A Conversation for Talking Point: Is There Ever Going to be Another World War?
It is possible!
Metro Started conversation Jun 21, 2001
The kind of people the Americans are putting in the white house makes World War III quite possible. The most powefull man on earth is an aspiring comedian, and may very well start a wolrd war just for a good laugh.
It is possible!
Vonce Posted Jun 21, 2001
Oh, he's no comedian...he's an idiot. He'll start a war not for a laugh, but because he won't know any better. Failing that, the fact that as governer of Texas, he was executing people at a record rate should say something about his personality, and the fact that he obviously has no problem with killing off people.
It is possible!
Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron Posted Jun 21, 2001
I hate to insert facts into this conversation, but the governor of Texas does not make decisions about the application of the death penalty. He does not have the power to commute a death sentence or order a pardon. All he can do is give a 30-day reprieve.
Of course, if he gave out chocolate covered gold, you'd accuse him of causing heavy metal poisoning and tooth decay.
It is possible!
Metro Posted Jun 22, 2001
The fact is that American political system is not producing first rate politicians and leaders anymore. Such leaders usually emerge in times of great urgency and need, which America feeding on its god given power and position in the world does not come across very often. The only thing which comes in abundance, politicaly that is, is political technicians who only need to know the amount of firepower which can be supplied at any given time around the world. No wonder, the two most prominent men in the new team are ex-military men, with established doctorines of the use of maximum available firepower. Another fact is that military has been a cornerstone of the American economy and given the background of the new administration, they are going to have their cake and eat it too. Yet another fact, is that the people around the world, considering the votes in Florida, are not sure Wheatear the democratic process is alive and intact in America. The supreme court ruling only refers to the time that America was young and brave and nothing else, which mind you, is the surest sign of decay. It is an irony that America is willing to spend billions of dollars keeping its military presence around the world, but not make sure that doubts sorrounding the votes of its people are dispelled properly. Unless, in the eye of the American government, the rest of the world has taken prcedence in priority over American people, the rest of the world should become increasingly conscious of the ways of the self-acclaimed leader of the new world order.
It is possible!
Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron Posted Jun 24, 2001
Since the election, all the counts condcuted by news orginazations have still shown Bush to be the winner in Florida. The Supreme Court just put a halt the nonsense. If the numbers don't agree with the will of the Florida voters, it's because Gore's supporters were to stupid to vote properly.
It is possible!
Metro Posted Jun 24, 2001
A stupid enemy makes the winner twice as much stupid. If the voters in Florida, a democratic stronghold, are willing to vote for the enemy just because their feelings are hurt over a Cuban child, the winner is bound to look much, much more stupid than those who lost their good sense and forgot that the same laws that returned the boy to his father are the ones that allows them to live in peace and prosperity in America. Florida was one spring the republicans should have refrained a drink from.
However, as far this kind of voting is concerned, it only highlights the general symptoms. Again, it is not this one or that one. It is the stage that is the White house, and that nowadays it is not host to great players, only those who are there to play out their childhood or their mother's dreams.
Please also let me to inform you that in many places around the world, unlike America, the news organizations are not the giver and takers of faith. The only chance there was to put things straight and clear once and for all, was to count the votes according to the wishes of the democrats. This should have gone on as far as possible and until each and every doubt is cleared. Of course we live in the days that America is only happy to be the greatest military power in the world. There was a time, that Americans were proud of the greatest democracy in the world, and what is democracy except one lonely vote. The American supreme court ruling has put an end to that dream once and for all. It can not be rolled back as can not be the time. So welcome to the club.
It is possible!
Vonce Posted Jun 25, 2001
America was never the greatest democracy in the world. It was never a democracy at all, it was a republic, and has been since the American Revolution. That is why America has the electoral college in the first place; the framers didn't trust the people, so they set up guards to keep the uneducated massess from destroying the government.
It is possible!
Metro Posted Jun 25, 2001
Exactly. Thank you for the reminder. Republic it was. And what does that make it now?
It is possible!
Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor Posted Jun 26, 2001
A republic. Personally I think that our president does not want to use neclear arms, otherwise why didnt he just order an attack on china when they captured our plane? In the immortal words of Einstein, I may not know how they will fight world war three, but I can tell you that world war four will be fought with sticks and stones!
It is possible!
