h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

hi rg

Returned home a few days ago from my (involuntarily) extended 'holiday'.

delay meant I have had to catch up with things workwise but I'll reply to your last tomorrow.

Weather here cold but above zero Some light rain but no obvious chaos. The Elbe has flooded due to rain upstream but the flood gates installed after the Great Flood of 1962*.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Hamburg+Great+flood+1962&client=firefox-a&hs=kDO&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=np&tbm=isch&imgil=n09ZdW6M5WFM1M%253A%253Bhttps%253A%252F%252Fencrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com%252Fimages%253Fq%253Dtbn%253AANd9GcRzFvZ3N7qCh2kM4CQlXdeN6g514ruvFiesLzCVaZ9ApFLLREPaHw%253B900%253B587%253Ba3lERC9VWw1aZM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.environmentandsociety.org%25252Farcadia%25252Fgreat-flood-1962-hamburg&source=iu&usg=__U0alNCX4nZmFXOI2UxrmRzOV_Ss%3D&sa=X&ei=BXn5UufwJpGqhAewkYGYBA&ved=0CEIQ9QEwAw&biw=1024&bih=593#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=EVKCEkiJ9E4uhM%253A%3B-SMGmLriw-GHuM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.hzg.de%252Fimperia%252Fmd%252Fimages%252Fgkss%252Fpresse%252Fpressemitteilungen%252F2010%252F09112007152.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.hzg.de%252Fpublic_relations%252Fpress_releases%252F010292%252Findex_0010292.html.en%3B2592%3B1944

seem to have done the trick though Dresden has been badly hit:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/10103478/Europe-floods-Elbe-River-surges-into-Dresden.html

* homes of about 60,000 people were destroyed, and the death toll of 315

Hi Bx4

[YL]"In the Czech Republic, firefighters said some 700 Czech villages, towns and cities have been hit by flooding in the last few days and some 20,500 people had to be evacuated."

I'm not sure chaos is the right word either. Whilst I've not personally heard it used in the context of recent weather; I have noted that BBC Sulfur haven't been shy about beating their climate change drum.

bs

hi rg

Yr 1999

>>The same could be said about benefits in general. These too are paid by a combination of taxes and borrowing. There is no pot; as in a pile of money laid down by the previous generation to draw on.<<

I have not claimed otherwise. Clearly when the public sector is in deficit (the 'UK debt' there can be). Pensions and other benefits are funded by current taxation including taxation on private And (in some situations) state pensions. However one's state pension is calculated on the basis of ones contributions:

'The basic State Pension is based on the National Insurance contributions you've paid or have been credited with during your working life.'

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/pensioners/pension-statepension.htm#1

>>No doubt. Though unless this population growth is sustained the inheritance for the following generation will be to have more pensions to find per head. Is the island growing bigger?<<

No but it does not mean that it overpopulate though some areas might be:

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=uk+population+density+by+region&client=firefox-a&hs=W1L&sa=X&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=np&tbm=isch&imgil=Az_u6Ji91giiYM%253A%253Bhttps%253A%252F%252Fencrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com%252Fimages%253Fq%253Dtbn%253AANd9GcTrqAlicYVy7jTRC6T1wSSzXXyZj2ozWP61zuqgRHaX7yDvRpEY%253B871%253B1346%253B1ZxpQ2TKNcXs0M%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fen.wikipedia.org%25252Fwiki%25252FBritish_Isles&source=iu&usg=__MgNozpM55wXypKTmbQRCF6Vjl1Y%3D&ei=9_r8UqXdLdKWhQe_mYHYDg&ved=0CG4Q9QEwCg&biw=1024&bih=622#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=Az_u6Ji91giiYM%253A%3B1ZxpQ2TKNcXs0M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fupload.wikimedia.org%252Fwikipedia%252Fcommons%252F5%252F5c%252FBritish_Isles_population_density_2011_NUTS3.svg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fen.wikipedia.org%252Fwiki%252FBritish_Isles%3B871%3B1346

