A Conversation for Ask h2g2

born again Bush

Post 81

Dark Side of the Goon

"America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter, and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
-Abraham Lincoln,
16th U.S. President (1809-1865)


az

Yes. That reminds me about the Patriot Act. Now THAT is a reason to distrust and fear George Bush.

"No, you said it was a bribe. That makes it sound like Bush is taking the credit"

Of course it's a bribe. What else would it be? A government never, ever gives out cash when it doesn't have to. Bush instituted the tax refund system to give a large chunk of America a warm fuzzy feeling because he wants a second term and he needed a domestic policy. ANY domestic policy. Plus, as we've said, most electorates vote based on the contents of their wallets. I know there are some enlightened folks here who don't (and more power to you) but you're in the minority and a chunk of cash in March to May (depending on when you file your taxes) goes down very nicely, thanks.

Here's a lesson. Howard Dean, who to my mind had some excellent ideas and was doing great things with getting grass roots Democrat support moving, killed his own campaign stone dead when he said he would increase taxes. John Kerry has been careful to say that he will not increase taxes, only repeal the Bush Administration tax cuts and reform the system.

"Well, if he's like me when I was that age, perhaps some of the time he'll spend drinking, mucking about and generally wasting his time"

High School, Blues, not College. Oh, no, wait...you're a fellow Brit. High School starts around 13, so yes, you might well have been out boozing. Things are a little stricter out here. For example, if one of my kids breaks the law, I get punished. That means if she breaks a serious law, I could go to jail. So no, at the age of 13 she's not going drinking. Not no how.

Where was I? The point Eldest was making was: she's required to go to school, complete homework (there's lots, apparently) and find herself something extracurricular to do so that she can put this on a college application. That's quite a large chunk of her time taken up already. We add RoTC to this, because she feels that she might want to join the Air Force and because it completes a Physical Activity requirement which, after 2 years, will get her the Gym credit she needs to graduate. RoTC happens in the morning. At 6 am. So, she's out of the house at 5:30. She'll be doing homework until around 6 each night. Kid's got to eat and sleep. This leaves about two hours a day during the week and then weekends. Eldest wants to get a job too, so she can do stuff like buy her own clothes.
There's nothing wrong with community service, but in this case JK is making it a requirement. From what I can see of High School, there's more than enough going on as it is.

"You're not telling me they did this from the goodness of their hearts?"
I'm not that dense.
Well, actually, I AM...but only before the second coffee.
I didn't know that the Arms industry had poured funding into his campaign. This explains a great deal. Wasn't it Bill Hicks who suggested that the first Gulf War was a test for all the cool toys the military had paid for?
Did you know that the French Government are apparently funding John Kerry? I'd love to know if that's true.


born again Bush

Post 82

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like

'Of course it's a bribe. What else would it be? A government never, ever gives out cash when it doesn't have to. Bush instituted the tax refund'
You'll forgive me, but first it was a bribe, then it was a refund that the IRS had to hand out, now it's a bribe because Bush has forced them to hand it out...So which is it actually, and if this money HAD been overpayed by the punters how did the IRS justify hanging onto it *before* Bush made them give it back? smiley - erm

As for the point about the Arms industry, well, frankly, I don't suppose they or Bush has advertised it. People start to ask difficult questions. Try and get hold of a copy of Greg palast's 'The Best Democracy Money Can Buy'. It's an eye opener - palast, for example was the first one to break the story regarding the Florida election scandal (which predictably failed to raise an eyebrow in the States).

As for the French Connection, sure, why not? As the war in Iraq *could* be interpreted as Bush ensuring that a decade of manouvering by the French and Russians failed to pay off in real terms, why shouldn't they fund his political opponents? Let's be honest, n America that runs permanently about 4 days from running out of oil couldn't run the risk of having the third largest oil fields being 'given' to the French and Russians. Also bear in mind that any medium term economic strategy HAS to take into account that a booming Chinese economy is going to be jockeying for HUGE amounts of oil and the thinking from the western powers becomes somewhat more complicated.

smiley - shark


born again Bush

Post 83

azahar

"Controversial director Michael Moore has said film studio Disney is refusing to release his new documentary, which heavily criticises President Bush."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/3685633.stm

"Fahrenheit 911 links Mr Bush with powerful families in Saudi Arabia, including that of Osama Bin Laden, and attacks his actions before and after 11 September."