Metro Posted Jun 27, 2001
Maybe the reason for not ordering an attack was that China is very well placed to retaliate and the SDI is not operational yet.
The spy plane over china was a small incident. Nobody will go to war for that. However, the very fact that you point to this incident as a possible start of a war, and that a nuclear one, shows the state of the average American mind. The fact is that Americans are made out to be so touchy. They are ready to fire all their bullets at the first fly that sits on their nose. That is the real danger. Actually America is not historically mature enough to enjoy the political prominence that it has been given after World War II. Considering the end of the cold war America must be relieved of its super power duties in clearly defined stages. That is the surest way to prevent a nuclear war.
As for what America is, it is still a republic. But republics come in many flavors. There are banana republic, chocolate republic, cocoanut republic and so on.
It is possible!
Earthman Posted Jun 27, 2001
Plus of course there are serious questions about whether it is possible to get SDI to work - detecting a small, fast moving target and destroying it with another small fast moving object is fiendishly difficult, and they haven't got anywhere near demonstrating they can do it.
Which is why there will be no WWIII soon, because the US don't like fighting wars against people who can shoot back in any way at all.
It is possible!
Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor Posted Jun 27, 2001
Have you seen "the day after" Those movies terrify me. I believe that our nuclear weapons should be locked down tight and take more than two hours to prep for launch. I do not belive in lessening the ammount of weaponry only an agreement to safegaurd the use of them. having only to push one button dosnt provide much time for a reaction, having to go though a long difficult sequence would cut down on the chances of somthing like that happening. I do not agree with nuclear war, but look how some wars have started in the past, one small tangle and a few more problems, soon they escelate (sorry for the spelling) to a major war (see WWI and II). I hope for my sake and my children to be that nothing like that ever happens, but what can I do, I have no control over nuclear warheads... or the button.
It is possible!
Metro Posted Jun 29, 2001
You do not have your fingers on the button? Please look again.
When the sake of yourself and your children is your only concern, you have placed your finger on the trigger and are ready to go. Start thinking about other children. That I think, is the safegaurd you are looking for.
Actually the main worry of the top dogs in the US military is that the ones responsible to fire a nuclear weapon will not do it at the last moment. The captain of the plane that dropped the bomb on Japan, did not know what it is like. Now he knows and so does everybody else. Of course that includes, the ones who knew what it is like and still sent out the planes over Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
It is possible!
Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor Posted Jul 2, 2001
My main concern IS my children and that is the reason I do NOT have my finger on the button, TRUST ME! If you have seen The Day After you know what I mean if not, see it and you will know why I do not believe that the answer is a nuclear war.
It is possible!
Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron Posted Jul 2, 2001
I don't think you should worry about a "The Day After" scenario. The US and Russia are the only two nations that could cause that sort of devistation throughout the world, or even a large area.
I really don't see us going to war against Russia. Without the ideological differnces of communism v. capitalism, they're not that important.
It is possible!
Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor Posted Jul 2, 2001
All it would take is one nation (namely the United States) launching its entire nuclear capabilities and we would have the Russians firing on us, and vice versa, and also everyone else shooting off everything they can... The main problem with safegaurding your system so it would take two hours to fire is that by the time you got the warning and were a quarter through preperation at the most, the missles would already have blown everything anyway... that,of corse, is what the sub marines are for... They are untouchable and can launch their weapons after preperation from underwater undetected...
It is possible!
Metro Posted Jul 2, 2001
I saw "The day after", when it came out. You can also check the pictures of the survivers and non-survivors of Hiroshima for a better view on the reality of a nuclear event! I hope nothing like that happens ever again. I do, I sincerely do.
However, can you give your opinion on why it actually did happen. We have only one case of it in the history. Should we go on, hypothesizing on the intentions of crazies like Sadam Hossein, and Osame Bin Ladin and the evil soviets, or study what actully DID happen. If this is a manifestation of the behavior of the animal that is the human kind, why not look at it for what it is worth. The circumstances which led to the nuclear weapon actually being utilised. What did it achieve? Why it was used in the first place? Are the circumstances which led to this shamefull act have a chance of materializing again?
Personally, I think, those who ordered the attack, had very much on their minds the American boys and girls who died in Pearl Harbor, and the various pacific islands. It was not a military undertaking. It was an act of revenge. Pure and simple. America has the power to be revengefull, and it has proven to be a very very bad looser. A very dangerous mix indeed.
