A Conversation for Ask h2g2

Language connected to race

Post 981

Recumbentman

A sister-in-law does this. It is incredibly embarrassing! But not to her.


Language connected to race

Post 982

liekki

smiley - ermI'd like to be able to do that. Knowingly, of course.


Language connected to race

Post 983

Edward the Bonobo - Gone.

Apparently the special effects in Zelig involved filming on old film stock, with old cameras and then bringing out of retirement people experienced in old processing techniques. Then the film was artifically aged by scrunching it up in a shower and jumping on it.

Favourite line: 'It's amazing what you can achieve when you're totally psychotic'.

But back to accents:
There's a phenomenon which I know will amuse some of you whereby a certain type of Scottish person, usually involved on the fringes of folk music, likes to be taken for Irish. It's cool to be a Celtic Tiger!

For myself - I met up with some old friends recently who were amazed at how Scottish my accent (and dialect) has become. Indeed, some Scots are these days taking me for one of them. In fact, I'm a 'Scot of English Ethnic Origin' (a self-coined term, designed to infuriate the more bigoted elements of the SNPsmiley - smiley) - grew up in Liverpool - but with an accent influenced by a South Walian grandmother - and the Scouse elements were bullied out of me once I got a scholarship to a school with ideas above its station. Then I lived in the South East of England for a while.

Generally, only I notice my Scouse elements (the usual vowels: fur, fair, fir) - When asked, nobody has ever guessed where I'm from. But I'm told my origins become more noticeable after a few scoops. I'm not sute whether I 'S my Ts' though. (The Scouse T elides into an S - as in 'Arrice?')


Language connected to race

Post 984

DA ; Simply Vicky: Don't get pithy with me!

It's embarassing to me when I realise it!

I grew up speaking broad Scouse... a friend of mine (Canadian) had a theory that NZ children adopt the accent of their non-New Zealand-native parent, because it's "stronger", was the way he put it. My mother's accent was as far as I can remember, some kind of NZ/RP, what my brother-in-law called "Posh Kiwi"... she was born in 1918, her parents were born in NZ, but her two grandmothers (one from Ayrshire, the other from London) lived with the family when she was little.

We dropped the Scouse when we went to school. In some respects, NZ is a very conformist place - and all children with non-Kiwi accents were bullied. I am not kidding, they were *bullied*! smiley - grr


Language connected to race

Post 985

KB

'S-ing the T's' is one of those similarities between Scouse speak and Dublin speak I've noticed. Another is the 'ee' sound that creeps into the word 'you', 'y-ee-oh'.

Just one type of Dub-speak though - sometimes the T is swallowed up in a glottal stop instead, I've noticed.


Language connected to race

Post 986

Edward the Bonobo - Gone.

The glo'al stop is becoming mainstream English. It's a feature of 'Estuary English', the accent which has spread out from London. It's found in President-for-Life Tony's speech, so I guess that makes it official.

Incidentally, it seems that Glaswegians are - in the words of The Proclaimers - throwing the R away: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,1436972,00.html#article_continue

The correspondence of Liverpool and Dublin speech is perhaps unsurprising. Liverpool has ben called 'Ireland's Second City' (although my vote would go to Kentish Town smiley - smiley). Scouse has been termed 'equal parts Irish, Lancastrian and adenoids'.


Language connected to race

Post 987

Recumbentman

In Dublin it's not so much a glottal stop as a h (not an h, you'll notice). Saherdy is the day after Freudy.


Language connected to race

Post 988

KB

In the middle of a word though? When it's at the end though, it's a sloi' bi' more like a glohal stop.


Lost Consonants

Post 989

Edward the Bonobo - Gone.

In Glesca, 'Ra' replaces 'The'

As in 'Ah stay in Ra Shaws = I live in Pollokshaws

Something else:
In French: 'Prends-tu une verre de vin?'

In English English:
'Do you want a (cup of tea)'
or
'Would you like a....'
or
'Will you have a...'

But in Scots English:
'Will you take a whisky?' (as per French)

What about the rest of us?


Lost Consonants

Post 990

Recumbentman

Said to my brother in the North of Ireland:

"Will ye have a cup of tea now or will ye wait till ye go home?"


Lost Consonants

Post 991

Edward the Bonobo - Gone.

Then, of course, there's the famous Glesca/ Edinbugger divide:

'You'll be wanting your tea' vs 'You'll have had your tea then'


Talking like a Scot

Post 992

DA ; Simply Vicky: Don't get pithy with me!

My brother told me of a comedy performance he'd seen by Billy Connolly in which he'd said "The Scots can see the future. Someone said 'well, there's me off up the road'" smiley - laugh


Talking like a Scot

Post 993

Edward the Bonobo - Gone.

See also:

"This is me since yesterday"

and

"That's me, then" (meaning "I've finished" or "I'm off")

Not to mention the famous bus driver's phrase - "Come on! Get off"


Talking like a Scot

Post 994

Recumbentman

Or County Down football suporters: Up Down!


Talking like a Scot

Post 995

liekki

>>"This is me since yesterday"<<

So that means I've finished/I'm off?


Talking like a Scot

Post 996

Edward the Bonobo - Gone.

"This is me since yesterday" means (approximately) "I've been doing this since yesterday"

Another nice Scots expression:
"The back of nine" = "some time after nine o'clock". It can mean either a short time - as in
"I'll see you the back of nine" (probably up to about quarter past)
or a longer time:
"We didn't get home until the back of nine" (some time before 10)


Talking like a Scot

Post 997

Edward the Bonobo - Gone.

(sudden realisation)
Hah! That's Back to the Future!


Talking like a Scot

Post 998

DA ; Simply Vicky: Don't get pithy with me!

<<"That's me, then" (meaning "I've finished" or "I'm off")>>

My mother (NZ born, of recent Scots descent) used to say that...


Talking like a Scot

Post 999

liekki

Oh, so quiet...

You know how women tend to be evaluated through their marital status in many cultures/languages? I realised the other day that the Finnish word for 'man who yet doesn't have a spouse' is literally 'boy-man'. A man is not a man before he's got himself a woman.smiley - biggrin

(the female equivalent is literally 'old maid')

Back to studying for my last exam of the spring (smiley - somersault) - it's on morphology.


Talking like a Scot

Post 1000

DA ; Simply Vicky: Don't get pithy with me!

<<'man who yet doesn't have a spouse' is literally 'boy-man'. A man is not a man before he's got himself a woman.>>

That is so smiley - cool Aïna!


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