h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Very good point, Saturnine.

It's not to physically/literally steal oil.

They probably had something along these lines...Sadam messed up, and warranted the 1st gulf war. Ever since then the neo-cons have seen Iraq has having the best excuse to be invaded and set up as a democracy. So they get the right president, and then they get 9/11, and next thing you know Sarge is in the Sunni triangle.

It's probably to bring capitalism and democracy to the middle east.

dave

"It's probably to bring capitalism and democracy to the middle east."

So, bearing in mind America's recent record in the areas od capitalism and democracy (Enron, Worldcom and Halliburton being examples of the way capitalism functions and the farce of the 2000 presidential election being an example of American democracy), do you really believe that Americans are best qualified to be imposing capitalism and democracy on a recalsitrant region of the world, at gunpoint?

Or do you think that America should clean up its own back yard and try to become a better exemplar of capitalism and democracy before attempting to spread them by force?

I think we invaded under false pretenses and that was wrong. I think that now that we're there we need to do the job right, which we will, eventually.

America is always trying to clean up its own backyard, that's what being american is all about.

You've listed 3 companies as examples, let me give you web pages that list many compaines which aren't so corrupt or evil:

http://www.nyse.com/
http://www.nasdaq.com/
http://www.amex.com/

dave

That's very amusing, Dave. But even you can't be that stupid. The fact that there are very many non-corrupt firms in the US, doesn't negate the corrupt ones.

You forgot Uncle Joe's Hotdog Stand on the boulevard in Long Island. Honest as the day is long!

Y'know, it's really not ethical to force your way of living (be it Christianity or Capitalism/Democracy) on another person or country.

That's what the whole Cold War was about.

yeah, but america don't do it very often, it's normally more proffitable for them to help over throw democraticly elected governments and put dictators in their place.

It's not stupid Empty, it's realistic. Everything done by humans will have inherent failures and corruption. To get some perspective, we should see how many companies have these problems, rather than say b/c one or a few companies have failed that the whole system is wrong.

Sounds like a good hotdog stand - haven't been there yet. My favorite is Johnny's Texas Hots, in Lakewood, NY (upstate). If you go, get 'em with everything, and get a milkshake.

Saturnine - I wasn't saying it was right; I didn't even mean to imply this - I was just giving my best guess as to why it happened.

dave

"Everything done by humans will have inherent failures and corruption."

Exactly! Now you're learning. That's exactly why it's arrogant and wrong of America to attempt to impose it's system, by force, on another part of the world. If the system they're attempting to impose was a perfect blameless sinless paradise, there MIGHT just be justification, it MIGHT just be ultimately worth all those lives.

But America has no right to claim the moral high ground to such an arrogant extent. Edpecially considering George W bush is running a concentration camp in Cuba and practicing wholesale denial of human rights on a daily basis.

if we're going to run in circles...

I thought we were there to steal oil...Are you saying that's not the reason anymore empty?

Part of being in government is good image. Can you blame them for the propaganda that comes out? The fact that so many people believe it is just a tribute to how good it is.

Yes, its official, the USA has the most skillful propaganda machine since "Hitler uber Deutschland" .

It doesn't come up to his level on fighting unemployment though.

Ooh, next I have to try this with an even more unsuitable country. Hmm...Luxembourg maybe?

"I thought we were there to steal oil...Are you saying that's not the reason anymore empty?"

Not at all. I've always believed that is the reason and I still do. But you were claiming it's not. You were claiming it's about spreading capitalism and democracy.

My point is that if it's appropriate to spread capitalism and democracy at gunpoint, then America should at least be a worthy exemplar of capitalism and democracy.

Good point. I don't think we should be spreading it at gunpoint, nor do I think that the US is the best example right now, but we have had our moments, and hopefully will again. Since we're committed at this point, we just have to work to make sure it goes as well as possible.

I think that capitalism and democracy are not going to be a good solution if we want to preserve the Earth from pollution, we have to adapt ourself.

That's true.All we see here in France about the US is through "the Bush administration" and nothing else. Anyway I like to believe that the next president "Kerry" will do much better...(hello,I am back,c'est fablefilou,tu te souviens?)

Lying doesn't go anywhere for the people.

I think the same happens on this side of the pond, fablefilou - we see france as the actions of Chirac.

Je regrette que je ne te souvien pas

But hello anyway, it is nice to meet you.

Chirac has been right on the Irak "dossier", he is not all the time like now with the religious stuff in schools, France is a country of the liberty"les droits de l'homme" and should show the exemple. Who cares about what the children or the teacher wear at school,Come on..