>>I find walking through Dartmoor Forest problematic. I realise we solved the tree scarcity issue with technology like steel for hulls instead of oak. International trade has helped us to drain down other people's natural resources. Out of sight, out of mind. Still I can't help but notice that the woodland between Oxford and Windsor has also gone. Houses *have* to be built somewhere. We surely didn't think we could multiply our population ten fold without there being a price to pay? And now Labour and the Evil Tories are set to allow towns to grow. Oh great.<<

I can't comment on English forests save that I was once taken into the 'New Forest' and was surprised to find it was more like a suburbia with trees. Also you might be guilty of overhasty generalisation since in Scotland reforestation is proceeding apace.

http://www.wildlifeextra.com/go/news/scotland-forest.html#cr

Also we have historically 'drained down other peoples natural resources, as far as wood is concerned there has been a move towards the use of wood from sustainable forest management:

http://www.iwpawood.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=181#.Uvz-ffuRjow

>>I agree. Also the climate (or do I mean weather) isn't set in concrete.<<
Both I think. Changes in the climate produce chages in the weaher?

The BBC's coverage of the impact of the weather seems somewhat restricted to parts of the South despite the Thames flooding being quite mild.

>>So in addition to lopsided devolution you'd have lopsided devo-max and/or lopsided federalism inflicted on the rest of us? Or was the plan for us all to have a binding vote across the whole nation? <<

'lopsided devolution' was a attempt by Nulabour to reduce the effect of the nationalist vote on Westminster. None of the Unionist parties there fell the need to give English voters a vote on a devolved English parliam because the rightly perceive that English voters are apathetic on the issue. Afaik, oly the SNP and Pupport a referendum on a devoleved English parliament.

>>I seem to remember it was you who pointed to the ebb (or was it flow) of Wessex's territory? The state was still called Wessex during this time presumably? <<

Your analogy fails because at no time did Wessex the appellation Great wessex' when it absorbed neighbouring Kingdoms.

>>
I don't know what the reasoning was in the minds of the proponents. As said before it was as unnecessary then as it will be completely unnecessary come Scottish independence imv. <<

I would think the change from 'Ireland' to 'Northern Ireland' was made to reflect the fact that the UK government no longer exercised over Southern Ireland.

>>By chance I heard 'Any Questions' from Neath and the topic of the Welsh Language and in particular the provision of teaching in the medium of Welsh came up. What surprised me was just how divided the audience were. Neath/Port Talbot voted 2:1 in favour of devolution in Blair's poll (as compared to near enough 1:1 nationally). Perhaps the audience (not a representative sample of the electorate I know) cared more about Welsh devolution than teaching through the medium of Welsh?
<<

Perhaps, but my point was that the Welsh Language Act 1967 repealed the Laws in wales Acts and the Berwick and Wales Act (as far as Wales was concerned). So in effect it 'de-annexed' Wales.

>>The other factor that came through loud and clear was that the First Minister didn't hold back on taking every opportunity to blame Westminster (well the Evil Tories mostly) for every ill.<<

Not surprising perhaps as the FM leads a Labour Welsh administration.

>>Perhaps the Evil King should grant them an independence referendum and let them sort themselves out.<<

I don't think the Labour administration in Cardiff have ever advocated independence for Wales though keen on promoting the Welsh language.

>>They could have their own Tory free state and everything will be rosy forever. Except when the pesky English won't join some EU scheme or other; thus in some yet to be apparent way causing hardship to their neighbours.<<

The problem may be that should Slick Dave's 'guaranteed' referendum result in the UK leaving the EU the 'Celtic Fringe' might well prefer to leave the UK.

Oops! I think I might have replied to our post already but I'll post this one anyway

Hi Bx4

I'll catch up over the weekend. Meanwhile...

"'The basic State Pension is based on the National Insurance contributions you've paid or have been credited with during your working life.'"