Speaking of tax breaks, apparently Disney is concerned that distributing this film would endanger tax breaks it receives for its theme park, hotels and other ventures in Florida, where Jeb Bush is governor.

smiley - sadface

az


born again Bush

Post 84

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like


Of course, there are any number of questions to be asked there, such as what political afilliations does the Mouse have (i seem to recall Walt was a bit of a right winger himself), in what way is it constitutional, legal or approprite for a Governor of a State to control his tax policies depending on a bit of celluloid, and just what in the name of God did Disney think Moore was making anyway? smiley - laugh

Of course, a company in as much financial doo-doo as Disney can't afford to keep a potential money maker like Moore under wraps, so they'll either sell it on or just wait until after Novemeber. After then it will either be irrelevant (as Bush will have won again) or merely another nail in the coffin in a single term president.

Bear in mind as well that F. 911 is entered in the competition at Cannes this year and ias guaranteed to go blockbuster in most of the foreign markets - Europe and the Middle east will eat it up. For once we may get a film before the US, I guess...

smiley - shark


born again Bush

Post 85

GodBen (The Magical Astronomer) - 00000011

I found Bowling for Columbine to be very misleading. I thought that it was going to be a movie about a school bowling team trying to win the bowling championship (perhaps in memory of a teacher/student/dog called Columbine), and it turns out to be a documentry of some sorts. Honestly, think of all the children who made the same mistake and came out of the theatre with extreme leftist views.

Seriously though, while I do agree with most of the things that were said in the movie, I can't help but feel that Moore is a very unpleasant man to be around. Now if we could get him to interview Bush . . . smiley - evilgrin


born again Bush

Post 86

Dark Side of the Goon

"You'll forgive me, but first it was a bribe, then it was a refund that the IRS had to hand out, now it's a bribe because Bush has forced them to hand it out...So which is it actually, and if this money HAD been overpayed by the punters how did the IRS justify hanging onto it *before* Bush made them give it back? "

Oh.
OK, once more...with feeling.

The IRS enforces tax law. The president and the legistlative branch (Congrescritters and Senators) make the law. This means that when Bush decided to institute a series of changes to tax law, the IRS had new rules to operate by. In following these new rules, the IRS was able to hand back taxes paid by those who qualify for the refund.
People's circumstances change, so it may be that in one year they will qualify for a large refund and the next year they won't. Things like a change in job or wage, dependants leaving home etc all will alter the eligability for the refund.

Think of it like this.
That Nice Mr Blair says to the Inland Revenue:
"If a person earns less than 40 thou a year, AND has one or more school age dependants, AND does not claim any social security benefits AND has been employed for the entire previous tax year they qualify for a refund. All that cash you took out of their paycheque each month? Give them that back."

This is, more or less, what GWB did.
What he did NOT do, but which you seem to have pictured, is wander aroud the USA in a 'Del-Boy' sheepskin jacket handing out wads of used fifties saying things like "I've seen you right, squire, now you see me right come polling day. Know what I mean?"
Although it might be funny if he had and it certainly would have made things clearer.

Why would he do this?
The standard Republican stance is that Americans should be free to choose things. They should be able to pay for improved medical care, or retirement plans, or anything else that the government also offers, but independantly. In order to do this, they should have money and therefore keep what they earn.
However, it is also true that GWB wants a second term and one of the best ways to ensure this is to line the voter's pockets whereever possible with cash.
The more money you have, the more vested an interest you have in keeping hold of it so you can use it to buy things - like houses, or cars. Over the last couple of years, people have got used to getting a tax refund. As I have already said, Commerce has got into this idea in a big way and now, over March and April, adverts appear saying 'bring us your tax refund and we'll give you a brand new (whatever)!'
The increased spending power is supposed to stimulate the economy, but my feeling is that Bush wants people dependant on this refund and horrified by the prospect of John Kerry taking it away.


born again Bush

Post 87

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like


So it's a retro-active tax cut? Smart thinking, except as I recall every tax dollar west of the Hudson is already going to repay the *interest* on the US National Debt (as Ronnie Ray-Gun, the last great tax cutter and saver managed to treble the US National Debt while quaintly forgeting to tell anyone...), so where is the money coming from? Presumably unless there is some pretty heavy cutting in national expenditure (and the budget increase for the Pentagon would rather indicate to the contrary) then the US National Debt is growing bigger than topsy? That don't sound like sound financial management to me.

I mean, if I was heir apparent Jeb, I wouldn't be too pleased at the idea of inheriting that little bombshell in 4 years time...smiley - erm

smiley - shark


born again Bush

Post 88

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like

>That Nice Mr Blair says to the Inland Revenue:
"If a person earns less than 40 thou a year, AND has one or more school age dependants, AND does not claim any social security benefits AND has been employed for the entire previous tax year they qualify for a refund. All that cash you took out of their paycheque each month? Give them that back."<

Frankly, if Blair tried that in this country he';d be out on his arse in 30 seconds. No one is gullible enough to believe that there would be anything other than a deeply cynical 'Buy Votes' policy behind it...Even the tories, in their present desperate stakes, aren't trying rubbish like that on because they know that we know the maths don't add up.

