h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

When an inappropriate article appears in peer review its very predictable that very rude and unfriendly comments will follow with very little thought to guiding the new researcher to the appropriate venue or how to improve.

The H2g2 guidelines give lip service to politeness and civility. I would think that a "yikes" on rude postings in peer review might make a few of the peer review "beasts" sit up and take notice of the effect they have on dampening future contributions and even on participation in the peer review process.

All Scouts must adhere to the Scouts code of conduct, which you can check out here <./>Scouts-Code</.>. It specifically states:

"Scouts have a responsibility to the Researchers whose work they are criticising and to the other members of the team. It is vital that Scouts are unfailingly polite to Researchers. When posting to the the Peer Review Page, you must always consider the feelings of those whose work you are criticising. Most Researchers are not professional writers, and it is vital that Scouts are positive in their feedback - suggest how to improve entries, rather than simply say that they are not good enough. Scouts who consistently leave tact out of their dealings with Researchers may be asked to leave the group."

I think for the most part we adhere to that very well, and occasionally have to put up with some rather unfriendly replies to simple suggestions ourselves. Especially when you consider we're volunteers, I think we get rather more stick than we deserve, and don't seem to see the critics volunteering themselves. If there are any specific incidents of a Scout being 'rude and unfriendly', perhaps the best place to complain is on the Scouts' homepage or to the Editors.

It's rather difficult to determine who is a scout. It's fairly easy to see who is rude and unfriendly. I'm sure that all scouts adhere to this code of conduct.

If you click on the person's name, there'll be a badge on the right hand side of their space

Interesting...and you've never noticed any Peer Review violations of the scout creed on civility in all your years of scouting?

Well, six months

Not from scouts, no. I've seen review comments from other researchers that are overly negative, though - which I always correct if I see. Scouts are, contrary to popular myth, quite friendly and helpful people who will go a heck of a long way to help entries into the guide. What does happen is that researchers get very defensive about what they've written, some don't want to make changes or make adjustments even to fit in with the guidelines, and get narky when they find we won't pick the entry til they do. Believe it or not, its normally the scout that gets picked on for making suggestions, not the researcher for writing the entry. We actually want good entries to go in the guide.

I stand corrected...just allow me let me copy and paste a few of the extremely negative and nasty peer review comments that have popped up just in the last day or two on inapprpriate postings and then post them here along with the scout or no scout status of the reviewer...that should put the issue to bed once and for all.

Steady on, Phred! Give me a link to them and I'll go and take a look, if you really want me to. We're both writing from different experiences, clearly, and I have no wish for things to get personal here - I enjoy your journals and posts. I'd be horrified if scouts were abusing their position.

Ok...Thanks for stopping me before this became too personal. However, there are scouts who continue to treat inappropriate postings with much less than unfailing politeness...unless these bullies are eventually "outed" the peer review process will never attract new authors as it could if the guidelines for scouts were actually followed.

Do you have an e-mail address?

Yes, its skankyrich[at]excite[dot]com

Feel free to let me know whatever you need to.

Any offensive posting anywhere in the Guide including Peer Review can be yikesed, if you feel that that is a better way of tackling the issue than talking.

It makes no difference whether the poster is a Scout or not; that shouldn't colour your views of the offensiveness or otherwise of a post, and yikesed postings will be moderated to the same standard whoever posted them.

Just popping in to reinforce what Bernadette just said: it doesn't matter if people are Scouts, first-time researchers, Italics, former h2g2 staff members, whatever - basic rules of politeness and civility are at the core of h2g2 and everyone should be treated equally.

Therefore, if you see any posting that you think doesn't meet those standards, hit the 'yikes' button so that we can take a look at it. If we notice any decline in the behaviour of a particular group or individual, then we can address it MUCH easier via the yikes system.

Cheers!

Paully

I've noticed that of all the people who comment on this matter, it appears that very few are, or want to be a Scout. You've been active in PR Phred, and have made very worthwhile contributions to a number of threads. Why don't you apply to become a Scout? I reckon we could do with an extra one or two right now, although that might not be the opinion of the Eds.

Well, the Scout page says they *are* currently recruiting and I've put my name down for it.

Indeed we could! Pop along to our volunteers page (which is bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/brunel/volunteers) to find out how you can sign up.

We're recruting right now!

Paully

I certainly have toyed with the idea of writing an entry or two for the guide but, having seen some of the "constructive" criticisms levelled at entries up for review, feel somewhat nervous of submitting an article for peer review.

A little less aggression from some of the reviewers would make me more inclined to enter into the spirit of things.

If you feel that you a good entry and you've followed the guidelines, there's no reason to expect anything but constructive criticism and suggestions to make your entry even better.

Or you could you drop it into the Writing Workshop first. I know the WW can be something of a dead-end, but several good entries have come out of there, often because a Scout has told the author 'This is bloody good - get it into PR, PDQ'.

Incidentally, I wonder how many of the non-Scout PR regulars are also subscribed to the WW and play an active part there too?

I'm a scout and I've commented on this matter I don't think it matter who it is that's making the comments or criticisms... almost ever, really.

However, if you want to make a change, you have to lead by example, or so I've found. I think you'd make a very good scout Phred, though I'd hate to give part of you up from the UG.

I know how you feel Agent... I felt that way when I first got here. If the positive folks are going to be louder and more forceful presence in PR, they simply have to outnumber the folks who are all too negative. Maybe we should draft a few of them

Paully, are any of the Italics actually subscribed to the Volunteer pages? I've noticed that sometimes requests get picked up almost immediately and sometimes it takes a few months.

I someone around here who has a certain reputation for being less than unfailingly polite on occasion, let me give what I hope, is a rather more differentiated and considered response to this issue.

Firstly, there is a difference between being a bear and being a bully. I'd probably fit into the former category but I'd hate to be classed as the latter. Bears don't tend to suffer fools. Bullies get their kicks from making others feel inferior. I've seen plenty of the latter recently had have confronted it head on but not, funnily enough, in PR. Much of the bullying has been centred around other conversation threads where people with unfashionable and misguided views have been given a good kicking by some notorious yobbos around here.

Secondly, if people don't like what someone else has said, then there are the options of either hitting the Yikes button or confronting it there and then. Starting off whispering campaigns by circulating URL's to others' postings is divisive and underhand.

Thirdly, if you *are* going to get het-up about manners, then it helps to remember that most of us have got a finite supply of forbearance. To be unfailingly positive about each and every entry that we come across is as valueless as being unfailingly negative. There have been a number of postings recently where the author has plainly NOT read any of the advice regardless of the admonition-strewn path one must take to the Submit button. Moreover, at least one of these has been downright offensive and disgusting.

This kind of behaviour would not be tolerated in RL, so why should it be tolerated on here? I've been threatened with murder along with my family. I don't like this kind of stuff, even in jest. So, to sum up, by all means get annoyed about lack of politeness, but there's a hell of a lot more to being a Scout than being polite, and bleating about others lack of manners won't necessarily empty their shoes for you to slip into.