h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I think that I also am a sit on the fence type of person aswell, but I believe that we are just freaks of nature. We were created when singled celled organisms decided that their life was a little meaningless and decided to grow another couple of cells for fun. We evolved out of water and then out of trees. Here we are today, still freaks of nature, just a bit bgger. I'm not an atheust (or however you spell it), I just believe in something other than an all powerful being.

I f you ask me some people haven't made it past the single celled being yet

I think I would like to believe that there was something more powerful out there but the humanist in me says that we create our own destiny. Also, the only real driving force behind life is procreation.

I was passively reading and thought I'd passively put in my two cents. From a mormon's perspective this is the response to your statement: your view is short sighted. Yes, there is suffering on Earth. But that's the whole point. If you can get through life DESPITE the suffering then you will be rewarded in the end. This is, however, not the suffering that Jesus died for. After this life, we will be punished of our sins THROUGH suffering, and Jesus made it possible to repent of those sins through his death. Just thought you'd like to know.

OK but the point I was trying to make is that "god" is not responsible for the suffering on Earth. The suffering is caused by man (even if it is sometimes "in the name of God" - like religious opression (sp) ) and whether you believe in god or not, ultimately the resposibility lies with the person involved, not god.

If we are to believe what you say is true, then you are basically saying the same thing. That the person who has caused the suffering will be the one punished for it. So the person is to blame, not god.

Er, did I make that clear? Very hard to do on h2g2 sometimes.

Yes, you're clear. It IS hard to make yourself clear on h2g2, though, isn't it?

"And has anyone else noticed the link between the hype of the millenium bug and the last turn of the century craze where the end of the world was about to happen. That gave rise to all kinds of interesting things like Jehovahs Witnesses, Mormons and Plymouth Bretheren."

Actually, your timing is off for Mormons. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints rose in the 1820s and was officially organized in 1830. The Mormons do recognize that we are in endtime in the Christian sense, but millennial fervor did not drive early conversions--as can easily be seen by holographic writings of early converts.

Rather, early Mormons were attracted outwardly by:
(1) the notion of America playing a divine role as a land of promise
(2) the Book of Mormon as scripture set in America
(3) the charisma of the founder, Joseph Smith.

On a personal level, most claimed as happens today, that they received a witness of the Spirit. Since religious manifestations are a personal matter whose epistemology could be argued "till the cows come home", I won't try to explicate more deeply.

As for millennialist beliefs among Mormons, yes, they do believe that these are the "last days", but there is no timetable for the Second Coming. Smith was told in a revelation that should he reach the age of 84 (I think) that he would see Christ's return in glory (which is differentiated from other visitations of the Savior to Smith on various occasions). The condition (Smith attaining an advanced age) was not met and Christ, of course, has not returned in glory.

Most Mormons nowadays I believe are pragmatic about the Second Coming -- they look forward to it, some in their lifetimes, but most are simply concerned with striving to live good lives in the here and now.