h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Toolman, no I don't like the drinking age thing either. That is why when I was a young buck stationed at Ft Drum (waaay upstate NY) I partied in Canada, you only had to be 19 to drink and the ladies in Kingston like US servicemene a lot more than some of the Canuks on this thread. Where/when has this been done before? Germany, Japan ringing any bells????
Abbi, non-us citizens serving in the US army do not get instant citizenship, but they do get help and I think it cuts down on the wait time a lot. I remember a couple of guys whose packet got priority when the war started.
Also you are right about the Shiites. We did them a huge deservice in 92, in fact we did the whole world a disservice by not pressing on towards what we did last year then. That was yet another of many many examples of a us president squandering a military victory for a political one. The easy out is almost always wrong in the long run. However was the removal of Saddam a proper begining of an apology??

You are also correct about Afghanistan. The power of the national government just about ends outside of Kabual. Right now the countryside is back to the void it had when the soviets left. Warlords are ruling by will and force of arms. The is a long row to hoe left there. Hopefully the US will commit the time, troops and money to finnish what they started.

Yes and each combatant claims to have "in the name of God" on each missile. Bur Blick some missiles are managed and others are not.
I believe all are despatched "in good faith" but it is the management of that faith that is the issue.

The Alliance weapons are managed by democratic process. The terrorist weapons are randomly used by undemocratic partisans. That is the key to understanding, and in my view, supporting the Alliance.

In nearly all wars I think both sides are wrong. Sending people to kill and to die isnt a good way of settling disputes.

It's legitimised murder. No doubt.
But it is an essential characteristic of humanity.
So is emotive illogical action.
In the starkest sense: kill or be killed.
That's why we are blessed with the hormone adrenaline:
fight or run.

"The power of the national government just about ends outside of Kabual. Right now the countryside is back to the void it had when the soviets left."

If Americans were capable of learning from history they'd realise that that is perfectly indicative that Afghanistan is just another Veitnam. At the time even the Americans admitted that after all the years they'd spent in Veitnam, all the billions, all the thousands of squandered lives, absolutely zero was achieved there.

Obviously Bush has wanted to 'distinguish' his reign with another Veitnam (or two). The real crime is that you let someone like Bush steal and keep the presidency of the USA.

When will you folks realise that The President is an office.
It is part of a DEMOCRATIC ADMINISTRATION for God's sake.

The President has to protect the USA. Whatever that takes the office does that function. There is nothing complicated.

The complications are in your heads.

What on earth do you mean by that, Oetzi? Do you mean that the president's rule is absolute? Or do you mean that the president is little more than a figurehead?

Either way, it doesn't absolve him of responsibility.

Empty
The Office of The President is the final arbitor.
It is also Commander in Chief of the military.
It has obligations.
Personalities do not challenge the precept.

What do you mean you don't understand.
Or do you just dislike the fact that it happens to be a republican in office, come on now Empty..

Surely you're not a partisan biggot..surely not..no...!

"Or do you just dislike the fact that it happens to be a republican in office,"

Not particularly, no. What I dislike is the fact that the current president is unelected, immoral and a mass murderer.

"The Office of The President is the final arbitor.
It is also Commander in Chief of the military."

Which only underscores the fact that he's ultimately responsible for all the atrocities committed on his watch. The buck stops with him.

<>

I *tried* to get elected president in 2003, but nobody printed any ballots with my name on them. Anyway, very few heads of state in the Middle East had to be elected in order to run things.
All they needed was for their fathers to heads of state. Oh, I just realized that the current U.S. president *does* have a father who was the head of state. silly me!

"unelected, immoral and a mass murderer"

Oh, don't be bloody ridiculous. Yes, the first may be true, but he certainly has morals: he's a born again Christian. Whether those morals are correct for a person that runs a secular country and is meant to separate church and state...well. That's up to the individual.

But where people get this "mass murderer" idea from...somewhere in the odd recesses of their brain? I don't know. He's certainly irresponsible, and unconscious of the rest of the world (but then he's a Republican Texan American, what else do you expect?), but he's not Pol Pot or Stalin.

Stop using overblown language. It devalues your argument.

Saturn

The USA is not regarded as a secular set of united states.
The believers and church goers stats are some of the highest.

Of course you get crazed despots on here. They are scattered all over the place. If you want rationality then try MSN. That's where most people have gone.

But MSN will not tolerate the flotsum and jetsum like the BBC does, so eventually they all come back. Not sure how long you've been here but I hope you at least hang around for a bit of "rock and roll" with these misfits.

There are misfits here?

Yeah App....about 95 deviants at the last count.
Don't worry the Feds have us all catalogued.

Saturnine, thank you for trying to interject a bit of reality into this thread. Empty Head was beging to go off the deep end over here. The 2000 election was a clusterf*$k (technical term) no doubt about it. The worst part was the fact that I lived up north, listened to Canadian rasio and had to hear canuks insulting my home town. I was an absentee voter so my ballat in the most hotly contested county in the country was tossed. The issue was setteled by the Supreme Court. It was not an unprecedented event in United States history. It was not even the first time a president has lost the popular vote and won the presidency. It was a poor election, however stolen is not the right word.

Anyone would have responded with the military after 9-11. There were really no other options. The people responsible for that event are less likely to negotiate than ES or Della.

It has been said by others but I will repeat it. Bush has an overdeveloped sense of morality. Him and his brother (my governor) both do. That is the problem. Things are black and white with them and there is no room for shade of gray. I take major issue with that.

Neither Afghanistan or Iraq is "another Vietnam" that tired ass phrase has been hauled out for every single firefight the US has been iin since 1975, guess what it has yet to be true.

ES please for the love of God tell me of one single bleeding Atrocity. I would love to hear something that the US has done that is 1/10 as bad as the people that you are defending.

also for the one or two of you that don't see me on two threads http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/brunel/A2191358

Take it easy Flip. I've requested a green slip.

"Anyone would have responded with the military after 9-11."

I agree. But I would have imposed it on Saudi Arabia. Not Afghanistan. And then I would have followed through and finished the work there, as opposed to leaving it all to other people to clean up the mess I created. Iraq was not a pressing concern. North Korea and Zimbawbe ARE.

I also possess a more objective look at the world (unlike Bush), and I recognise that terrorism is such a problem because it is not a black and white issue. It will exist whether or not you occupy a country. Therefore, when it comes to dealing with terrorism, I would have gone more down the "peace talks" route, and worked on establishing a better reputation for the United States, rather than isolating and oppressing the parts of the world that don't agree.

Bush was the worst possible President to be in office when it happened.

"The worst part was the fact that I lived up north, listened to Canadian rasio and had to hear canuks insulting my home town."

Americans started (and still continues) with the anti-Canadian s**t. You can hardly expect them not to respond when they get the chance.

"Neither Afghanistan or Iraq is "another Vietnam" that tired ass phrase has been hauled out for every single firefight the US has been iin since 1975,"

In a few senses, they are. The focus on Vietnam was to stop the "domino" effect of communism via infiltrating a country under the mistaken opinion that democracy is the best way, and everyone wants it. Iraq is certainly a victim of that same misguidance, as is Afghanistan, but to a lesser extent. Right now, neither of the countries have benefited from American occupation (yes, the girls are back at school, but what's the point when they get raped on the way there...), and I don't think they ever will.

"Things are black and white with them and there is no room for shade of gray. I take major issue with that."


Me too !
Black and white thinking makes people ill or mean.
Sometimes both.

I saw Richard Pearle on Charlie Rose.
He said that Syria is is being eyed and pressured to conform and now they have the example the US set in Iraq to consider.
Scary.