A Conversation for Ask h2g2

Synchronicity

Post 1

Xanatic

I just noticed something about synchronicity on the Fortean Times homepage. And I just wanted to hear what the rest of you think the phenomena is about. And for those of you that don´t know what it is here´s an example:

"On this day in 1975 in Hamilton, Bermuda. Erskine Lawrence Ebbin was knocked off his moped and killed by a taxi. It was the same taxi with the same driver, carrying the same passenger, that killed Erskine's brother Neville in July the previous year. Both brothers were 17 when they died, and had been riding the same moped in the same street. But history never quite repeat itself: the time of the two accidents differed by 40 minutes."

It seems to me things like these cannot be said to be nothing but coincidences. But ar they some sort of fractals of space-time or what are they?


Synchronicity

Post 2

Mikey the Humming Mouse - A3938628 Learn More About the Edited Guide!

If the driver, Erskine, and the passenger were all aware of the situation, the attending emotional state would probably have increased the chance of a fatal accident.

Mikey


Synchronicity

Post 3

Xanatic

Yeah, but at the same time and place with all the same people involved? And what about that baby that fell out of the same window two years in a row only to land in the arms of the same guy? I think it might even have been the same day of the year.


Synchronicity

Post 4

Phryne- 'Best Suppurating Actress'

What about when you say the exact same thing as someone else... daily? Or three people start a conversation at once, after a long silence? This is starting to get weird.
(Spread the word of the Fortean Times, ps: where should one measure a circle starting from?)
smiley - smiley


Synchronicity

Post 5

Mycroft

The trouble with such reports is that you never get a complete picture. For example, Hamilton has a population of less than 1000, all motor vehicles purchases are massively taxed and no householder other than a doctor may have more than one car. In Bermuda even if a vehicle is completely wrecked it's cheaper to have a mechanic replace everthing except the hubcaps rather than buy a new one, so the chances that the taxi driver wouldn't be using the same taxi and that the moped wouldn't have been used by another member of the family is exceptionally small. As for the passenger, there are any number of possible reasons why it's likely she would be in that taxi. Maybe she always asked for the same driver and spent half her day in a taxi because she didn't have a car. For all we know the taxi rank is across the road from the boy's house and every time the driver pulled out he knocked someone down. Then again, maybe the driver and/or passenger had a grudge against the boys.

With regard to the baby falling out of the window, let's assume it happened on the same day two years running. Is it strange that it's the same window? Not really - there's a good chance that was the only window the baby could get to. Same day? It's actually more likely that it would've happened around the same time of year than not: you don't leave windows open in the middle of winter. Same guy? That isn't a problem either - my guess is he ran a fruit stall across the road, and after the first incident would spend most of his time looking at that window if it was open.

Of course, everything I've said maybe completely irrelevant, but the point is that no-one really wants to know. I'll bet whoever wrote up the Hamilton incident will have done nothing but look for coincidences and once a couple of them had registered, and then dismissed anything that didn't enhance the angle they were looking for.

Anyway, let's assume that these are meaningful instances and not mere coincidence. Does it actually tell us anything useful?


Synchronicity

Post 6

Phryne- 'Best Suppurating Actress'

Jung's your man. I can't quote him because I have not read anything he wrote.
Even if meaningless, (ie. small Twilight Zone things that beset me all the time), it can be pretty eerie.


Synchronicity

Post 7

Dorothy Outta Kansas

What about the "Three Buses in a Row" or crashes of Trains, Planes and Automobiles? The former happens to me at least once a week; the latter seem to be reported by the media in groups of three.

By the time I've been waiting for a bus, I'm prepared to be bitter about the group of three that eventually turn up. Reporters pounce on *another* similar accident, particularly in "Silly Season" [the time of year when normal news is rare and reporters have to seek attention-grabbing headlines].

But despite the arguments against coincidence being any more than... well... coincidence, I still maintain that we display our human arrogance by pretending we understand the intricacies (which must involve coincidence) held by the Universe.

smiley - footprints Fenny (falling off a soap box)


Synchronicity

Post 8

Phryne- 'Best Suppurating Actress'

(Thought you'd turn up soon! smiley - smiley)
Is there a set time of year for Silly Season? If so, isn't that a bit of a coincidence? (albeit one that will be explained by Mycroft in a sensible way, referring to personal perception, suggestion and some statistics. smiley - winkeye)


Synchronicity

Post 9

Mycroft

The arrogance isn't really around any more since the advent of chaos theory and the uncertainty principle, as they demonstrate that we can't figure everything out the way Newton believed.

