h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Hi Bx4

Garrard – I have my own Garrard tale; I was given a plinth mounted deck sometime at the end of the sixties (by an upgrader). I can’t remember the model number (though it was more for the consumer market than for equipping broadcast studios). I looked for it recently alas it was lost. I’d subsequently upgraded myself by cutting a deal with another for a belt driven Technics (by then belts were ‘in’; idle wheels were ‘out’). Also there was a proper lid with hinges which held more appeal than Garrard’s unbranded smoked plastic ‘blob’.

Hearing – I have sympathy with your teacher (couldn’t afford decent gear until hearing had faded) and more importantly for yourself having to wear hearing aids. My hearing is rubbish and I’m sure I annoy SO and other humans with the volume setting I need to set for (my) comfortable listening. Most are too polite to say anything to my face! My objective with my current 1959 deck project is not hi-fi instead a balancing of components, as far as reasonably possible, so as to try to get the best out of everything.

‘Reel to reel tapes’ – For me these are another lost archive.

‘Labour MPs or MSPs have [not] crossed the aisle’ – Good point. That said they have been divisible into Blairite and Brownite camps?

‘The Labour [Westminster] vote has held up so far’ – I recall the rough rule of thumb that Scotland votes SNP for Holyrood and Labour for the other place?

‘Jim 'Fear of the Egg' Murphy’ – I guess he’ll decide on whether to leave Westminster dependent upon his success in Labour Top Dog election in their Scottish ‘branch office’? Actually isn’t every part of the UK a ‘branch office’ where UK national parties are concerned? Egging – I’d have liked to have seen a few [dozen] more. It doesn’t seem fair that Jim had to carry the load for the whole political class.

Computers – I’m sure we will overcome unseen hard drives and blank screens!

bs

PS As an aside; without access to Linux level adblock; I'm now being annoyed in spades. Creepy advertising that thinks it can appeal - what a turn off.

hi rg

Somewhat busy preparing for a symposium which I'll be at all this week so reply may be a bit terse.

>> idle wheels were ‘out’...Garrard’s unbranded smoked plastic ‘blob’.<<

I think the idle wheel only worked with a heavy platter like the Garrard. quite uncommon afaik. My Garrard had no. I bought it naked without a plinth which I had to build. No tonearm either.

>>hearing aids<<

My hearing loss is largely at higher frequencies. Fortunately my hearing aids provide an extended bandwidth so I can hear a wider range of frequencies than before so I'm hearing sounds (including musical ones)I haven't heard in years. Also useful is that they are adapted to pick up Bluetooth signals so I can listen to my iPod through them.

>>Blairite and Brownite camps<<

While a significant number of the Nulabour nomenklatura and Westminster were Scottish I don't think NuLabour featured much at Edinburgh. Blairites and Brownites seem to have faded into history somewhat with the seizing of power by Millipede II.

>>Scotland votes SNP for Holyrood and Labour for the other place<<

That has been the historical pattern but post referendum the Scottish electorate seems to be falling out of love with Labour.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/oct/30/scottish-labour-snp-general-election-poll

Of course opinin polls are always of doubtful worth but there is also a reported decline in labour membership and an upsurge in SNP membership.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/scottish-politics/revealed-just-how-many-members-does-labour-really-have-in-scotland.25814760

So if its a genuine and sustainable then the results from Scotland in 2016 might prove interesting. SNP as 'powerbrokers' perhaps:

http://www.newsweek.com/2014/11/21/interview-alex-salmond-plots-his-next-moves-against-british-state-283751.html

...though I'm not holding my breath.

>>‘Jim 'Fear of the Egg' Murphy’ – I guess he’ll decide on whether to leave Westminster dependent upon his success in Labour Top Dog election in their Scottish ‘branch office’?<<

Well , post Millipede II, his political career is on the wane at Westminster so becoming Scottish Labour's 'Líder Máximo' might be an attempt to reverse this.

Of course becoming leader does not guarantee he will become an MSP as Johan Lamont was elected from the party list so there will not be a by-election. Presumably some Labour loyalist constituency MP will be persuaded to fall on his sword...

>> UK national parties<<

Don't the mostly have a head office in the Great Wen?

>>fair<<

Afaik nobody but Jim was 'egged' in the whole campaign.That may say something about him...

bs

Hi Bx4

Egging – Oh the irony… http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30086495 “demonstrators carried banners reading "down with Zeman" and "we do not want to be a Russian colony"…As the president unveiled a plaque to the students involved in the 1989 protest, he was booed, jeered and pelted with eggs…Though Mr Zeman appears not to have been hit, German President Joachim Gauck was struck during the attack…". Egging is only OK provided it happens to a politician we disagree with; least wise that’s how it seems some react to it. I’m more for sharing – Egg the lot.

Plinth – This can be anything… http://www.theanalogdept.com/anthony_hind.htm My observation here on idle wheels is that my 55+ and 45+ year examples still work and appear steady enough to my ear (they even look good under a strobe light) whereas the belt drive Technics is, it often seems, just starting to slip and a replacement needs to be sourced. ‘Out of service’ is no good (and forget about keeping spares as they deteriorate with time). I note that some ‘audiophiles’ online appear to favour belts, even over direct drive, because they say there has to be a degree of separation between motor and turntable. Good for them.

