h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

pokes head in door,ummmmm is this where i come for the free five minute argument??? my guns are very much under control thankyou(cant speak for anyone esles) and what about the life penalty,cant remember anyone asking me if i wanted to be born much less where it would happen,or when

Tee hee!

You know I've got a theory about a similarity between Americans and English (BTW being a complete pacifist I believe only that hanging should be brought back for confusing UK with Engand and viccy verky) but I reckon for any country to have a broad-minded pan-cultural sense of awareness they need to have been occupied by an oppressive foreign country sometime in the relatively near past.

Regards from sunny (and actually quite backward (damn! there goes my argument)) Scotland.

DUOTWR

I am wondering if being a sea-port helps?

I have just been working in Hamburg, and before that in Glasgow, and both are cities with a strong sense of the world and themselves. I get the impression the same is true of Liverpool and Sydney, (to take two at random) but I have never even been to them.

Other places in the UK disappear up their own back-sides, London and Edinburgh being prime examples. OK, London used to be a port, but it was so busy being London that it never really noticed the rest of the world.

Liverpudlians - strong sense of the world? Hmm.
Strong sense of Ireland possibly. Wales maybe. Manchester probably.
Germany? De bombed are chippy.

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It's better just to be ashamed of having ever existed on this plane of reality at all. It's not that Americans or Brits are arrogant so much as that people are arrogant. *Everybody's* secretly convinced of their own racial superiority.

Except Canadians, because we're spineless.

Just a quick question to any Australians, now I'm honestly not trying to mix it. I've had the impression for a long time that one of the great things about Australia is that when the various settlers arrived there, there was an opportunity to start a fresh nation without all the overheads of history, ie. shake off that colonial/imperial attitude so loved by Brits. My only concern, and this comes from chatting to a couple of Australian friends of mine, is the moderately strong racist tendencies of some Australians, and I'm going to mention the aboriginals in this respect. Do you think that being a country made up from such a diverse set of cultures that racism is any less prevelant in Australia, or is it just a case of finding a(ny) target group for racial hatred.

Well, I've read through most of this forum, and find it very depressing. The original question was fair enough. I have met Americans who were genuinely surprised at the apparent hostility occasionally met on their travels, so why not ask why. But, surely, surely, reasonably thoughtful H2G2 Researchers should be way beyond the definitions and crass generalisations of Nationality and Xenophobia? People are people are people. Everywhere. Good, bad and mostly indifferent.

Je suis internationalist. (J-P Sartre)

Yeah, fair point.

I'm not trying to suggest that H2G2 researchers are xenophobic or that they conform to stereotypes, I'm just aware that different countries possibly have xenophobic tendences to a greater or lesser extent. I myself think that Scotland (where I live) is moderately bad in this respect. Mention England and you will likely be met with some rabid foaming-at-the-mouth from otherwise rational people (myself, from time-to-time included). This is definately not something to be proud of, but I find it interesting to what degree this exists, and with which targets.

I'm not a racist, or at least I try my utmost not to be. I do, however, think that a lot of people are to some extent. The sooner we ge away from this the better. You just have to look at the UK press and it's attitude towards fellow European states and their inhabitants to see why such xenophobia amongst the general populace exists, and why it's likely to continue for at least the foreseeable future. Did anyone see the report on how UK citizens vastly overestimate the number of immigrants living in the UK?

Cultural diversity is a great thing, the sooner _everybody_ realises this the better.

DUOTWR

I just found a wonderful section in "Democracy in America" by Alexis de Tocqueville (written around 1850):

"The American, taking part in everything that is done in his country, feels a duty to defend anything criticized there, for it is not only his country that is being attacked, but himself; hence one finds that his national pride has recourse to every artifice and descends to every childishness of personal vanity.

"Nothing is more annoying in the ordinary intercourse of life than this irritable patriotism of the Americans. A foreigner will gladly agree to praise much in their country, but he would like to be allowed to criticize something, and that he is absolutely refused."

(for those who like exact references: the section is entitled "Public Spirit in the United States" in chapter 6 "the real advantages derived by American society from democratic government" in Part II of the book, in my copy, translation by Lawrence, edited by Mayer, it's on page 237)

Just goes to show, it isn't a new problem.

The opportunity to start anew without the baggage of the 'old' world would have been a great idea. Except what the English did was ethnically clense the place (or at least the areas worth living in) and then send society's flotsam and jetsam there.
Australia, unfortunately, has an entrenched racist society – as exemplified by the popularity of that awful one nation woman. Many Ozzys appear to advocate the complete denial of Aboriginal rights, and their right to land.
For a country where almost 'everyone' is an immigrant, it's a funny attitude to take.
This isn't mindless Aussie bashing, just as my previous posts weren't mindless yank bashing. But the nations that like to describe themselves as free and open, usually have the most to be ashamed of. Britain included.