The groups of three thing is well known: even comletely random events run in streaks and no-one knows why or probably ever will, but there are good reasons why the stuff you mentioned tend to cluster. With buses they bunch up if one of them gets slightly ahead or behind schedule: a bus which is late will usually have more passengers to pick up, which makes it even later, while the bus behind it will have less passengers to pick up and so catch up. Once two buses start leap-frogging each other they catch up the bus ahead of them. The crashes business is as much to do with the psychology of journalism as anything else: as you said it's the media reporting that gets grouped, it's not necessarily the accidents themselves. If a jumbo goes down one week it's a huge story, and while the issue dies down over the ensuing weeks as the story's sucked dry of information, every time a 2 seater Cessna takes a dive it gets disproportionately large coverage to maintain interest in the bigger story.


Synchronicity

Post 10

Dorothy Outta Kansas

*looking didactic again*
Silly season traditionally began at the start of Parliament's Summer Recess, when journalists and other media insects had nothing to report on. I think it finishes at the other end of summer.

*looking worried*
I promise I'm not following you around, Mandrake (even though I think you'd be flattered, not concerned!) I happened here by accident (or coincidence)!

smiley - footprints Fenny


Synchronicity

Post 11

Mycroft

Well I'm anti-paranoid: I'm convinced I'm following someone smiley - winkeye


Synchronicity

Post 12

Phryne- 'Best Suppurating Actress'

(apple dropping on head gesture) Ahaaa! Another one.
I had a feeling you'd be here because it's quite similar to your Brain, Synaesthesia, Colours etc. conversations. I don't mind even if you are following me around... I follow people sometimes. In real life. The trick is, to walk in front of them and keep looking round... they never suspect!
This is an odd Thing Wot Happened, and a mite scarey too:
One day I was all by myself (no one was looking smiley - winkeye) and suddenly I got the song 'The Boys are Back in Town' in my head. I'd not heard this song for weeks, and here it was and wouldn't go away. This was around midday, about 1pm. The next day, I saw my Significantother, who requested we listen to a rock compilation CD (mine). It had the song on it. When it came on, he announced "I was listening to this yesterday..." at about 1pm.
Aaargh! Not to mention the Numbers Game.


Synchronicity

Post 13

Mycroft

It is indeed freakish that Significantother has to ask permission to put on a CD smiley - biggrin


Synchronicity

Post 14

Bernie Risenfall

By the strangest coincidence I have been following Mycroft around. It is refreshing to hear common sense offered without the slightest hint of a condescending air. My own view would have cynically suggested both boys had somehow offended the Taxi passenger and the driver was merely paid to kill them. Now I see that this is a less than charitable suggestion. smiley - cheers


Synchronicity

Post 15

Phryne- 'Best Suppurating Actress'

He has to ask permission to speak, also. smiley - winkeye


Synchronicity

Post 16

Dorothy Outta Kansas

I've turned the radio on, to get rid of a song that's in my head, and found it playing on the radio station I tuned to...

No, I wasn't able to hear another radio.

I've played and won the Numbers Game, too. Husband says "Think of a number", and I do, and it's invariably the one he decided on. I wouldn't count that as Coincidence, though. I actually hear his mind yelling "THREE"!

x x Fenny (in telepathic mood)


Synchronicity

Post 17

Phryne- 'Best Suppurating Actress'

Yes, same thing... in a bizarre twist, I thought of 3 but changed it to 7 at the last moment. He guessed 3. I said no, and he replied "It was going to be 3, but you changed it to seven."


Synchronicity

Post 18

Mycroft

Bernie, I do hope you were being sarcastic about my lack of condescension otherwise you're going to be very disappointed if you follow me for much longer smiley - winkeye


Synchronicity

Post 19

Mycroft

Bah, that's nothing! Tell him he needs to ask permission to think if you want to have some real fun smiley - devil


Synchronicity

Post 20

Phryne- 'Best Suppurating Actress'

He's a loveable curmudgeon, really. smiley - winkeye

Something else: I like Beethoven's 9th symphony, and it passes the time on long car journeys. So, here I was with it approaching the Ode to Joy (which, incidentally, can be rewritten as a song about dogs), watching the landscape of Northumbria in the sun, which was all very nice. I went to half-sleep, opening my eyes just before the big choral finish... at which, I looked out of the window and saw a rainbow.
smiley - smiley
Aaaah.
I was a bit disappointed to see no glowing hosts of angels, though. (Or at least a couple making love in the snow surrounded by people applauding.)


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