h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Mr D, thanks for toning it down, but I'm not stirring either. I'm standing up in this community and pointing to a pattern of behaviour and saying "that's not ok here".

I appreciate what you are saying about fire with fire, but I came home tonight and saw a bunch of backlog where many people were engaging on topic with someone who was trolling and it was painful to watch, the trolling and people engaging with it as if it was ok conversation. I can't just ignore that and if speaking out is fighting fire with fire, then so be it.

I also appreciate the concerns about how this thread looks to outsiders, but I think as long as we have diverse threads in Ask, and on the FP it's not such a worry. All online communities have this stuff go on. Have to say though that my reading of some of the controversial threads was one of the main reasons I joined originaly

well, Oxy may be a troll or may not. The question in the OP is still valid, even without all the stuff around it.

Trolling is defined as posting something to a messageboard that is deliberately designed to provoke a heated reaction. If we classify someone as a troll, then by logic their questions should also be placed under scrutiny.

Was it acceptable to Justin The Preacher to continually post questions about the irrationality of refusing to accept God? Was it acceptable for Hoov to instigate interrogation and hounding of religious zealots? Was it acceptable for Quincy to pass off unfounded medical advice? Was it acceptable for LW (god rest his soul) to tell us what mood he was in four thousand times every day?

On a messageboard, where the only identity of a person we have is through the words that they post, then your identity is very much inextricably tied up with what you say. I don't think it's valid to pronounce someone a trouble-maker and then say they're making rational and valid points.

B

I haven't actually been one of those who has said Oxy is a troll or not. And I know about internet trolling, I used to mod somewhere that at its worst was much worse than some of the stuff I've seen around this place.

But anyway. Time will tell I think.

Wow.

Juat, wow. And not in a good way.

I have just yikesed every post accusing Oxygen of being fkf on the basis that those accusations should be made to the Mods and CEs not in the thread where they smack of mob action and bullying **and are therefore against the house rules**.

If I were a CE I would suspend this thread for a few hours. Good job I'm not, then. The reason I would suspend it is because of the worklaod it is causing the Mods and CEs. Which leads me to my next post.

People, if you want to put your into the meachanics of how moderation works, email or contact me.

I am completing the redsign of the moderation tools over the weekend. This means I will define *the steps that the volunteers go through* to review, pass, fail or modify content, *not* the criteria they will use.

I will also define audit trails and what happens to content they modify, the subject of a similar debate on s2g2 on Noesis.

Oxygen, I would value your contribution to that redesign work. You care, you raise some important points. I would like your input even if all you do is read a document that summarises what I've designed and pass me your comments.

If you - or indeed anyone - would be willing to contribute to that work, please either leave a message on my personal space and we can conduct the conversation there withouth email addresses, or email Z at h2g2comunityconsortium at gmail dot com and he will forward the email to me.

I now return you to your original programming.

B

redsign = redesign

Are you going to yikes your own post then Ben? Because either it's ok to say that this researcher is that one, or it's not.

I think calling what any of us have done an accusation is ott. From what I recall Peanut said she thought that this researcher was that one. How is that an accusation?

I'm curious to know what you think the community should do about trolls that open new accounts and troll. I'm not talking about this situation, but in general.

At no time have I ever subscribed to the idea that only the CEs and mods have responsibility for issues in the community.

I object again to being called part of a mob. I'm not more part of a mob than Z and Mr D are for agreeing with each other.


I haven't seen who you've yikesed. Your post comes across as lots of accusation without backing up

I would appreciate confirmation from Ben, Z and Mr D that they will not be involved in any way with the moderation process from the posts that Ben has just yikesed.

Or any other mods who've expressed opinions in this thread on the issue of trolling or the issue of researchers opening new accounts and continuing with disruptive behaviour.

I can confirm that.

>> I'm curious to know what you think the community should do about trolls that open new accounts and troll. I'm not talking about this situation, but in general.

Me too.

Kea, you know that who mods what is not something that is discussable on the site.

You also know that we have a policy whereby volunteers do not deal with situations involving other researchers with whom they have "history" either as friends or as foes.

Hang on, does this mean I need to go yikes the post entry where Dmitri opined that Socky Socky Joy Joy was my sock puppet? I never officially said so anywhere...

If being accused of being fkf is considered a bad thing, that must surely be because fkf is a troll.

I think a time out on this thread is a good idea. Sadly its showing exactly why trolls can cause such disruption and anger on all sides.

>>> You also know that we have a policy whereby volunteers do not deal with situations involving other researchers with whom they have "history" either as friends or as foes.

That was what I confirmed in my post.

Thanks Z

>>
You also know that we have a policy whereby volunteers do not deal with situations involving other researchers with whom they have "history" either as friends or as foes.
<<

Yes, but that's not the situation I was asking about. I was saying that it's not appropriate for any mod who's already expressed a strong opinion about the issues in this thread to be involved in decisions about these yikesed posts (won't even get into what will happen if they have to go to the CEs, given how many CEs have already posted here too).



>>Kea, you know that who mods what is not something that is discussable on the site.


True, but I hadn't seen it as being about who doesn't mod something. And I don't think you can have it both ways. Either people aren't involved in moderating threads they're in, or they are. If it's the former then it's implicit who's not modding, so why not give the community (or me) some reassurance?

I can see you have a problem because the numbers of mods are so low, but that's one of the problems of having a publically name list of who is doing the modding.

The thing is kea, if the mods start confirming that they're not dealing with an issue it just creates a greater chance for someone to work out who is.

kea. No-one doubts you are interested and care very deeply indeed.

Will you review the redesign for the toolset this weekend? That is, without any doubt at all, the most constructive thing anyone can do regarding moderation on h2g2.

Once we have the redesigned toolset, THEN we can refine who does what, when; what is against the HR and what isn't; and when a muff is a hand warmer and when it's not.

Ben

>>The reason I would suspend it is because of the worklaod it is causing the Mods and CEs. Which leads me to my next post.

That needs an explanation I think. Maybe not now if people are busy, but I apart from the thread title thing I wouldn't have thought this thread was particularly time sucking (relative to threads historically). So if it's a technical thing it would be good to know, and if it's a low on numbers thing likewise. It's quite a change to the culture of the place to consider closing such a thread for a period of time.

>> if it's a technical thing it would be good to know

The technical side of it sucks with a suckitude on such a scale that I feel guilty having an evening off tonight to celebrate posting my dissertation.

Think how bad it could be.

Double that.

Then add sprinkles.

And double again.