A Conversation for Ask h2g2

Monger

Post 1

Frankie Corridor

Blacksmith, Locksmith: result, lots of people called John Smith.
Stonemason, Freemason: result, lots (if slightly fewer) people called John Mason
Wheelwright, Playwright : result, lots of people called John Wright (and Cartwright, and lots of other -wrights.)
Ironmonger, Fishmonger: result...why hardly any John Mongers? (There's only two Mongers in my telephone directory, and that's in an area where there's a lot of iron- and fishmongers.)

Any ideas?


Monger

Post 2

Paul the Brake

They oviously didn't like the name monger so they changed it by Deed poll (or is it pole)


Monger

Post 3

Mustapha

I went to school with an Iremonger. He had a sister and there must have been Mr and Mrs Iremonger, so they must be out there... somewhere... lurking...


Monger

Post 4

sassy.saint

My ex manager was a monger so there are some of them out there. smiley - smiley


Monger

Post 5

Just zis Guy, you know? † Cyclist [A690572] :: At the 51st centile of ursine intelligence

Simple. Smith is an ancient trade, and therefore stretches back well inside the days before surnames, whenone was "John, Smith" - which became John Smith when surnames became necessary in order to tax people more effectively.

Ironmongery is a relatively recent trade by comparison, although there are a few Ironmongers out there (one of my primary school teachers was a Mrs Ironmonger). Tinkers, on the other hand, go back a long way. The cornish for tinker was "cheap-man" which became Chapman - and there are tens of thousands of us. Ditto Potter, Weaver and so on. But most villages had a smithy, and the Smith was proud of his trade (whereas many of the itinerants were not) so the smith would be more likely to take his trade as his surname.

Farmer, whilst not unknown, was too generic. And I suspect that somewhere or other there was an Ethelbert Dungshoveller, but he probably never married smiley - smiley.

So there you have it.

p.s: does anyone know if "smith" comes from "smite" ?


Monger

Post 6

Cheerful Dragon

My husband would tell you that you should never ask questions like that when I am around. Having consulted my trusty OED and Oxford book of Word Origins I can tell you that 'smite' comes from ancient North European (Scandinavian, German, Dutch) words for smear or pollute. Smith, on the other hand, comes from ancient North European words for craftsman or his tools (chisel, mattock). However, the root words from which smite and smith are derived look very similar to me, though I'm no expert. So I'm willing to bet that, if you traced back far enough, the words are related.


Monger

Post 7

Just zis Guy, you know? † Cyclist [A690572] :: At the 51st centile of ursine intelligence

In which case, I am very glad I *did* ask this question when you were around, as I actually did want to know the answer, and you just provided it smiley - smiley


Monger

Post 8

F F Churchton

What 42?


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