“…Blairites and Brownites seem to have faded into history somewhat with the seizing of power by Millipede II ...” – I had thought Miliband elected more democratically than the Brown man (now there was a candidate for a ‘seize power’ jibe)? The history Blairites ‘faded into’ appears to be recent… http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art/39405/It%E2%80%99s+the+night+of+the+living+Ed+as+Blairite+rebels+chicken+out as in November 2014? That said imo “Labour has committed itself to austerity and is pandering to racism” was the stand out quote in the linked article.

Scotland – The referendum showed the apparent power of opinion polls bringing forth the pledge which the SNP rubbished at the time only to rely on as soon as their cause was lost. They foolishly appear to lean on it in much the same way as those expecting a poll on the constitution treaty or its successor following the 2005 GE? Didn’t they realise all bets were off once the results were in? To be right on this they only needed to listen to themselves. Could the smart thing to have done was to have loudly and graciously acknowledged the pledge at the time whilst stating how pleased they'd be to work with Miliband on delivering it should Scotland vote 'No'?

Powerbrokers – It is difficult to imagine how the English electorate would react to an SNP acting like Clegg in 2010 in choosing the PM! That said the SNP have rather shot their own fox by declaring for Labour in any hung parliament (by declaring against supporting The Evil Tories). Nice piece of negotiation that. What are the SNP going to do next – vote with the Tories to bring down a Labour government?

Labour in Scotland – (Membership numbers noted) do you see foresee a tendency toward a ‘one party’ Scotland? Will even the 55% who voted against the SNP proposition on September 18 be persuaded to vote SNP in May 2015? Clearly the Scottish electorate already won't support the aforementioned Tories and their stooges. Who’s left to vote for when the only certainty is a dislike for every Unionist? Time to paint the town yellow?

I hope the symposium goes (or went?) well!

bs

hi rg

>>pelted<<

In the egging of Murphy pelting seems to have been singularly ineffective according to the pro-Union, pro-Labour pro-Murphy local equivalent of the Daily Mirror:

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/crime/indy-thug-said-egged-jim-4169121


Murphy true to the spirit of Project Fear claimed a 'Yes' conspiracy...

>> Egging is only OK provided it happens to a politician we disagree with; least wise that’s how it seems some react to it.<<

Though in Murphy's case it might be his singularly unattractive personality and tendency to avoid awkward questions from those who disagree with him:

http://wingsoverscotland.com/losing-the-rag/

But I suppose it brought his 'Shouting at old ladies in shopping centres Tour' to an end..

>>egg them all<<

Indeed but the odious Murphy was the only one egged during the referendum campaign....

>>Plinth – This can be anything<<

Indeed mine was made of chipboard though I once knew a man who embedded his 301 in a concrete plinth to ostensibly minimise the effect of vibration. Sadly his passion was for using his equipment to demonstrate in stereo the sound of railway trains pssing through stations and such like.

>>wheels<<
The 301 has we dial that let you ajust the speed to compensate for wear I don't know if belt driven decks have an equivalent.

>>'audiophiles'<<

A strange breed - the railway man was one such. Like Marshall Mcluhan they seem to believe 'the medium is the message'

>>recent<<

2010 is recent imho though NUlabour may persist in the undergrowth despite the September 2010 pronouncement of Millipede II:


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/8026708/Ed-Miliband-New-Labour-is-


However for one Blairite Jim 'Flee the Egg' Murphy the battle with the Brownites is not over:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2817386/Scots-Labour-runner-Jim-Murphy-fuels-campaign-flop-storm.html


>>Brown<<

Apparently like Darling he will stand down at the next election:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30167158

>>Scotland – The referendum showed the apparent power of opinion polls bringing forth the pledge which the SNP rubbished at the time only to rely on as soon as their cause was lost.<<

I think the SNP are relying on the Unionists to break there promise to deliver 'Home Rule for Scotland'.

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/09/brown-takes-charge-cameron-backs-his-plan-scottish-home-rule

>>Didn’t they realise all bets were off once the results were in? To be right on this they only needed to listen to themselves. Could the smart thing to have done was to have loudly and graciously acknowledged the pledge at the time whilst stating how pleased they'd be to work with Miliband on delivering it should Scotland vote 'No'? <<

I suspect as in 2011 with regard to the Lisbon Treaty it will turn out that 'a pledge is not a promise' and what will be delivered will not be Home Rule:

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/editorials/scotland-at-the-ready-the-snp-could-force-another-referendum-very-soon-9862673.html

>>Powerbrokers – It is difficult to imagine how the English electorate would react to an SNP acting like Clegg in 2010 in choosing the PM! That said the SNP have rather shot their own fox by declaring for Labour in any hung parliament (by declaring against supporting The Evil Tories)<<

It does not follow that not 'supporting the Evil Tories' means that they will support Labour in the (unlikely) event that hold the balance of power it might be a more effective strategy to support neither bringing about a minority administration.