Frankly, the best tax policy Blair could follow would be Dennis healey;'s advice to up the taxes on the rich ('squeeze 'em til their pips squeak' I believe was Dennis' memorable phrase smiley - laugh) and then watch the pathetic Howerd squirm as he defended the rights of boardroom directors to get outrageous sums for *failing* to do their jobs properly as we have witnessed increasingly in this country over the last ten years.

smiley - shark


born again Bush

Post 89

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like


In fact (and i apologise for the multiple postings here) it's nice to see that nothing has changed since Jello Biafra first intoned, all those years ago;

'Kiss ass while bitch
So you can get rich
While your boss gets richer off you'

The Dead Kennedys - Holiday in Cambodia

smiley - shark


born again Bush

Post 90

azahar

Mudhooks just posted this on the thread about Michael Moore, though it actually has nothing to do with Michael Moore, and so since it also has nothing to do with born again Bush I thought I'd also post it here! smiley - winkeye

Wonderful article called The War of the Words by Terry Jones.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1206738,00.html


az


born again Bush

Post 91

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like


smiley - laugh As when i read it the other morning on the train, it reminded me of Ice T's wonderful speech from 'Three Kings' (which is of course set during Gulf War I) - 'You may not call them sand n*gg*rs or dune c**ns, as I find both of these terms racially offensive. Acceptable alternatives are camel jockey and towel heads.'

Interestingly, the BBC referred to Fallija as 'the worst fighting since the *beginning* of the Gulf War' (my emphasis). Now I'm sure that Dubya said the *war* was over ages ago?

smiley - shark


born again Bush

Post 92

badger party tony party green party

I was thinking about a track that Public Enemy did during the presidentcy of another Bush and in the midst of the now defunct totally aimless and counter productive "war on drugs"

(maybe they will become like "carry on..." films or the "Now that's what I call music..." compilation albums)

Anyway Chuck D raps...

5,000 FBI agents
coming after us
with a licence to kill
thirty mil
...claiming its just a drugs bust

I thought it was poetic or paranoid exaggeration of the truth, but when you look at the US goverments actions in Afghanistan and Iraq as part of its "War on...Terror" I start to wonder if he wasnt far more accurate than I gave him credit for.

By the way Blues, wasnt it Ice Cube who was in Three Kings? Ive never seen the film but I remember he was on the posters.

one love smiley - rainbow


born again Bush

Post 93

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like


You are probably right - it is sometime since I saw the movie...smiley - smiley

smiley - shark


Removed

Post 94

azahar

This post has been removed.


born again Bush

Post 95

Noggin the Nog

All part of the shift from "The government is accountable to the people" to "The people are accountable to the government." Not that this is any way unique to the USA of course.

Blues, the US budget deficit for this year is close to 500 billion dollars, with the same again for the following two years. Makes your head spin doesn't it?

Noggin


born again Bush

Post 96

azahar

Hey! My posting just got removed! smiley - cross

Hate when that happens . . .

az


born again Bush

Post 97

Heleloo - Red Dragon Incarnate

smiley - yikes those weekend smiley - mod are really quick

I'm glad I got a chance to see the link, some of those pics were so spot on


born again Bush

Post 98

azahar

hi Helelou!

Oh, you saw it then? I just got an email saying it was either a link to an unsuitable external website or else contained a broken link. smiley - erm What's a broken link?

Yes, I had a look through some of the other cartoons and thought a lot of them were quite good.

az




born again Bush

Post 99

Heleloo - Red Dragon Incarnate

I put the link on favs after looking at a few of them, so Mr Helly could have a look tomorrow

probably unsuitable cos it is anti Dubya, there fore anti Blairsmiley - erm


born again Bush

Post 100

Blues Shark - For people who like this sort of thing, then this is just the sort of thing they'll like


Hmm, I suppose that *could* be read as electoral biase by an over-enthusiatic mod...

As both of you are outside the UK, you;'re probably not aware that we are in what is laughingly called election fever - which means 15% of the elctorate are going to turn out to vote. All of them will be retired majors who wuill vote for the party most likely to take us out of Europe, despite already having been drowned by the tide of history.

In accordance with it's charter, that means the Berbb can't be seen to favour any one viewpoint in a political argument. So anti-Blair cartoons might not be quite the thing at this time.

smiley - shark


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