This isn't quite like HMRC (or whatever they are calling themselves this week) claiming "'The basic State Pension is funded by the National Insurance contributions you've paid or have been credited with during your working life.'

Let's hope that following generations honour the 'contract'.

bs

Hi Bx4

"...it does not mean that [the UK is] overpopulate[d] though some areas might be..."

Clearly this is a matter of opinion. I'd quite like that the 'wilderness' areas of your linked map are kept nay expanded.

"...in Scotland reforestation is proceeding apace..."

Bully for Scotland. Are communities being moved out to replant the forest? This would be needed to restore the patch between Oxford and Windsor.

"...The BBC's coverage of the impact of the weather seems somewhat restricted to parts of the South despite the Thames flooding being quite mild..."

I don't know about BBC Sulfur though C4 News tonight might as well have been a Cornish 'special'. Typical Southerners.

"...'lopsided devolution' was a attempt by Nulabour to reduce the effect of the nationalist vote on Westminster. None of the Unionist parties there fell the need to give English voters a vote on a devolved English parliam because the rightly perceive that English voters are apathetic on the issue. Afaik, oly the SNP and Pupport a referendum on a devoleved English parliament..."

Thus neatly dodging my question on lopsided federalism; "Or was the plan for us all to have a binding vote across the whole nation?" I suppose that wouldn't be fair on 'the Celtic fringe'? Also I think it presumptuous to assume we'd be against devolution for England (for all of it mind - not just Prescott's 'Mickey Mouse' regional proposal); the question has never been put whilst, all the while, Scotland is asked again and again.

I had to laugh this week when a SNP 'Finance Minister' was asked on Today whether the UK should be polled on whether there should be fiscal union with Scotland - funnily enough he dodged the question!

"...at no time did Wessex the appellation Great wessex' when it absorbed neighbouring Kingdoms..."

I think I see; you object to 'Great': The fact that the borders of Wessex didn't remain fixed whilst the name of the state remained should not be a precedent for the UK to retain its name because you object to Great (inherited from the Roman name of the island of Great Britain) being in the subtitle.

"...I would think the change from 'Ireland' to 'Northern Ireland' was made to reflect the fact that the UK government no longer exercised over Southern Ireland..."

As you know I think this was unnecessary. No one thinks The U S of A claims sovereignty over Canada or Mexico. Perhaps just to be clear Obama & Co should rebrand as The U S (between) C & M?

"...I don't think the Labour administration in Cardiff have ever advocated independence for Wales though keen on promoting the Welsh language..."

Agreed for Llafur. It seemed to me that the question of teaching in the medium of the Welsh language caused the Neath AQ audience to stir. The Welsh Assembly was voted for by a margin of 2:1 in that constituency. The result of the straw poll was far more even on the question of how the language was being promoted.

"...the 'Celtic Fringe' might well prefer to leave the UK..."

We're working on it.

"...Oops! I think I might have replied to our post already but I'll post this one anyway..."

Maybe; though my memory these days... What was the old saying - The Irish remember everything whilst the English remember nothing?

Be well.

bs

hi rg

Apologies. Been somewhat busy in the world.

>>Clearly this is a matter of opinion. I'd quite like that the 'wilderness' areas of your linked map are kept nay expanded.<<

Surely a matter of fact rather of fact rather than opinion.

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/publications/view-larger.html?edition=tcm%3A77-247453&chart=tcm%3A77-276314&contentid=tcm%3A77-275330

Though the lowest density on the map as the Western Isles and large part of the Highlands at least are typically about one person/km^2.

>>Bully for Scotland. Are communities being moved out to replant the forest<<

No I think it is more that some moorlands that resulted from deforestation are being reforested so the small numbers of locals can switch jobs.

