h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Wow, I had no idea about the philosophical depth behind the sub-culture. I thought, back in the 80's, when I *was* a Goth, I was wearing all black, plus capes, vintage clothes, pike shoes (which are still in my closet BTW), silver jewelry, and vampire makeup, that I was doing it just to look cool.

Methinks the style came first, the justification only recently.

Signed,

Someone who has seen The Damned, The Cramps, Sisters of Mercy, Siouxsie and the Banshees, Jesus and Mary Chain, Skinny Puppy, The Mission UK, Love and Rockets (not really Goth, I know), The Cult, The Cure, Christian Death, Ministry (before they went industrial), and so on and so forth live.

Hi there!
Sorry, all my knowledge on the 80's Goths is hearsay, so I can't really comment on that. I'd welccome any input on the 80's scene for that reason. Could you go along with replacing Philosophy by Attitude?

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Who saw The Sisters of Mercy, Velvet Acid Christ, The Mission, Anne Clark, Cassandra Complex and Fields of the Nephilim at the Mera Luna festival this year (Sorry, couldn't resist that one. I do take you serious and don't want to start a gothier-than-thou-flame). Missed out on Christian Death at the 2000 WGT, we'll see what comes of the 2001 WGT [URL removed moderator]

Sorry, I didn't mean to give the impression of a flamer. I wanted to make sure that it was understood that I knew whereof I spoke...

Christian Death are still around? I haven't followed the scene or any of the bands for the last 10 years. As I remember it, the scene was *all* attitude and no philosophy. Unless you count the over-blown ramblings of Anne Rice.

The 80's Scene, mmmmmm...let's see. It was all about Anne Rice. At that time "The Vampire Lestat" blew everyone away in the States. Especially in San Francisco, where I am from, and where she was living at the time. Clothes, particularly from vintage (read: second hand) stores, black leather--and plenty of it!, tons of silver jewelry (popular motifs: ankhs, skulls, bats, crosses, spikes/thorns) were the first sign one was dealing with a Goth. Next came the makeup. You know what that looks like. The bands. Very important. Seeing them live all important. At that time industrial was just starting up, and was considered cutting edge when compared to the atmospheric sounds of C. Death, et. al. I had a particular fondness for the Damned (Dave Vanian was GOD, I even dyed and styled my hair like his) and the Cramps (a punk/rockabilly fusion group--their "I Was a Teenage Werewolf" meant instant inclusion in the Goth world).

The taste in film, books, art, drink (red wine, naturally), hangouts (graveyards) and home decoration had to reflect the Goth scene. So, plenty of Ken Russell flicks (ever seen "Gothic"?), kinky sex (bondage), vampire tales, coffins in the living room, candles, velvet draperies and duvets, well, you get the picture. It was style over substance. So, I felt a little silly reading about the modern Goth scene, with all the justifications and explanations. An adoration of death was the closest we came to a philosophy. Mind you, had anyone a really *close* brush with death, they quickly changed their tune...

About 15 years ago the Haight-Ashbury in SF changed from a hippie mecca into a Goth/Punk mecca. That, in addition to Telegraph Avenue in Berkeley, was *the* place to see and be seen. I'm probably leaving a lot out, but that's what this oldtimer remembers!

No no... I didn't get the impression of you being a flamer, but I just couldn't resists pointing out that a whole bunch of the grand old groups underwent re-surrection, if a Goth band can be called "dead". (Speaking of that, someone managed to dig out Front 242 for the 2001 WGT and I thgought that they were *really* gone for good)

The attitude/philosophy thing -as I see it- boils down to the question at what poit does an attitude become an philosophy? Was there no distaste for the mundane life(-style) etc? Hmp, well.. maybe Philosophy in the sense of "the rational investigation of the truths and principles of being, knowledge, or conduct" is a bit too strong in the Goth context. But Philosophy as "a system of principles for guidance in practical affairs" would fit. Guidance in practical affairs as in 'which colour to wear'

Very interesting account of the 80's scene. Quite frankly, I had no idea of the US-Goth-Scene. To me it consisted just of some kids adoring Marylin Manson. Coming to think of it though, a country with 250,000,000 people in it should sprout its Goth scene. Never too late to get a misconception set straight. Thanks for that! Actually, I met a guy and a couple from the US at the WGT who told me that they flew all the way to visit a number of festivals in Europe. From that I inferred that the Goth scene had to be very very underground/small. But maybe they'd had it made and could afford just popping over for a bit of song and dance.

The gear/makeup/decoration etc the scene didn't really change a lot over the years, did it?

Cheers
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I prefer to think of philosophy as a means of exploration and notetaking.

'Nonnie

(Nice article. )

Christian Death are actually going to play at the WGT this year, I think I'll seak a look at them if time permits . Too bad that Fields of the Nephilim cancelled their appearance

Bummer.

Speaking as a bit of a FotN completist (tho' having never seen them live) I'd love to be albe to go to see one of their gigs, even though I'm not too sure about some of their more recent stuff (One More Nightmare comes to mind).

I saw them last year and it was great ...

*sulks*