>>Labour in Scotland – (Membership numbers noted) do you see foresee a tendency toward a ‘one party’ Scotland? Will even the 55% who voted against the SNP proposition on September 18 be persuaded to vote SNP in May 2015?<<

As somebody pointed out the pledge of Home Rule changed the dynamics of the vote since a 'No' vote could no longer be seen a simply a vote for the status quo.

It is widely recognised in Scotland that ' Labour is the most reluctant to support the further devolution to Scotland all promised during the referendum campaign.' and the failure of Labour to deliver Home Rule, amongst other factors***, may lead to a significant decline in their support by May 2015.

Such as Head Office's attempting to parachute one of the NuLabour's nomenklatura into the contest for leadership of Scottish Labour:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/nov/02/scottish-labour-can-recover-but-not-with-jim-murphy

>>Clearly the Scottish electorate already won't support the aforementioned Tories and their stooges. Who’s left to vote for when the only certainty is a dislike for every Unionist? <<

Rather than being simply anti-Unionist sentiment it may be that that the Labour party may not be forgiven for aligning themselves with the loathed Tories

>>Time to paint the town yellow?<<

I hope not Yellow is the colour of choice of the Scottish Liberal Democrats

>symposium<<

Interesting though back at the daily grind. I'm thinking of to my 'post-retirement' consultancy role.

bs

Hi Bx4

Murphy: He didn't answer questions, stood in a street shouting and claimed a conspiracy to silence him. Ah now I see why he is odious and the only one egged.

Concrete: Um I don't know if I told you what my current rig is set up on? No worries with passing trains and the bounce from the suspended floor is cured.

Speed: The belt driven Technics has individual (electronic) speed adjustments for 33 1/3 and 45 rpm.

Broken Promise: I suspect for politicians the game plan is to win and never mind what they say to do it. I caught up with the second referendum debate where Salmond was goading Darling about accepting the result and will of the Scottish people. I suspect the very closeness of the result will mean a tough time for the nationalists in getting a re-run out of Westminster on the basis of 'The Pledge'. As suggested before; by rubbishing it at the time it makes it tricky to rely on it now?

Vote for the status quo: That's like 'voting for nothing'? Who'd vote for 'nothing'? No party campaigns for doing nothing over the next five years - they all rely on tempting voters like supermarkets tempt shoppers. We all know all the stuff about pledges, promises and how parliamentary democracy works in the UK. We are over five (or more to the point can remember or read of what happened, more than five years back)?

Minority Government: These tend to be more unstable under the Westminster system (rather than that experienced in Holyrood)? So yes the SNP could force one to come about though they couldn't guarantee to keep it in place. It's not long to wait now and we'll see if the SNP trounces Labour at the Westminster poll.

Aligning with Tories: What did folk want - for Labour to campaign for independence till May and campaign for unionism once in government? The independence campaign is one occasion when not aligning with the Tories on this issue was impracticable for a UK national party with 'branch offices' everywhere.

Retirement: From what you write that would appear to be me in this correspondence? To be honest I'm not stressed about it. If 'the daily grind' lights your fire then that's OK too.

bs

hi rg

>> I see why he is odious and the only one egged.<<

He appears to have been parachuted in 'head Office' who are briefing against other candidates who are more in the Old Labour tradition. Remains to be seen as to whether he will revive the fading fortunes off the local 'branch office'.

>>passing trains<<
The only passing trains affecting the 'stereo buff's' collection were on his remarkably tedious record collection.

>> suspect the very closeness of the result will mean a tough time for the nationalists in getting a re-run out of Westminster on the basis of 'The Pledge'.<<

May depend on 'The Pledge' is actually delivered.

>> As suggested before; by rubbishing it at the time it makes it tricky to rely on it now?<<

The debates were before the Unionists panicked and made 'The Pledge' and the package delivered by the Smith Commission seems to fall far short the promise that 'Scotland would be as close as possible to a federal state within one or two years, offered No voters “a modern form of Scottish Home Rule within the United Kingdom"'

http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk/move-to-devo-max-federalism-is-now-unstoppable-but-not-just-in-scotland/

>>That's like 'voting for nothing'? Who'd vote for 'nothing'? No party campaigns for doing nothing over the next five years - they all rely on tempting voters like supermarkets tempt shoppers.<<

Only the status quo with respect to the devolution the Westminster government having ruled out the Scotsh government's proposal to have a 'devo-max' option in the referendum.

'Danny Alexander, Liberal Democrat Chief Secretary to the Treasury, on the 13th of September spoke of “effective Home Rule”.