The opportunity to start anew without the baggage of the 'old' world would have been a great idea. Except what the English did was ethnically clense the place (or at least the areas worth living in) and then send society's flotsam and jetsam there.
Australia, unfortunately, has an entrenched racist society – as exemplified by the popularity of that awful one nation woman. Many Ozzys appear to advocate the complete denial of Aboriginal rights, and their right to land.
For a country where almost 'everyone' is an immigrant, it's a funny attitude to take.
This isn't mindless Aussie bashing, just as my previous posts weren't mindless yank bashing. But the nations that like to describe themselves as free and open, usually have the most to be ashamed of. Britain included.

The opportunity to start anew without the baggage of the 'old' world would have been a great idea. Except what the English did was ethnically clense the place (or at least the areas worth living in) and then send society's flotsam and jetsam there.
Australia, unfortunately, has an entrenched racist society – as exemplified by the popularity of that awful one nation woman. Many Ozzys appear to advocate the complete denial of Aboriginal rights, and their right to land.
For a country where almost 'everyone' is an immigrant, it's a funny attitude to take.
This isn't mindless Aussie bashing, just as my previous posts weren't mindless yank bashing. But the nations that like to describe themselves as free and open, usually have the most to be ashamed of. Britain included.

The opportunity to start anew without the baggage of the 'old' world would have been a great idea. Except what the English did was ethnically clense the place (or at least the areas worth living in) and then send society's flotsam and jetsam there.
Australia, unfortunately, has an entrenched racist society – as exemplified by the popularity of that awful one nation woman. Many Ozzys appear to advocate the complete denial of Aboriginal rights, and their right to land.
For a country where almost 'everyone' is an immigrant, it's a funny attitude to take.
This isn't mindless Aussie bashing, just as my previous posts weren't mindless yank bashing. But the nations that like to describe themselves as free and open, usually have the most to be ashamed of. Britain included.

The opportunity to start anew without the baggage of the 'old' world would have been a great idea. Except what the English did was ethnically clense the place (or at least the areas worth living in) and then send society's flotsam and jetsam there.
Australia, unfortunately, has an entrenched racist society – as exemplified by the popularity of that awful one nation woman. Many Ozzys appear to advocate the complete denial of Aboriginal rights, and their right to land.
For a country where almost 'everyone' is an immigrant, it's a funny attitude to take.
This isn't mindless Aussie bashing, just as my previous posts weren't mindless yank bashing. But the nations that like to describe themselves as free and open, usually have the most to be ashamed of. Britain included.

What's wrong with my Mac more like. It's just posted five versions of the same message.

Nothing like making a point-again and again and...

I don't know if Dubious Use realises it, but he has subconsciously based a non-racialist statement on a racialist premise - I quote:

"Just a quick question to any Australians, now I'm honestly not trying to mix it. I've had
the impression for a long time that one of the great things about Australia is that when
the various settlers arrived there,.... My only concern, and this comes from chatting to a couple of
Australian friends of mine, is the moderately strong racist tendencies of some
Australians, and I'm going to mention the aboriginals in this respect. Do you think that
being a country made up from such a diverse set of cultures that racism is any less
prevelant in Australia, or is it just a case of finding a(ny) target group for racial hatred."

To boil it down: he is saying that "Australians" are racialist. Excuse me, but doesn't "Australians" mean the aborigines as well? I bet everybody who read that posting first time round immediately imagined white Australians every time he said "Australians" and grouped the aborigines separately. I know I did, and I apologise to everyone, black and white, for this. It's still in our subconscious and, as I said somewhere either in this forum or in another similar one, it's a sign of maturity and tolerance to analyse these feelings and learn about the other cultures and races rather than let them blindly lead us.

Are white people the only racialists? Not in South Africa, for example, they aren't. (Sorry, can only speak from second hand, but I was just trying to kick up another wasps' nest)

Noone has mentioned the elections tomorrow. (Today actually, it´s that late again!) I think the way the "most important man of the western world" is elected is somewhat improbable (Oh, heck, it´s that late I am not sure about which terms to use)

Think of it: Only 50% go to the vote. Most of them don´t evan seem to know reasons to vote for one or the other, exept for traditional reasons. And the ones who decide it in the end are those impressed by the showmaster qualities of one or the other.

Of course these are flaws of all democracies. Who realy goes into sound judgement of what politicians say and do?

So it´s "Read your Macciavelli" again, and a pitty I only got 223 votes in the last local election

How many people do you want to vote? If someone can't get up the motivation to vote, then they shouldn't be allowed near the poll. They don't care, and probably don't pay enough attention to make a proper decsion. Even most of the people who do vote don't pay enough attention to the world.

Besides, the more people who vote, the more my vote is diluted.

Don't Vote! Stay Home! Make my vote worth more.