h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

what's wrong with next to the "New Conversation" button?

oh, and can you change the "view the post that this is a reply to" etc links to buttons? buttons look nicer...

You can't put a 'show latest' link next to the 'New Conversation' button, because you need one for each of the conversations in the 'other conversations' list, because we want to preserve the choice of what the user sees. There'd be no point switching to always showing the latest post, because sometimes that's not what you want (especially if you're a newcomer).

Okay, my idea is this:

We have TWO new buttons/links. One of them says "Jump to latest post in forum" and does so. The other says "Jump to your last post" and does so if you've posted in that forum and brings up an alert box saying "You haven't posted in this forum" if you haven't.

We can't do that (easily) in the thread view, but we'll do it from the list on your user page, so you can jump to your last post from there. We'll consider adding such a button on the forum thread list, but we might decide to do it differently, and maintain lists of which threads you've already read, so we can take you to the first post you *haven't* read. But this is something that'll take a lot of extra UI if it's to work properly, so it's not something to quickly hack together.

I've learnt patience.

Yes, and I posted something I didn't want to because of that!

This is good to see, after the initial shock were getting used to the new look, I know I am, and people are looking forward again.

I don't know if this is possible or viable but my idea is as follows:
Instead of just having a jump to latest 20/newest posts button the best thing to do would be to list all the groups of twenty at the top of the LHS coloumn. This would give a clear idea of the length of the forum, it would allow jumping to any block of 20 desired (so good for new users) and it could encorporate a 'new' symbol on the blocks that you havent visited yet. Much more useful than just a newest posts function.

And can I say that there is a welth of brains out here ready to give ideas and suggestions about H2G2 (as evident in the above [and no doubt below] forum). We all have an interest in this succeeding and were cirtainly not against you, please talk to us. There is a nice little window at the top of each page that could be used to link to a questionaire we fill in to help you with improvements.
Please talk to us.

Cheers, Nick

Er, Marvin, I don't blame you for hating humanity, but when you respond to something with this new format, please make it the latest post of the forum.

Why, shame on you, Jedi! Don't you know we MUST now always click on the "go to the posting that this is a reply to" (or whatever) link just to be sure that what we're reading is in fact a reply to the item above it? Be ashamed of your complacency!

With the best will in the world, I don't think forums should be arranged for the benefit of newcomers. This is like having to repeat your conversation in detail every time someone else comes into the pub. Why not put the onus on the newcomer to find out what's being talked about, and not interrupt the flow of those who started it?

What I propose is that every time the forum loads, it's only the last 20 posts that you see. A "View Older Posts" button takes you to the top of the whole forum, from where you can scroll through as you used to. That way the regulars don't get interrupted, and a newbie can choose to wait on a download, and read as much or as little of what went before as they like.

It's been my experience that most people don't read back anyway, and just dive in to a conversation. Sometimes it's annoying, but often it keeps things fresh.

Looks good in a forum post.

I can't find the right place to put this message..... on my home page it said I had a reply to something in this conversation posted 5 days ago. I looked, and after paging through about 20 screens I found about ten items posted 5 days ago... how am I supposed to know which one is the reply to the one I posted... and what was it that I posted in the first place. I could click on the "goto message that this is a reply to" (or what ever it says) link... but I might have to click on them all before I find it... and in anycase it might be that no one was replying specifically to me, but they were just hanging off my thread because (like me) they were unable to find the place where they should be. In short, the current forum system is crap. Why was it changed? If it was to be modified why not make the mods to it that were promised (like the one where you can delete message if you change your mind) instead of making changes that NOBODY WANTS!

Moose,

h2g2 uses conversational-style forums. When your home page has the following indication next to a forum entry:

(6 Days ago, Last reply 9 Minutes ago)

that means that the last time you made a post in this thread was 6 days ago, and the most recent posting on that thread was 9 minutes ago.

This does not mean that the post was a direct reply to your earlier posting, but indicates how recently the conversation has been added to.