By these actions and clear and strongly worded commitments to the Scottish people in the face of what seemed a likely Yes vote, the official No campaign sought to redefine the meaning of a No vote. They succeeded, and in doing so won a mandate from the people of Scotland for substantial and significant change, for more powers to be devolved to an extent that can be defined as Devo Max/home rule and as close to Federalism as possible within the confines of the UK.' (ibid)

>> We all know all the stuff about pledges, promises and how parliamentary democracy works in the UK. We are over five (or more to the point can remember or read of what happened, more than five years back)?<<

Such defeatist cynicism may be the prevalent amongst the English voters but in Scotland while the cynicism exists the defeatism doe not:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/scottish-politics/11199884/Labours-complacency-hands-SNP-the-keys.html

>>Minority Government: These tend to be more unstable under the Westminster system (rather than that experienced in Holyrood)? So yes the SNP could force one to come about though they couldn't guarantee to keep it in place<<

Surely they could keep it in place on an ad hoc basis in return for further powers being devolved to Scotland?

>>Aligning with Tories: What did folk want - for Labour to campaign for independence till May and campaign for unionism once in government?<<

There is a difference between campaigning for Union as the Labour Party and doing it in an alliance with the Tories. It is the latter that will not be forgiven not the former.

>>The independence campaign is one occasion when not aligning with the Tories on this issue was impracticable for a UK national party with 'branch offices' everywhere.<<

I don't see why an alliance with the Tories is a necessary precondition for supporting Unionism.

>>Retirement: From what you write that would appear to be me in this correspondence? To be honest I'm not stressed about it. If 'the daily grind' lights your fire then that's OK too.<<

My original plan was to to retire, apart from a bit of consultancy early a decade ago but it 'grow'd like Topsy' but with advancing decrepitude it is perhaps time that I revert to my original plan.

I see Slick Dave continues on the slippery slope to a Brexit moment:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/merkel-fears-cameron-crossing-red-line-on-immigration-a-1000743.html

bs

Hi Bx4

Scotland: As a general point I think there is a Scottish perspective, as illustrated in your first link, there is also an English perspective. In Scotland an improved constitutional position rides high on the agenda whereas in England eyes are more toward the EU?

Parachuted: Murphy is not the first candidate Labour have parachuted into a constituency. It is the Labour way? As for “Old Labour tradition” perhaps an “Old Labour Party” is begging to be set up in Scotland? A “Branch Office” attitude is the Labour way common to the UK is it not? Maybe independence will sort it out as HQ of any Labour Party will then be in Scotland?

“The Pledge”: Was this included in any 2010 party manifesto? If not then what is the mandate for it? Perhaps there was a White Paper approved by parliament? I’m struggling to understand why I should attach more credibility to it over that owed to the manifesto commitments to an EU Treaty referendum in 2005? Politicians like to win votes they’ll say anything to get their way.

“Devo-Max”: I’d have thought, for this to appear on any ballot, the poll would have to be held across the UK? We already have lopsided devolution (can you tell I'm not a fan?); personally I think it would be better all-round had Scotland voted for independence rather than have devo-max (‘home rule’ or whatever) imposed on an English electorate who didn’t even have the opportunity to vote for it!

“Defeatist cynicism”: I look forward to watching the fight to win whatever it is the SNP really want (is it independence or something else these days?)

“Surely they could keep it in place on an ad hoc basis in return for further powers being devolved to Scotland?”: Yes they could though this wouldn’t prevent the party they put in place from pulling the plug. Personally I can’t see any unionist party wishing to rely on the support of the SNP to rule from Westminster? How would that go down with English voters next time round?

“There is a difference between campaigning for Union as the Labour Party and doing it in an alliance with the Tories.”: I’m with you here I think if you’re referring to “The Pledge”. I suspect any alliance would be short lived.


“Brexit”: Amazingly the article appears to ignore the fact that there is an election in May. ‘Dead man walking’ Cameron couldn’t win standing against ‘Clunker’ Brown so what hope against ‘Virile’ Miliband! There’s no way the Liberal Democrats would allow a vote on the EU. They aren’t those sort of democrats. So called Brexit is for the birds.

Also last I looked there was support for continued EU membership across all of the UK.

Decrepitude: Can’t fight it (least wise I’ve not found a way).

bs

hi rg

>>eyes more towards the EU<<

To some extent - though I think Scots are both more pro-EU than the rest of the UK:

http://www.chathamhouse.org/expert/comment/15743

and they also have a different attitude and priorities on immigration:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-26020982

which may explain in part why UKIP is a minor player in Scotland and why Cameron's recent 'me too' xenophobia attracts no support there.

>>parachuted<<

Seems to have been the trend though the peasants may be starting to rebel:

http://www.leftfutures.org/2011/09/proposed-ban-on-parachuting-candidates-into-safe-seats-blocked-by-sharp-practice/

though I suspect not sufficiently to scupper Jim the Egg's aspirations.


>> the Labour way common to the UK<<

Except as I have said before I think Brewers Green is seen more as the head Office than a branch Office:

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/apr/11/labour-party-move-new-headquarters

>>“The Pledge”: Was this included in any 2010 party manifesto? If not then what is the mandate for it? Perhaps there was a White Paper approved by parliament? I’m struggling to understand why I should attach more credibility to it over that owed to the manifesto commitments to an EU Treaty referendum in 2005? Politicians like to win votes they’ll say anything to get their way. <<

Properly it was called 'The Vow' and was supposedly based on Gordon Brown's '12 point plan' for more devolved powers:

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/independence-referendum-gordon-browns-12-point-4187106

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2014-09-16/leaders-sign-the-vow-to-promise-scots-new-powers/

though the recommendations of the Smith Commission fall somewhat short of these.

