gap in your CV.
It also shows that you are about 36 years of age. You need to convince yourself that you want the job that you are applying for and write your CV accordingly. Highlight the aspects of your career todate that are relevant to the job you are applying for.
It is not clear what it is you are trying to achieve and whether or not you are currently employed. Whether you are looking for advancing your present career in your present situation or looking to move.
If you are looking for a fresh start you need to understand why you want the change and spell this out in your application. Most of all it is important to demonstrate that you have something to offer.

>>"...my failed training regarded being a teacher - and this is what I am applying for now..."

If you were in the UK and did not disclose this previous training, it would be known about anyway as you'd have had funding and been given a reference number. Check the sitaution there. In the UK it would not be a good idea to try and hide this.

fill the gap with a gap

just squeeze a gap year into it

Thanks for all the replies, they are muchly appreciated.

(The lady of the Mice wants me to add specific details about my failing the training: part of the problem was disease-related; and secondly: I am certifiably nuts )

I never meant to hide the training from my CV. What I was curious about was how to convey the facts in a CV.

Otto Fish, special thanks for your interview question - it helped me sharpen my ideas.

Y.

sTwiggy @9: >>"where do you see yourself in a year's time"<<

I was asked that. Having been reading a bit, I'd thought a bit & was prepared - "That depends... perhaps ...where will you be then?" With that interviewer it seemed a reasonable response. It was maybe my second best job.

I totally missed that this was for a teaching post Yelbakk - in that case you can't gloss over it at all. You should say that you did the course but did not complete it on the cv and be prepared to explain why not in the best possible light if you get an interview and also explain what is different now.

I think that you're going to have to be honest. Dishonesty on cv leads to sacking and loss of professional registration.

I guess that you started an on the job teaching course, didn't complete it for a variety of reasons partly including health. Then some years later you went back into the same field - completed more training and since they have worked successfully as a teacher, and are now applying for a new teaching post.

I would put the bare minimum in the 'Previous employment history section'- that's the bit that they have to erad. Then I would introduce a 'personal history' section or somelike, at the end, that they could read if they were interested.

In that put: 1 That you did the training, enjoying it gained useful experience and skills in it. Unforunately due to a variety of issues you wern'et able to complete it.

2. The issues that stopped you are now in the past. The health issues are resolved and you now have an excellent sickness records, the personal issues are resolves..etc.

3.Because you enjoyed it so much you just didn't give up on teaching, but persisted with that ambition and returned to it when your issues were resolved. Emphasise that since then you have demonstrated that you are able to be a capable teacher.

You could possibly spin this as an advantage.

You have stuck at your ambition, you have overcome adversity, it would enable you to empathise with students in difficulties. You could even give an example of how you have been able to do that.

How about asking yourself the question. What happened in the gap ?
With this clear in your mind. Ask yourself the question. Why have I asked h2g2 for an answer to my dilemma ?
Surely you would be foolish do anything but tell the truth. It would seem that your career history is easily traced.