h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

What about suggesting that certain areas be open for unedited entries in languages other than English as a sort of experiment? I've heard plenty of reference to Polyglot Plaza, and as I didn't ever see it before I don't know exactly what it was, but it seems that it might just be possible to open a place where people could use their choice of language without it infiltrating all of h2g2.

A benefit to that approach would be that few people are going to make the effort to translate a bundle of unmoderated conversations to risk being offended. And I suspect that those who have had their form of expression limited by the English only rule would be some of the first to notify the moderators if there were something truly questionable in there, for fear of losing the freedom to use their native tongue.

I'm not at all sure this would be feasible, but I haven't seen it suggested in my random bounces through the debate. It certainly isn't a perfect solution, but it might be a way to gain a little bit of ground in a more-or-less controlled setting.

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Hmmmmm.... point taken, :X
But....how long do you suppose it's going to take to have that entry moderated out of existence? **POOF** That's why the suggestion was for a bit of compromise.

Now, will you give a translation here, or shall I mutilate it?

Interesting. It took about an hour. The postings were in French. Here's what they said.

Do not speak.
:X
Do not think.
:X
Do not feel.
:X
It is only an English world.
:X
It is necessary to obey.
:X
It is always necessary to follow.
:X

M.o.G.,

Sounds like an interesting compromise. What does everybody else think?

:X (THDoM),
please be careful! They may ban people who continuously break the language rule. I realize you're protesting the situation by forcing it to be deleted, but be aware that they may get rid of people who knowingly and continuously break their rules.

The language "rule" is not a rule. It is clear in the House Rules that non-English postings are not a violation; they are only hidden until multi-lingual moderators can be found:

"Postings or entries containing languages other than English may be removed. Because we have to ensure we understand a posting or Guide Entry before we can pass it, languages other than English may have to be removed."

It doesn't say, "please don't post in languages other than English."

OTOH, it does take moderator time which could be better spent restoring "legacy" (pre-BBC) material.

GTB

The h2g2 policy on only allowing English until translators of other languages can be found has the effect right now of blocking anything but English. The disadvantages of this policy (that it blocks Welsh and Gaelic and any other languages of minorities within the UK, discourages participation by speakers of other languages who may be less fluent in English, discourages English speakers from practicing other languages here) outweigh the advantages (??? keeping the lawyers happy who don't believe that reactive moderation is acceptable?).

Since this policy is based on the premise that pro-active moderation is necessary, since it is clear that pro-active moderation is more costly and not mandated by law, then it would be better for this policy to be dropped.

I'm sorry, GTB, I see what you're saying now. My interpretation of the House Rules is that they could ban you for causing them to moderate your language just like they could ban you for persistently spamming or impersonating others. I put up a question on a forum under the House Rules at http://www.bbc.co.uk/h2g2/guide/F63189?thread=106519 to get an answer on this. (I tried to make it clear that I wasn't protesting, but asking a legitimate question.)

Well, of course I agree the policy should be dropped - I think all pro-active moderation should be dropped! I don't, however, think that anyone is likely to be exiled for speaking languages other than English. (Oddly, they are banned de facto, although not de jure) I'll keep tabs on the thread you mentioned.

GTB

> "I don't, however, think that anyone is likely to be exiled for speaking languages other than English."

Exactly so. You will only be banned (temp or perm) for breaking the T&C - un petit peux de Francais won't get you in any *trouble*, no matter how bad you are at speaking it. Unless, of course, you say something which translates to something against the T&C.

An interesting theory... I suspect TPTB might be able to persuade the higher PTB to allow a small section "as an experiment" - after all, this is meant to be partly R&D for the BBC, right?

Suggest it on the community soapbox - see what people think...

"(Oddly, they are banned de facto, although not de jure)"

Damn it, I don't know Latin! Somebody remove that post by GTB! He might be swearing at me!

"De jure" to you too, buddy!

Peta replied to my question. She said it might come down to more of a judgement call of whether the person making the posts seemed to be doing so in order to be "anti-social" or for the purpose of giving extra work to the moderators. So I think my interpretation is correct, to some extent. If Zaphodistas intentionally posted dozens of messages or guide entries in languages other than English, they could receive warnings, and could eventually be banned.

But like I wrote in that question to Peta, I don't think the moderators would be mean in this case. A person would have to put in a lot of effort to get banned just for this.

Oy vey. So many abbreviations! LOL! Of course it's not the best solution, but in a place where the contributors hold NO power (practically speaking) it's a potential point of negotiation. And if we're nice and behave politely perhaps those in control of the funding for this lovely laboratory we all enjoy so much will decide that proactive moderation is not especially cost effective. Seems to be the rule in corporations, though when governments get mucked up in it....dunno.... just have to try and see.

Off to hunt down the community soapbox, now. Thanks, Lucinda

Done.
Now, if someone would be kind enough to post the link to the conversation under the same name in Community Soapbox I'd be eternally greatful.
I'm STILL a cybermoron, and as I'm on vacation and influenced by several cosmicpolitans at the moment, I'm not in the mood to try it in a test place.
Muchas Gracias! (for the moderators = thanks a lot!)

Mother, your new message forum in the Community Soapbox is at http://www.bbc.co.uk/h2g2/guide/F55683?thread=106679