I am not sure your argument about manifesto holds up because the General Election was in 2010 and the Scottish parliamentary election did not take place till 2011. Given that no-one expected the SNP to have an overall majority in 2011 (The Scottish electoral system being designed to make coalitions the most probable outcome) then I suspect none of the Unionist parties anticipated this in 2010. It was however in the SNP manifesto so they did have a mandate for it.

>>“Devo-Max”: I’d have thought, for this to appear on any ballot, the poll would have to be held across the UK? We already have lopsided devolution (can you tell I'm not a fan?); personally I think it would be better all-round had Scotland voted for independence rather than have devo-max (‘home rule’ or whatever) imposed on an English electorate who didn’t even have the opportunity to vote for it!<<

I thik we have have had this discussion before. Scottish devolution was an act of ill conceived 'realpolitik' on the part of the Labour Party becase the SNP was eroding its Westminster vote in Scotland. No similiar situation existed in England so Westminster did not offer a similar choice to the English electorate. Perhaps if the English had pressured the Westminster parties by organising a populist movement for a devolved English parliament then they might have got one but they didn't. However Perhaps Cameron's 'English votes on English ' may give England ersatz devolution.

>>“Defeatist cynicism”: I look forward to watching the fight to win whatever it is the SNP really want (is it independence or something else these days?)<<

Yes but, No but...

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/119498/scotland-rejects-independence-alex-salmond-and-snp-still-gain

>>Yes they could though this wouldn’t prevent the party they put in place from pulling the plug. Personally I can’t see any unionist party wishing to rely on the support of the SNP to rule from Westminster? How would that go down with English voters next time round?<<

Surely if the SNP only gave support on a quid pro quo basis then it would be they who pulled the plug. The unholy alliance that is the Coalition would suggest that the desire for power weighs stronger than principle at Westminster. I imagine it would not go down well with English voters just as the Coalition did not go down well with Scottish voters.

>>“There is a difference between campaigning for Union as the Labour Party and doing it in an alliance with the Tories.”: I’m with you here I think if you’re referring to “The Pledge”. I suspect any alliance would be short lived.<<

So it has proved.

>>“Brexit”: Amazingly the article appears to ignore the fact that there is an election in May. ‘Dead man walking’ Cameron couldn’t win standing against ‘Clunker’ Brown so what hope against ‘Virile’ Miliband! There’s no way the Liberal Democrats would allow a vote on the EU. They aren’t those sort of democrats. So called Brexit is for the birds.<<

I thought the consensus was that Miliband was a Wimp. Anyhow one coalition does not a summer make particularly give that support for the Liberal Democrats seems to be in freefall. So Clegg may not be in a position to play kingmaker in 2015.

>>Also last I looked there was support for continued EU membership across all of the UK<<

I thought you were sceptical of opinion polls?

>>Decrepitude: Can’t fight it (least wise I’ve not found a way)<<

'Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.'

Dylan Thomas

bs

Hi Bx4

“…Scots are both more pro-EU…” – I’m sure this is true though the point I was trying to make was that (imo) the UK (excluding Scotland) was more concerned about the EU (whether positively or negatively) than Scotland.

“…Cameron's recent 'me too' xenophobia…” – I missed this though if true how does this square with the failure to achieve immigration targets? Yes he could blame the ‘the real opposition’ though this was known about at the start of the parliament?

“…Jim the Egg's aspirations…” – I gather Salmond the Egg is to seek office himself. Is a parachute involved?

Labour Party – Somewhere has to be HQ. Everywhere else can only ever be a branch office at most. I cannot understand why folk in Scotland won’t set up their own Labour Party in Scotland (if being a branch office vexes so)? Perhaps Merseyside, Manchester and Newcastle should do the same?


“…It was however in the SNP manifesto so they did have a mandate for it…” – This is not relevant to the whole of the UK is it? If ‘lopsided anything’ is to be avoided then the whole of the UK needs to be on-board?


“…Perhaps Cameron's 'English votes on English ' may give England ersatz devolution…” – Pigs may fly? Dead man walking also springs to mind (again). Coincidentally this was just now discussed on Daily Politics. I didn’t catch the whole debate though I got the distinct impression that Labour (who I see as likely victors in May) were set on breaking up England. Lucky England.

SNP – I suspect that the more Westminster seats they secure the less likely that there will be a Westminster co-sponsored independence referendum.

“…Surely if the SNP only gave support on a quid pro quo basis then it would be they who pulled the plug…” – All the ‘party in power’ need do is call an election and ‘quid pro quo’ ends. I realise they may have to change the law on fixed term parliaments or something.

I think I agree with your point about the coalition as it seems no-one got the government they voted for in 2010.

