h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Its been done before on h2g2. But I just got into this with a few other peeps and though'd I'd bring it up here and see what people think.

Is it okay to smoke in public?
Is it an infringment on the smokers rights to stop them?
Is it an infringment on the non-smokers rights to make them suffer it?

unsubscribes now, I remember what happened last time

I'll probably unsubscribe soon too as my house has been almost burned down a few times by a smoker so I'm a little biased, but I have to ask this related question:

Is it okay to urinate in a public swimming pool?
Does urinating in a public swimming pool infringe other swimmer's rights?
Does evicting the urinator from the pool infringe his rights?



Actually, on rereading, it doesn't really have to be a joke. There's a public health issue in both the smoking question and the urination question.

hmm. maybe I'll stick around for a bit.

*doesn't.
I'll smoke in public, and I do.
Can people who drive cars stop pumping their polution in my direction.

Hmmm...

Define public.

How I react to other people smoking is very different if I'm:

outside vs inside
at a restaurant vs a school

things like that.

Personally, I think that yes, smokers have a right to smoke.

But, I also have the right to breathe without having an asthma attack.

At times, these rights conflict. There are environments and situations in which I would consider my right to breathe to supercede the smoker's right to smoke. And there are other environments and situations in which I would consider the smoker's rights as superceding mine.

It's not a black or white.

I wouldn't smoke say, waiting outside a school to pick up my child (if I had a child), or in a non smoking area in a resturant.
A lot of resturants here (UK) have smoking sections or are all smoking; this is from 'popular' demand, if there was more demand then they would be all non s smoking areas; we have two pubs near here for example that are non smoking, needless to say I don't go to them

~~blissfully unaware that there was a "last time"~~


When people can smoke in public and assure that I don't have to breathe their smoke because they keep it *all* inside *their* lungs, then I'm all for letting them smoke in public.

Until that day, I'd appreciate it if they didn't smoke around me, indoors, outdoors or anywhere else, private or public, because I really don't enjoy the asmatic attacks I get from second hand smoke.


Thank-you very much.

Here's how it works in my town:

http://www.gov.edmonton.ab.ca/smokingbylaw/

Similar laws are happening in neighbouring municipalities.

'Do you mind if I smoke?' 'That depends - do you mind if I fart?"

Nuff said.

"'Do you mind if I smoke?' 'That depends - do you mind if I fart?'"

Steve Martin, isn't it? (We need to be rigourous with our sources.)

* sparks next cigarette - then holds lighter next to Gosho's bum *


Off you go sunshine...

But seriously, what about the peeing in the pool analogy? I'm sure everybody thinks "that's just disgusting", but that's what a lot (the majority in my part of the world, I suspect) think about smoking.

Yes you're right. Seriously, I would never dream of smoking in an environment where smoking was restricted for some reason - aeroplane, cinema, non smoking section of restaurant or bar, a non-smokers home. To smoke there would be just plain rude.

On the other hand, stopping me smoking somewhere where I am allowed to smoke, or somewhere where I am not causing any fuss or bother to any other person is guaranteed method of p*ssing me off very severely and very fast!

i think smokers have a right to smoke in public if they are in an area that is not otherwise restricted. when i was a smoker i smoked in public areas, and i was respectful of non-smoking areas. even if i was in an unrestricted area, i wouldn't usually have a cigarette if i didn't see at least one other person smoking, or evidence of someone having smoked there in the past (butts on the ground, ashtrays, etc.).

as far as respecting the rights of non-smokers to breathe smoke-free air, this is my take: if a smoker is in a non-smoking area and wishes to have a cigarette, he is free to remove himself to an area that is unrestricted. likewise, if a non-smoker is in an unrestricted area and is bothered by the smoke of others around him, he is free to remove himself to a non-smoking area. it's a two way street.

i don't think the swimming pool analogy is strictly accurate. a swimming pool is a confined area, and there is no such thing as a peeing section of a pool . an ocean, on the other hand, is a perfectly acceptable place to relieve yourself if the need strikes. swimmer beware.

as far as respecting the rights of non-smokers to breathe smoke-free air, this is my take: if a smoker is in a non-smoking area and wishes to have a cigarette, he is free to remove himself to an area that is unrestricted. likewise, if a non-smoker is in an unrestricted area and is bothered by the smoke of others around him, he is free to remove himself to a non-smoking area. it's a two way street

Au contraire.

I was once in an open air resturaunt in Edinburgh... obviously you can't really regulate smoking there, or even have sections. Well, I don't smoke, but the people sitting up wind of me did. And I couldn't very well remove myself and so asked them very kindly to put out their cigarettes as I was nearly choking to death.

Which they did with a smile, so all was good.

A pub or a resturant is an enclosed enviroment, - people with inflamatory bowel disaese, and asthma often find that smoke drifts, so that they cannot even go into pubs even if there are non smoking areas.

No one wants to ba party pooper so very few people will say "actually i do mind if you smoke, I will breath it and get really bad diarreaha for the next two weeks"

Personally I don't have a problem with smokers, as i have said elsewhere.. but I think that my right to go to a pub with my friends who can't at the moment because they can't tolerate the smoke outweights their right to smoke.

There's a little joke around here which inspired my analogy: having a no smoking section in a restaurant is like having a no peeing section in a swimming pool.

Yes, a swimming pool is a confined place; but (as Z just posted) so is a restaurant, a hotel room, an office, etc.

I really don't mean to be taking the position of the strident anti-smoker. I'm really just trying to clarify the issue for myself. As a non-smoker I'm fortunate in living in a jurisdiction where smoking is pretty much absent from indoor public spaces so it really isn't an issue here.

Is the real question here "where in public places should smoking be legally allowed?" rather than "is it okay to smoke in public?" One could argue that its okay to smoke in public places in which it is legal to smoke.

Well this 40 a day man is quite prepared to move seats, put my cigarette out (well maybe not always), do what ever I can to redirect the plumes of breathed out smoke so as not to injure those who cannot tolerate cigarette smoke. This is not something special, this is just being polite.

Now will excuse me a moment, I can't find my lighter!

Removing myself from an unrestricted area to avoid smoke means that the *only* places I go would be safe to go have to be non-smoking places.

However, simply sitting in the non-smoking section of a restaurant doesn't mean that the smoke automatically stops at the little half wall between smoking and non-smoking areas. It goes everywhere. There have been many times after eating in a non-smoking section that my clothes reeked of smoke because of the smoke drifting over from the smoking area.


As far as open areas are concerned, rather than cause a problem, I usually just leave... unless I *need* to be there for some reason, then I just put up with it, or try to stay upwind of the smoker (doesn't work too well if I'm standing in line for something), and hope I don't have too bad of a reaction.

>>>Is the real question here "where in public places should smoking be legally allowed?" rather than "is it okay to smoke in public?" One could argue that its okay to smoke in public places in which it is legal to smoke<<<

Hmmm... Schools, hospitals, public buildings in general, the workplace. Smoking should not be permitted.

Commercial premises. Leave that to market forces. If the proprietor thinks that they can make more money by p*ssing off the 70%+ of people who don't smoke by allowing smoking in their establishment, then they should be allowed to do so.