h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Please, no!!! Not the 'Faith' discussion again!!! Anything but that

Patriarch, if you want to get involved in the 'Atheism is a religion. You need faith to believe. No you don't. Yes you do. Round and round in circles ad nauseum' debate, go to GB's Approved Atheism article and look in the forums there. You'll love it

Ooops. Apparently I had more to say. I just forgot.

Would the Americans here agree that possibly the reason for the lack of an RE class in US schools was due to the fact that the majority of inhabitants are Christian, regardless of the particular flavour?

Possibly why RE has been added to the curriculum in UK schools is because the UK really is a hotch-potch of different cultures and religions these days, that it really is compulsary so that the kids know each others identities, as well as their own. In the US (as far as I know), the huge majority is still Christian and so therefore RE class would be less relevant. I agree, teaching as part of history would probably be a better idea. That way, hopefully the fundamentalists will not be able to have as much of a say in it either.

hm.. yes, I would agree with that AA
Good thing someone else picked up on the fact that the faith discussion was creeping back into this forum, It could have gotten very violent in here.
The fact that christianity is so prevelent in our education system (the teachers and the like) is the main reason RE won't work, I think I said that earlier in some post, but it fades from my memory If we could some how convince them to be unbiased, if would work though, and get some sort of logical base for the children of America to draw from (at least as far as religion goes).
And I would also like to agree with GB, that the historical education would succed in giving that base, and *should* be mandatory in US schools, and elsewhere for that mattter if it isn't already.

The US is also a hodge-podge of religions, possibly more so than anywhere else. But the Christian influence is so intolerant that the other religions are suppressed, and the xtians would be VERY unhappy to give those religions equal time. Something about exposing their precious kids to heathen ideas and practices, I guess. Remember, there are only certain parts of the country where it's okay to practice other religions... in the Corn Belt or the Bible Belt, they're holier than Jesus... just ask them. Luckily I live in probably the most secular parts of the country, and certainly the most tolerant. Not only is atheism tolerated here, but my religious friend Eddie wants me to be his son's godfather in spite of my atheism. But I'm sure GreyRose's experiences are much different.

And as that timeline points out on that link for the history of creation/evolution litigation in the US, too many people are trying to prevent children from learning science, much less other religions. An RE class could be taught in the more tolerant areas, but nationwide, would be impossible.

As for the First Amendment stuff, there is one point to remember: "Freedoms must be protected for the few who would abuse them, else you deny them to the majority who won't." So we have to allow the idiots to abuse the 1st, because if we take away that right, they'll use their political clout to end all opposition.

Hi guys!

I have to write fast, I'm on borrowed time. I'm experiencing hardware problems not encountered since the Captain of the Hindenburg turned to his Number Two and said, "I say, is it supposed to be this hot in here?" My hard disk is on it's last legs, and I think it borrowed those from someone who'd already given up the ghost. Once I have fixed these problems, I shall return to throw in my usual selection of narrow-minded viewpoints, overly sarcastic ripostes and weakly thought-out arguments. Until then, sorry, you'll have to manage without! If you really want to contact me, I suggest telepathy, smoke signals and carrier pigeon. Well, not carrier pigeon, my Grandad still eats pigeon.

I haven't been around, and have noticed that membership has swelled somewhat. Hello to all you new members! Hope you're all preparing book reviews for me, otherwise we shall have to instigate some sort of initiation ritual (which will almost certainly involve listening to an entire album by one of those new-fangled muppet boybands).

Also, I have a question regarding one of the new members in particular, although I confess I dread the answer. Apologies if you have already detailed this elsewhere, but an average page is taking about six minutes to download - not including all the hard resets - so I have to be selective!

What on earth does the Chairman of Breasts do?

I still don't get it. The First Amendment appears to be meant to protect peoples rights to the freedom of religion (among other things). The xtian community suppresses all the other religions, which in my opinion clearly is a violation against the First Amendment, and nobody objects? In practice that means that the First Amendment protects the xtian community from all others, but NOT the other way around. In fact, the FA is used to discriminate the religious minorities and the entire american community allows this to continue.

I hope all US-citizens will forgive me the next blasphemic statement, but from the above I can only conclude that the first amendment is a load of crap, not worth the paper it is written on.

Where a rule is applied so strictly and without exception, there clearly is no justice. But again, the above is strictly my personal opinion as a non-american.

FA allows freedom of religion, speech, press, assembly, etc; pretty much anything that won't hurt anybody but might be unpopular. FA protects all religions. The xtians have a majority in public office, so the doctrine that enforces the separation of Church and State works for them; if they feel that teaching kids about all religions is a violation of that (which they certainly will), they'll use the separation as an explanation for negating the bill. Without the doctrine, we'd live in a Christian nation, once the different denominations got done squabling.

Wait, that might be fun. The squabling, not the Christian nation.

-jb

Sorry then, Mummy, could you provide me with proof that god does not exist?
Surely atheism is about a lack of belief in an all powerfull god, rather than a set of people who systematically set out to proove he does not exist? And atheism does not mean being without religion, it means being without god. So there.
If you start getting offended and cliquey as soon as people have a different opinion to you, then you lose all credibility.
i.e. you're talking crap.