“…I thought the consensus was that Miliband was a Wimp…” – He’s not Cameron or Clegg. That’s more than enough to triumph. Is Miliband a wimp – I don’t know?

“…Clegg may not be in a position to play kingmaker in 2015…” – I gather that’s Sturgeon the Egg’s job?

“…I thought you were sceptical of opinion polls?..”

As the last real poll was forty years ago what else can we use in answer to the question “does the UK wish to exit the EU”? I agree that OPs needs to be treated with scepticism.

'Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.'

Are you sure you never partook in a jar in coffee#1? (I’d find a picture link however as this still isn’t my computer I’m rather ‘time constrained’ here).

Hope health’s good?

bs

hi rg

>>UK...more concerned about the EU (whether positively or negatively) than Scotland<<

I'm not sure I agree in terms of the 2016 Brexit referendum Scots are concerned that the outcome will be made on the basis of the decision made by the numerical dominant English vote irrespective of the vote of the 'Celtic 'which is why Sturgeon has proposed that:

' each of the four UK nations should have a veto over UK withdrawal from the European Union'.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/oct/29/guardian-view-scotland-eu-referendum-question-needs-answer

>> I gather Salmond the Egg is to seek office himself. Is a parachute involved? <<

Unlike Jim, Salmond has not been egged.. As understand the notion of a parachuted candidate this involves a safe seat held by the reelevant part. Since Salmond is seeking a nomination to contest the Gordon constituency currently held by the Liberal Democrats - so no parachute would seem to be involved.

>> I cannot understand why folk in Scotland won’t set up their own Labour Party in Scotland (if being a branch office vexes so)? Perhaps Merseyside, Manchester and Newcastle should do the same?<<

I'm not sure that the Labour in Scotland has the will to set up an independent Scottish Labour Party. After it was only after she resigned that Johan Lamont had wee rant about the SLP being a branch office before that she was content to toe the head office line.

>>This is not relevant to the whole of the UK is it?<<

I didn't say it was - we were discussing your point that none of the Unionist parties manifestos of 2010 articulated a position on a Scottish referendum.

>> If ‘lopsided anything’ is to be avoided then the whole of the UK needs to be on-board?<<

This surely is a matter for the Unionists parties who clearly feel no compulsion to hold a referendum on a devolved English parliament

>> Labour (who I see as likely victors in May)....<<

Clearly the age of the aerial sus scrofa is with us...
http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x394/ancdrol/pigs-can-fly.jpg

...were set on breaking up England. Lucky England.<<

Didn't 'Two Jags' Prescott already try this?

>>SNP – I suspect that the more Westminster seats they secure the less likely that there will be a Westminster co-sponsored independence

I don't think the aim is for a co-sponsored independence referendum rather additional devolution resulting in 'a system of government as close to federalism as you can have...'

>>I think I agree with your point about the coalition as it seems no-one got the government they voted for in 2010.<<

Of course here and in Scotland we have Additional Member Systems which means that people rarely get the government they voted for.

>> I gather that’s Sturgeon the Egg’s job?<<

Again unlike Jim Nicola was not egged. I await with interest to see if the Scottish Labour representation at Westminster hits the buffers.

>>As the last real poll was forty years ago what else can we use in answer to the question “does the UK wish to exit the EU”? I agree that OPs needs to be treated with scepticism.<<

Perhaps a trend analysis of OPs would be more reliable.

>>Are you sure you never partook in a jar in coffee#1? <<

Is this the franchise all of whose branches were visited by an eccentric motorcyclist? None here though the Less Political sells:

http://www.lesspolitical.de/dark-espresso-jelly-40g.html

>>Hope health’s good?<<

Fine still bicycling to work. Yours?

No sign of snow 'chaos' here

bs

Hi Bx4

I must start with an apology as am guilty of poor use of English. Whilst I wrote “more concerned about the EU (whether positively or negatively) than Scotland” I should have written something like “more concerned about the EU (whether positively or negatively) than [England etc. has for] Scotland”. So whilst the political focus in Scotland may be on a shiny new constitutional settlement for the UK – in the balance of the UK I think we are more interested in Miliband’s ‘control immigration fairly’ speech. (This is to say nothing of Scottish interest in the EU).

“…the outcome will be made on the basis of the decision made by the numerical dominant English vote…” – I’m struggling to understand why Scotland and ‘Celtic’ others should be uniquely treated to a ‘veto’ in UK wide decision making. Many (if internet forums are a guide) couldn’t care less that Monmouthshire was unceremoniously dumped into the clutches of the Cardiff puffed up political classes with a mere nod in a July 1972 parliamentary session. In contrast Scotland was treated to the longest political campaign in history so the Scottish electorate could decide their future political home for themselves. Note ‘decide for themselves’ not have decided for them. Sorry; what’s needed here is a dose of fairness.

“…Unlike Jim, Salmond has not been egged…” – More is the pity. I note that Murphy isn’t as ‘no mates’ as some would have it and he got the Labour gig.

“…As understand the notion of a parachuted candidate this involves a safe seat…” – I always thought it involved a candidate not from the area being ‘parachuted’ in from outside? I know Labour liked to do this hereabouts. They treated us like a ‘branch office’ you know.