>>This would be needed to restore the patch between Oxford and Windsor. <<

I don't know the area but certainly true of the NEW forest much of which is more the leafy suburb than woodlandd.>

>>Thus neatly dodging my question on lopsided federalism;<<

Well no I was asumming that if all fourr countries in the UK had devolved parliaments then this could well be the start of of a move towards the UK as a federalist state..

>>Also I think it presumptuous to assume we'd be against devolution for England<<
Their seems to be little evidence of support fora devolved English parliament amongst English voters. Perhaps if there were it would make a referendum more likely.

>>Scotland is asked again and again.<<

Actually twice; The rigged ('40% rule') 1979 one and the successful 1997.

>>I had to laugh this week when a SNP 'Finance Minister' was asked on Today whether the UK should be polled on whether there should be fiscal union with Scotland - funnily enough he dodged the question!<<

Afaik there is only one Scottish Finance Minister John Swinney and generally members of the Scottish executive don't comment on the internal poliical afairs of other parts of the UK

>>I think I see; you object to 'Great': The fact that the borders of Wessex didn't remain fixed whilst the name of the state remained should not be a precedent for the UK to retain its name because you object to Great (inherited from the Roman name of the island of Great Britain) being in the subtitle. <<

'Britannia is an ancient term for Roman Britain ... In AD 43 the Roman Empire began its conquest of the island, establishing a province they called Britannia, which came to encompass the parts of the island south of Caledonia (roughly Scotland).' Wikipedia)

So the Roman Province of Britannia consisted of England and Wales but not Scotland nor, afaik, was the province of Britannia ever called Magna Britannia. In fact,:

'The term Great Britain was first used during the reign of King James I of England (James VI of Scotland) in 1603, to refer to the separate kingdoms of England and Scotland. on the same landmass, that were ruled over by the same monarch. Despite having the same monarch, both kingdoms kept their own parliaments.'

http://resources.woodlands-junior.kent.sch.uk/customs/questions/britain/names.html

>>As you know I think this was unnecessary. No one thinks The U S of A claims sovereignty over Canada or Mexico. Perhaps just to be clear Obama & Co should rebrand as The U S (between) C & M?<<

Except that the USA has never asserted sovereignty over Canada or Mexico hence rendering the appellation the United States of Greater America redundant.

>>Agreed for Llafur. It seemed to me that the question of teaching in the medium of the Welsh language caused the Neath AQ audience to stir. The Welsh Assembly was voted for by a margin of 2:1 in that constituency. The result of the straw poll was far more even on the question of how the language was being promoted.<<
l
It seems odd but the only language that is de jure official in any part of the UK is Welsh because of a second Welsh Language Act 1993:

http://www.comisiynyddygymraeg.org/English/Law/welshlanguageact1993/Pages/homewelshlanguageact1993.aspx

This seems to somewhat akin to the use of Irish Gaelic in Eire. No equivalent legislation for Scottish Gaelic exists though both Gaelic and Scots are used in street signs and official documents in much of A' Gàidhealtachd

>>We're working on it<<

I hadn't thought you considered yourself part of the 'Celtic Fringe'.

>>I don't know about BBC Sulfur though C4 News tonight might as well have been a Cornish 'special'. Typical Southerners.<<

Indeed saw another report on the Thames Valley followed by a cheery weather report that said all would be well there but gales forecast for the West.

bs

Hi Bx4

I hope you're well?

"... Surely a matter of fact rather of fact rather than opinion..."

I think we may be at cross purposes.

"..."...it does not mean that [the UK is] overpopulate[d] though some areas might be..."..."

Isn't whether the UK as a whole is overpopulated/underpopulated or 'just right' a matter of opinion?

"...if all [four] countries in the UK had devolved parliaments then this could well be the start of of a move towards the UK as a federalist state..."

What four countries - I thought there'd be three from September?

"...Actually twice; The rigged ('40% rule') 1979 one and the successful 1997..."

And not forgetting the 2014 poll after all - "devolution is a stepping stone to independence"?

"...members of the Scottish executive don't comment on the internal political affairs of other parts of the UK..."

