h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

That *is* a tricky distinction. Personally, I don't much care to be associated with my government in the vast majority of cases, but I can see how cultural outsiders would be able to (and perhaps be justified to) mentally clump us all together since they only see the 'Uncle Sam' arm. It is similar to the way I would see the issues in Chiapas had I not dug into it a little. It's interesting how an overabundance of information has seemed to make us more unable as individuals to be aware of things, but I suppose that's the idea. Bush and the Players are banking on black and white thinking. I think as recipients of the blessings (?) of technology, our generation needs to cultivate the personal responsibility to take the time to watch-dog what is going on in the world.

"It's interesting how an overabundance of information has seemed to make us more unable as individuals to be aware of things, but I suppose that's the idea."


The overabundance of information allows individuals to choose information to support their already accepted ideas. We're all guilty of that to some extent.


"...our generation needs to cultivate the personal responsibility to take the time to watch-dog what is going on in the world"


We need to cultivate open minds.

The problem is that in a sea of information, we are just to wrapped up in our own lives to have major problems with corporate media providing us with news quickies. And yes, most of us, myself included, are guilty of that.

Certainly, if by open-mind you mean a critically thinking mind that makes it a priority to call things as they are, and not an empty vessel that is a convenient receptacle for media garbage.

Seems we´re getting back into the "critizise the Bush administration and politics, and you insult americans" thing. Like it or not Bush at the moment IS America.

I for once will gladly help Apparition flogging that dead horse; perhaps we can even resurrect it, if we beat hard enouhg


TD.

here's a musical statement. listenned to it on NPR this morning.

"Price of Oil" Billy Bragg
http://onegoodmove.org/1gm/1gmarchive/000390.html

Apparition I am with you on the issue of civis v squaddies.

"Like it or not Bush at the moment IS America."

I wouldn't take kindly to you saying that Blair "is" Britain. Likewise, I'm sure many Americans would be offended to you insisting that Bush somehow represents the entire nation. Most of them, as I'm sure you've already pointed out, didn't even vote for him. How do you square that with the statement that he "is America"?

Well duh....

Its called public perception!

you know you equate something with its most obvious public manifestation e.g. back in the early 80's The Grantham grocers daugthter was the Conservative Party - by the same mechanism to large parts of the world Dudya = the USA

One way would be the fact that the president has a far greater degree of power than even Tony Blair, and we know how much people have been criticising his 'presidential' ways of late. In the UK, there is a much greater chance of the government being defeated on an issue; in the US, especially now that the Republicans control both houses, there is a far greater risk of politics becoming an issue of the whim of the president.

>politics becoming an issue of the whim of the president.<
Given the mental acuity of the chap, that's a really scary thought...

Phil

"How do you square that with the statement that he "is America"?"

His face and rhetoric are front stage at every meeting of world leaders as representative of the USA. There is no one else out there representing alternate views, who also claims to represent the USA. So as far as the world knows, Bush's views are those of the USA.

"There is no one else out there representing alternate views, who also claims to represent the USA. So as far as the world knows, Bush's views are those of the USA."

I've seen and heard from dozens of Americans giving "alternative views" to Bush including Al Gore. Do they not count as representing America?

"I've seen and heard from dozens of Americans giving "alternative views" to Bush including Al Gore. Do they not count as representing America?"


You've seen Al Gore? Please tell me when? Every once in a while I hear of him making a speach at a university here or there. Barely makes it to the news.

Yes, you're right. There are other voices out there: Chomsky, that former arms inspector to name a couple. They never make it to a summit of world leaders though.

>Seems we´re getting back into the "critizise the Bush administration and politics, and you insult americans" thing. Like it or not Bush at the moment IS America.<

I do not say much here as I do not want tobe put upon for viocing my opinion but I have to say something on this one. I have read in this and a few others how you Tmershi and others have said when some americans have taken issue with what you say about Bush or america you made it clear that when you make derogetory statements about them you are not talking about americans but about bush himself or american foriegn policy. You tell the americans who take issue that they should not be so sensitive. Now you turn around and say yes all those insulting things you have said can be taken to be said about all americans. That has to be the most bigoted statement I have ever heard or you just say the first thing that comes to mind.

"Now you turn around and say yes all those insulting things you have said can be taken to be said about all americans."


Bush is the public face of America to the rest of the world. He's also an idiot. I think we all should be more careful about "electing" our country's representatives.

I agree but if I am right bush recieved less then 40% of the populer vote and won the needed electives from the system americans use to win the election. That means that 60% did not vote for him. should they be associated with bush?

But what i was really responding to was TMershi's stateing for months how when he spoke of bush or america he was speaking of the goverment not individual americans critizing those americans who took issue with him. Now he comes out and says yes when I speak of bush or american policy I am talking about all americans. Surely neugen you can not justify that

*rolls eyes*

I believe the operative word here is 'perception.' I don't think it was ever implied that americans are as Bush does, just the simple fact that Bush is the face of America, just as Coke in most parts of the world *is* Cola. There are thousands of 'opposition' companies having varying degrees of success, but none of them come close to being the 'poster child' for cola drinks.

*ducks to avoid the tomatoes that are surely going to be lobbed at her due to her bad analogy*

"I agree but if I am right bush recieved less then 40% of the populer vote and won the needed electives from the system americans use to win the election. That means that 60% did not vote for him. should they be associated with bush?"


The rest of the world does not know that. Perhaps if the news headlines read "Bush represents 40% of the pople who actually bothered to vote" instead of "Bush has all time high approval rating", there may be a different perception.

And to Tmershi's issue: if an "elected" leader of a group is an idiot, then that image reflects on that group, along with anything he happens to say or do. It really falls back onto that group to find a new representative.

that was a really good point in your second paragraph Amoeba, on approval rating vs. election results.

Sounds brilliant! I wonder if we'll ever see it in NZ? Thanks for the link..