For the sake of completeness, please let me say that I am quite aware of the crimes and atrocities of the Imperialist Japan in the far eastern Asia. Still, vaporizing innocent children of Japan can only be the fruit of minds sick with revenge.
It is possible!
Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron Posted Jul 2, 2001
Hiroshima and Nagasaki were both legitimate military targets. We had every right to attack them. Civilians get hurt in wars, but they're really not that important. They're collateral damage. What's important is that you defeat the enemy’s ability to wage war.
It is possible!
Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor Posted Jul 3, 2001
Metro, Pearl Harbor was not the reason for our use of the atomic bomb, nor the Pacific Islands, as we were very sucessful in that theatre. The reason for our use of the weapon was because there are many Japanese islands and the government of Japan had told everyone to defend Japan down to the smallest child. An allied invasion of Japan would have meant great losses on our part, and I am sorry if I seem like a bit of a biggot here, but better them than us! It was our only choice of ending the war quickly and efficiantly. I think the US has more than re-paid the debt of civilian deaths in the economic support given to Japan to help make it a world power. The past is the past however... Forgive and forget!
It is possible!
Metro Posted Jul 3, 2001
Oh dear. We are back at square one. I do not blame you though. That is the human nature. We should not be fooled by all this technology and wonderful ideas and beautiful words spoken all around us. We are still the savages, who by some friendly turn of a card in nature turned into WWW-wise animals.
Nonetheless, you should not forget the simple lesson of history, that no one nation will remain the most powerful, or dominant factor in the world forever. Maybe one small nation comes up with a weapon far more destructive and powerful than the nuclear weapon. Considering the might of America in conventional weapons, that weapon will find immediate legitimacy against American population and interests and what you have called ability to wage war. That will be the day, when you regret the words you have just spoken. You keep it up like this and that day will come. Of course that will be too late, at least for you, to look up the words that I have left up there for you, unless you've got your facts so strong, that you're going to take it like a man anyway, come rain or shine.
Pyrex, Two Bit, Japan was absolutely defeated by the time the nuclear device was used against them. Their pilots would hit American ships with their plane, only because there was no ammunition left to reload. In other words it was not a military threat in anyway in the context of world II. And as a rule, the ability to wage war will not be removed unless each child, man and woman is annihilated, if the desire to wage war was there in the first place. Vietnam is a fine example. What America did in Vietnam, was not short of the damage caused by many nuclear attacks. However, the desire to win was so strong that American hotheads had to leave eventually, acknowledging defeat. Of course the nuclear weapons of Russia and China had something to do with American decision, otherwise the ability to wage war by Vietnam would have been removed by the same methods employed in Japan. Sure, America would have done something to make amends. What is all that money good for anyway if not for that?
The use of nuclear weapon against Japan was an act of revenge. You can justify that in many more eloquent terms than what you have used. I am all for forgiving, but not forgetting. Forgive me, but I cannot forget what you are going to do to me or my child, if bad comes to worst. That would make me a savage with no memory.
There you go, we are back in jungle and we will remain here, as long as all the forgetting and forgiving has to be done by the rest of the world, so America can play god and devil at the same time.
Key: Complain about this post
It is possible!
- 1: Metro (Jun 21, 2001)
- 2: Vonce (Jun 21, 2001)
- 3: Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron (Jun 21, 2001)
- 4: Metro (Jun 22, 2001)
- 5: Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron (Jun 24, 2001)
- 6: Metro (Jun 24, 2001)
- 7: Vonce (Jun 25, 2001)
- 8: Metro (Jun 25, 2001)
- 9: Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor (Jun 26, 2001)
- 10: Metro (Jun 27, 2001)
- 11: Earthman (Jun 27, 2001)
- 12: Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor (Jun 27, 2001)
- 13: Metro (Jun 29, 2001)
- 14: Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor (Jul 2, 2001)
- 15: Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron (Jul 2, 2001)
- 16: Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor (Jul 2, 2001)
- 17: Metro (Jul 2, 2001)
- 18: Two Bit Trigger Pumping Moron (Jul 2, 2001)
- 19: Pyrex Muse of Unbreakable Space-age Wonder Glass, Student of Life, Keeper of the Seven Keys of Ventuslor (Jul 3, 2001)
- 20: Metro (Jul 3, 2001)
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