How can I prove there's no god to people who would consider my arguments invalid, or even religious?

Although this would actually belong with the article on atheism, rather than here, I'll give you the two most important pieces of evidence.

1. At least the last few centuries that has been absolutely no proof that he *does* exist.
2. If he did exist, he would surely have done something about a few atrocities here and there, such as WWII, the nuclear bomb, etc. (which we all know he didn't)

If a god really existed, he would not have let it come this far. He would have *cared* for us. And since obviously nobody *does*, that means that clearly nobody claims the seat of god. It's vacant!

The fact that atheism *literally* means 'without god' rather than 'without religion', does *not* hold the evidence that we are therefor a religious group. A religious group holds a set of beliefs, given to them by some deity. They follow a path that has been pointed out to them by one or more prophets. These two descriptions can not be used for atheists.

And last but not least: since when is being offended the same as losing credibility? Your opinion about almost anything is ok with me.
If you want to believe that gods existence or non-existence can not be verified; fine. I can live with that. But if you describe atheists as yet another group of believers, then you're simply missing the point of what atheists are saying, doing, and (not) believing in.

i.e. my crap is no worse than yours

Now now Calm down
Going back to previous postings - Isn't Judaism really HUGE in the US?
And although I have heard of a few people who claim to be Christians / whatever without believing in God I would suggest that they really are the exception and that only a handful on the planet exist. And I thought I would stick my oar in here too to say that Atheism is *not* a Religion.. How could anyone possibly seriously think it is? That's just splitting non existant hairs (or something) that is.

http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Senate/2680/index.html

That is absolutely hilarious.

-jb

I haven't laughed that hard in years!! Thanks for that one AA.
I have a Mark Twain quote on the topic, but since I'm not at home, I have no access to the book, so I might post it later, if it is still pertinant.

That site was hilarious, I must say... until I saw the stuff promoting mutilation. Didn't find that funny at all, so (naturally) I sent them some hate mail. My response was well written, though, so they'll never post it.

I think the Twain quote you're looking for is my favorite: "When I reflect upon the number of disagreeable people who I know have gone to a better world, I am moved to lead a different life." But then, I don't know of any Twain passages that deal directly with masturbation.

That would work fine, I'm sure the qoute is in "Letters From the Earth", something about how all protestants masturbate. It could take me a while to find though, unlike the one I used in the I'm taking names forum, I got lucky and found that one rather quick.

Good Gravy, this is some sophisticated humour. At least I hope so. The scary thing is that though it would be easy to write such a thing as a parody of over the top zealousness, I am certain the views expressed by this website strikes a chord *somewhere*.

And back to a few topics ago... Atheism may not be a religion, but in America, Atheism should have the same PROTECTIONS that all religions have. I remember hearing something not to long ago about American Athiests getting representation in some sort of advisory board for the president so that their views could be presented along with those of other spiritual leaders.

America is pretty diverse as far as religions go. In my own city, we have Christian churches of nearly every denomination you can think of Catholic, Protestant, and Orthodox, Mormon churches, Jewish synogouges, a Sikh temple, Muslim Mosques, Buhddist temples, even a Shinto Shrine.

The PROBLEM is that Fundamentalist Christians just can't stand people disagreeing with their beleifs. That is why an organization such as the Christian Coalition works so hard to make the laws of our government match the commandments found in their holy tome.

The Twain quote I used is from "Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar", so it's pretty easy to find, and I keep my copy of the collection that has it right next to my computer.

As far as humor, that's what I thought it was... initially. Then I realized that it was an immature theologist's true feelings, by the way the emails were handled, and the way mutilation was supported. That sort of thing just isn't funny.

Oh, I'm certain it's not a joke site. The people who wrote this seem deadly serious, and unfortunately from what other religious stuff I have seen/heard about over the years, it is well within the realms of possibility.

I didn't bother to send them an e-mail, mainly because:
a) I didn't know where to start.
b) I'm sure that although I may have started out with good intentions to try point out where they were wrong, I would have ended up just hurling abuse at them, and it looks like they get enough of that already
c) You can't argue with this sort of person. They are convinced that they are making sense, and no-one will change their mind. Basically, small-minded, worryingly-stupid Christians.

The most ironic thing about this site is that if only the parents of these people had tried masturbating more ofter rather than procreating, then maybe these fuckwits would not have been born. Therefore, they disprove their own argument that masturbation is a bad thing

I'm off to go and do a bit of 'self-abuse'.

Oh my stars! What a sheltered and evil life I've led! On a slightly scarier and just a tad more freaky note though...
while I was searching for this websites anti masturbation equipment, I found these guys,
http://members.internettrash.com/shockingtruth/manifesto.html

(please don't eat before viewing.) Cheers, yours in glorius onanism, ---- Ado!

ACK!!!! That's appaling, I can't beleive they actaully put their names at the bottom. They probably have a lot of threats against their lives. Hmm.... that page sounds just a tad Third Reichish.