This was to do with Salmond's 'Stirling Zone' so not an internal UK issue as Scotland was to be a partner.

[quoting] "In AD 43 the Roman Empire began its conquest of the island, establishing a province they called Britannia, which came to encompass the parts of the island south of Caledonia (roughly Scotland).' Wikipedia)"

"The name Britain goes back to Roman times when they called England and Wales "Britannia" (or "Britannia Major", to distinguished from "Britannia Minor", ie Brittany in France). The Roman province of Britannia only covered the areas of modern England and Wales. The area of modern Scotland was never finally conquered." http://projectbritain.com/britain/britain.htm

Britannia Major or Great Britain and not a cm2 of Scottish territory claimed. You have nothing to fear from the UK (of GB) as it is a reversion to one time Roman borders, which as you pointed out, never encompassed Scotland.

"...Except that the USA has never asserted sovereignty over Canada or Mexico hence rendering the appellation the United States of Greater America redundant..."

I think you are being over sensitive. Remember it is we who were subjugated by 'Brown the Unelected' from 2007-2010: Now that was something to worry about.

"...I hadn't thought you considered yourself part of the 'Celtic Fringe'..."

You haven't been to Bristol lately have you?

"...a cheery weather report that said all would be well there but gales forecast for the West..."

Ah bless.

bs

Hi Bx4

Out of turn though I thought this was a nice bit of summing up...

"Elections to the Scottish Parliament show that the Scots have shifted their allegiance from Labour to the SNP. But they still want the English to be governed by the Labour Party. Hence they vote to place Labour politicians, whom they don't particularly want at home, in Westminster." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-26173128

bs

hi rg

Apologies forb late reply. Somewhat in the toils at work trying to adapt a more effective new method of inserting new genes into bacterial genomes.

>>I hope you're well? <<

No too bad except for residual runny nose.

>>think we may be at cross purposes.<<

Quite possibly.

>>
Isn't whether the UK as a whole is overpopulated/underpopulated or 'just right' a matter of opinion? <<

I was rather trying to address the relative population densities of different parts of the UK. I'm not sure what criteria would make a particular population density an example of overpopulation.

>>What four countries - I thought there'd be three from September? <<

Status quo ante.

>>And not forgetting the 2014 poll after all - "devolution is a stepping stone to independence"?<<

Scotland possibly. Wales doubtful.

>>This was to do with Salmond's 'Stirling Zone' so not an internal UK issue as Scotland was to be a partner.<<

As the Magnificent Merve's replacement at the BOE has pointed out the Osborne/Balls/Alexander contribution to the 'Project Fear' agenda was misleading. rUK would not be able to stop Scotland pegging its currence to the rUK £ (cf. the Estonian 'Second Kroon') but only that the rUK government might deide that the BOE should not underwrite the Scottish banks. However as Salmond has pointed out a rejection of a curreny union:

' would leave them (the rUK government0 having to pick up the entirety of UK debt...All the debt accrued up to the point of independence belongs legally to the Treasury, as they confirmed last month - and Scotland can’t default on debt that’s not legally ours.'

>>Britannia Major or Great Britain and not a cm2 of Scottish territory claimed. You have nothing to fear from the UK (of GB) as it is a reversion to one time Roman borders, which as you pointed out, never encompassed Scotland.<<

As I have pointed out the RuK ould not claim sovereignty over all of Great Britain (which was created by the 1707 union of Scotland and England) so retention of the qualifier 'Great' would be delusional. Its not a matter of fear but legal precedent (cf namechange oster secession of Eire)

>>I think you are being over sensitive. Remember it is we who were subjugated by 'Brown the Unelected' from 2007-2010: Now that was something to worry about.<<

I believe the great majority of Labour MPs who 'crowned' Brown were English.