“…the Gordon constituency currently held by the Liberal Democrats…” – That will be a tough gig for ‘Salmond the Should be Egged’ given the strength of the Liberal Democrats these days. Is it really possible that the Liberal Democrats could ever lose in Scotland? Even in Government they’re ‘The Real Opposition’. How cool is that? Still Salmond’s a good egg – if anyone can dislodge a Liberal Democrat he can.

“…I'm not sure that the Labour in Scotland has the will to set up an independent Scottish Labour Party…” – I wasn’t thinking of the party elite so much as folk on the ground fed up with ‘branch office’ politics. I’ve wondered about Scotland had she voted Yes in September; would she have become a one party state? Would not local parties sprout up to represent threads of different political interests?

“…Didn't 'Two Jags' Prescott already try [the division of England]? … ” – Indeed though today’s headline is “The government is expected to set out proposals for introducing "English votes for English laws" later.” I note Labour describe this as ‘a stitch up’ presumably because it doesn’t conform to their ‘smash England’ agenda. I makes no odds as Labour triumphs in May. Bye-bye coalition government, bye-bye England hello English Regions.

“…additional devolution resulting in 'a system of government as close to federalism as you can have...'…” – Whoopee I can hardly wait. Postcode lottery here we come.

“…I await with interest to see if the Scottish Labour representation at Westminster hits the buffers…” – Indeed not long to wait now.


“…Perhaps a trend analysis of OPs would be more reliable…”- Your ‘favourite’ politician observed that in these matters a majority of less than 1% on one day (as in Wales 1997) is all that matters.

“…The franchise all of whose branches were visited by an eccentric motorcyclist?..” – The same though I think they are owned outright by a Cardiff brewer.

Did you try any of the Dark Espresso Jelly?

Bicycling – With the aid of an engine I’m afraid. I did push it into the shed the other day does that count as exercise? My health – Thank you for asking I’m trying to diet though this isn’t a good time of year for avoiding treats. One Stollen dispatched already (well I had to make sure it was fit to share).

No snow just frost. I note Spiral is to return.

Keep well. Keep pushing those pedals.

bs

hi rg

Apologies for delay in replying. Very time poor at moment - a combination of writing final reports on a number of projects before year end and (tedious but inevitable) seasonal social whirl. Hopefully back on piste in a few days.

Meanwhile have a good one.
bs

Hi Bx4

Main thing is that you are well.

Good luck with social whirl (I'm on a break from my own just now) and year end reporting (none for me ha ha).

All the best for this festive season and the New Year.

bs

Hi rg

>>the social whirl<<

Not a particular fan so played the diabetes card often.

>>So whilst the political focus in Scotland may be on a shiny new constitutional settlement for the UK<<

I would have thought the 'English votes for English laws' dimension would have some resonance in England. Te SNP (and I believe Plaid Cymru) already abstain from such votes. Obviously a significant problem or Labour and the Liberal Democrats though not the Tories were this to happen.

>>in the balance of the UK I think we are more interested in Miliband’s ‘control immigration fairly’ speech.<<

I believe this speech was by way of correcting his omission of immigration in his party confrence speech.

>> I’m struggling to understand why Scotland and ‘Celtic’ others should be uniquely treated to a ‘veto’ in UK wide decision making.<<

I doubt if Nicola Sturgeon expects to get a veto but a pro-exit decision resulting from an English majority against the contrary wishes of the Scots would serve to reignite the independence issue in Scotland.

>>Monouthshire<<

'Old' Monmouthshire was created as part of Wales by the by the 1535 laws in Wales Act which, inter alia, abolished the the existing marcher lordships.I know of no subsequent parliamenatary legislation which transferred Monmouth from Wales to England.

>> I note that Murphy isn’t as ‘no mates’ as some would have it and he got the Labour gig. <<

Indeed, a much diminished 'branch Office' voted as 'head office' wanted or thought they may regret after his 'mansion tax' pledge.

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article4315043.ece

>> I always thought it involved a candidate not from the area being ‘parachuted’ in from outside? I know Labour liked to do this hereabouts. They treated us like a ‘branch office’ you know.<<

I think there is a distinction to be made between an 'outsider' independently selected by the local constituency and a 'political careerist' imposed by the 'head office':

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/17/parachuting-political-careerists-safe-seats-candidates


Possibly:

http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides/299426-poll-suggests-snp-are-closing-on-lib-dems-in-uk-wide-support/


>> I wasn’t thinking of the party elite so much as folk on the ground fed up with ‘branch office’ politics<<

The 'folk on the ground' seem to be voting with their feet:

http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/scottish-politics/revealed-just-how-many-members-does-labour-really-have-in-scotland.25814760

>> I note Labour describe this as ‘a stitch up’ presumably because it doesn’t conform to their ‘smash England’ agenda<<

I wasn't aware of this agenda but rather thought the exclusion of Scottish Labour MPs on England only votes might mean that they had a UK majority administration in the HoC but an English minority administration there.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5b167f3e-538d-11e4-8285-00144feab7de.html#axzz3OAai2Pgf


As the link says the:

'neatest solution: create a separate English assembly – perhaps outside London – to mirror those in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. It would pass legislation on issues such as education, transport and health which affect only the English.' seems to have no traction amongst the Unionist parties (though the SNP and Plaid Cymru support the idea).