I happen to very much like the conversational style of threads. I want to follow the entire conversation. When the next update includes the forum refinements to jump to last page of posts and your last post, we'll have a very good forum structure.

As to why these changes were made, this has been discussed exhaustively here (performance, speed, compatibility issues).

And if you don't like it, you can appeal to a higher authority!

Though you might not appeal to DNA as much as you might think ...

You mention that when the next update is done it should include the ability to jump to you own last posting and to the last 20 postings. Very sensible and what I believe we have all be screaming for. Is this wishful thinking or is there somewhere in the above thread any mention that this is likely to happen?

I once read that to find information one should be able to reach it with a maximum of three clicks of the mouse and within 20 to 30 second or the first click.

I now find it so slow on this sight that the last time I gave up trying to get to the last posting on this subject - 4 days ago. It's just taken 8 clicks of the mouse button and about 5 minutes to get to it. If you do have any inside information about a possible update I'd like to know. If they do sort it out then I'd join in more often. As it is I can't afford the time!

If any H2G2 staff read this I'd also like to know if the number of hits on this site has gone up or down since the last update that prompted 150+ comments on "Navigating Forums Now Harder".

Couple of points, Fez, although I'm not a staff member: 1. regarding 8 clicks to get here... As a workaround until the update is done, you can add &latest=1 to the thread address and jump to the last 20 posts. For example, for this thread: http://www.h2g2.com/F615?thread=56379&latest=1 You can even use this as a link on your page. For example, if there's a long thread that you visit regularly, you can link to the last page by doing the following in GuideML (can't use the ampersand so change to ?) Current Navigating Forums now harder 2. For official response on the amount of posting since the site update see Jim's comment at: http://www.h2g2.com/F615?thread=56379&post=446085 and his follow-up three posts later. 3. There was additional slow-down this week -- I heard due to some piece of equipment blowing up or something (server, scsii controller, I don't know) that they had to work around. 4. Site traffic has been high as has the number of newcomers to the site the past month or two. 5. Regarding the update. I've read most of the threads in this feedback forum and while I cannot speak for the powers, my reading of what they have said in this forum includes the following (not just wishful thinking, but actual responses gleaned from Jim and others): -- There will be an upgrade. They have been working on it and testing configurations... they seem to be well past the drawing board and into the testing process. -- No one can/will say when this will occur, yet. (I think they want to avoid vaporware announcements). -- the update WILL include a jump to the last page of posts button. -- it is likely that there will be a jump to the last page of posts button next to each thread on the left side of the forum page -- it is likely that there will be a jump to the last posting you made link on your home page with each forum item. (nice one!) -- it is possible that there may be some user configurability in the forum look -- there may be other buttons/ shortcuts/ UI changes. Hope this helps. Redbeard

It sounds like that lot would address most of the current dissatisfaction. But can we have it REALLY SOON please? I find the current system so frustrating I've hardly been on recently. And most of the forums I've been posting to have tailed off drastically since the "upgrade", so I don't think I'm alone.

Well apparently total postings are up - it seems that there are now more postings, but they're spread out over more forums...

The features that are appearing in the next release (scheduled for next week) are:

1: All links to forum conversations will have an extra link to take you to the latest block of posts. So you have a choice what you read.
2: The 'Most Recent Forum Posts' list on your home page will have *3* links. One to the start of the thread (as before), one to the last posting you made (so you'll be able to read any specific replies), and one to take you to the latest block of posts.
3: In the left hand frame with the forum view we're adding 'Move to earliest' and 'Move to latest' buttons to the current conversation.
4: Also for the current conversation, we're adding a visual representation of the size of the conversation, which allows you to go to any page of posts with one click.
5: Each of the 'Other conversations' below the current conversation will have a 'Show latest' link added, again giving you the choice of reading the whole conversation or just the newest block.

We think that these additions address all of the navigation issues that people are finding with the forums.

Oh, dat's GREET!