>> Whoopee I can hardly wait. Postcode lottery here we come.<<

Surely a federal union would result in a fairer sytem with four devolved parliaments? I dont see why it would be a 'postcode lottery'.

>> Indeed not long to wait now. <<

Sometimes four months can be a long time in politics...

>>Your ‘favourite’ politician observed that in these matters a majority of less than 1% on one day (as in Wales 1997) is all that matters.<<

I'm not sure who my 'favourite' politician is but this may be true in referendums but less so in parliamentary elections.

>>
I think they are owned outright by a Cardiff brewer.<<

I thought the were Bristolian in origin.

>>Did you try any of the Dark Espresso Jelly?<<

No. I am a traditionalist. I buy beans from Quijotekaffee, grind them myself and brew in a Delonghi Icona.


>>Bicycling<<

I've stopped for the moment. Currently the Harbour ferry from Neumühlen/Ovelgönne to Landungsbrücken and then the U-Bahn 3.

>>Stollen<<

No Stollen for me... No Lebkuchen... No Glühwein...

>>No snow just frost<<

Neither here. Fings aint wot the used to be.

>>Spiral<<

Never really took to it. Have been watching DR's The Legacy (Arvingerne) which was supposedly bought by BBC but is showing on Sky Arts which we can get here without having to faff about with the likes of My Expat Network.

bs

hi rg

While trying to post the above I was asked to enter a captcha.

bs

Hi rg

Been largely off piste following a decision to REALLY retire. Almost through the boring administration consequences.

bs

Hi Bx4

Been offline will catch up.

BS

Hi bx4

'the diabetes card'

Quite frankly I wouldn't want this card in my (all be it chewed) hand. I've seen diabetes at first hand, it is not on my wish list, instead my wish is that you suffer as little as possible from the illness.

[The SNP & Plaid] 'abstain from such votes'

I think the SNP are having a rethink on this. As a general point I am not aware of an appetite for constitutional change in England. I could be wrong though suspect The EU presents itself as a more likely election vote winner (or loser).

[Miliband] 'I believe this speech was by way of correcting his omission of immigration in his party confrence speech'

Didn't he omit mention of the deficit to cause ripples in the media? Does immigration even require mention as the subject is electoral poison? It is too closely tied in with still undimmed recollection of Grandma Bigot? Some folk can never be reconciled.

'a pro-exit decision resulting from an English majority against the contrary wishes of the Scots would serve to reignite the independence issue in Scotland'

Indeed it would! That said independence as an issue never went away. The issue remains unsettled until independence is achieved.

'I know of no subsequent parliamenatary legislation which transferred Monmouth from Wales to England'

Yet the 1972 LGA specifically places it in Wales begging the question - why bother if it already was? See also OS maps prior to 1974 - none of which show Monmouthshire as being part of anywhere but England.

'an 'outsider' independently selected by the local constituency'

You raised a smile with this. This doesn't speak well of local talent? They even consider looking outside for representation?

'The 'folk on the ground' seem to be voting with their feet:'

The acid test is but weeks away. That said, given the closeness of the referendum result, I'd expect a better SNP showing than in 2010.

[From link] ''neatest solution: create a separate English assembly – perhaps outside London – to mirror those in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. It would pass legislation on issues such as education, transport and health which affect only the English.' seems to have no traction amongst the Unionist parties'

More to the point the 'solution' doesn't have traction with the electorate.

'Surely a federal union would result in a fairer sytem with four devolved parliaments? I dont see why it would be a 'postcode lottery''

Service levels vary according to where folk live in the UK. This does not go down well when pet services are unavailable in the locality whilst over the road they are. What of the UK? I'd thought this was voted for even in rebellious Scotland?

[Coffee#1] 'I thought the were Bristolian in origin'

I believe they are now part of Brains Brewery? http://www.sabrain.com/news/107132

'Currently the Harbour ferry from Neumühlen/Ovelgönne to Landungsbrücken and then the U-Bahn 3'

Currently nothing here as brought down with 'man flu'

'No Stollen for me... No Lebkuchen... No Glühwein'

Painful! I'm about to have a whisky (Burns night) (sp)

'The Legacy'

Don't know it. I'm watching Broadchurch whilst gladly admitting it more a guilty pleasure than a recommendation.

Sorry if scratchy read as 'flu' ridden when written.

bs

Hi rg

Been having trouble with h2g2 and lost my reply. Will recompose off line and post in a couple of days.

bs

Hi bx4

I'm sorry you've been having bother. I've had similar issues with normal E-mail and sympathise with your having to fight the machine.

I know writing itself can be a chore (from, imposed on me, battles with authority); the last thing we need is for the quill to fight back (and it does).

bs