>>You haven't been to Bristol lately have you? <<

no, though I thought you were more y Mers

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110427203055/althistory/images/3/37/19._State_Flag_of_Y_Mers.jpg

"Elections to the Scottish Parliament show that the Scots have shifted their allegiance from Labour to the SNP. But they still want the English to be governed by the Labour Party. Hence they vote to place Labour politicians, whom they don't particularly want at home, in Westminster"

Typical BBC ballcocks

The Scots dont want to be governed by the Tories whether allied with the Wingmen or not.

Sadly the tribal labour voter in Scotland have not quite grasped that Nulabour or Millpedian Labour are clones of the Tories.

bs

bs

Hi Bx4

I hope the runny nose sorts itself out and the work doesn't involve too much toil. I'm rather bunged up myself; should I blame a change in the weather from mild to cold? Odd that this should coincide with 'the first day of Spring' according to the BBC Sulfur weather person. (I had thought previously that Spring started on March 21).

This sort of leads on (via MMCC?) to matters Green whereby their leader declared the other day that we were consuming 'three Earths' in the UK. Of course what she was alluding to was that we should (with the help of Green taxes?) cut our consumption toward 'one Earth' or less. A reduced 'Earth consumption rate' could also be helped with a reducing population though The Greens and BBC Sulfur don't bang that drum. For our level of consumption we are overpopulated even though there are areas of lower population density on our island. That is unless The Greens have got their maths spectacularly wrong.

"...Scotland can’t default on debt that’s not legally ours..."

Fair enough.

"... retention of the qualifier 'Great' would be delusional..."

I don't think so. Then again I think of my country as 'The UK' without giving the 'Great' subtext any thought. When prompted it reminds me of Brittany.

"... Its not a matter of fear but legal precedent..."

I doubt if the name change was a legal precedent. This doesn't mean there won't be a name change - we have politicians dumb enough to do anything.

"... I believe the great majority of Labour MPs who 'crowned' Brown were English..."

I don't think I suggested otherwise? Vote Blair for 'a full term' and get Brown. It's not fair like the English voting Evil and mercilessly forcing the result on 'The Celtic Fringe'.

My Bristol comment was, on reflection, an obscure reference to the number of Welsh registered cars seen trundling around and generally clogging the roads in and out of Wales in the morning and again in the evening. A similar situation exists in Gloucester.

"....The Scots dont want to be governed by the Tories whether allied with the Wingmen or not..."

Indeed this appears to me to be the most convincing reason for Scottish independence. Why be subjugated by a foreign ideology when in six months time the Evil can be waved away forever?

Whilst Salmond's 'beacon state' comment was cringing; I really would like to see what a British located state will look like without a (still unelected!) House of Lords let alone First Past the Post.

bs

hi rg

Sorry about the delayed reply somewhat under the cosh at work at the moment.
Will reply tomorrow.

bs

Hi Bx4

No bother; just enjoying the sunshine.

Look forward to hearing from you.

bs

hi rg

Not sure this will post as when I tried to do it earlier I got a 'fatal error' message when I clicked the 'Reply Button.

>>Odd that this should coincide with 'the first day of Spring' according to the BBC Sulfur weather person. (I had thought previously that Spring started on March 21).<<

A matter of different conventions I think meteorologists divide year in areas with a temperate climate into four seasons of approximately equal length with Spring starting on the first of March whereas the astronomical convention has spring sarting beginning at the March equinox varying between the 19th and 21st of March.

>> A reduced 'Earth consumption rate' could also be helped with a reducing population though The Greens and BBC Sulfur don't bang that drum.<<

I don't know about the BBC but the section of the Greens website the section on population in their document 'Policies for a Sustainable Society' says:

'PP106 The Green Party holds that the number of children people have should be a matter of free choice.'

Which seems to suggest that the amount of sustainable resources available per capita in the UK would be expected to decline as uncontrolled breeding continued.

>>For our level of consumption we are overpopulated even though there are areas of lower population density on our island. That is unless The Greens have got their maths spectacularly wrong.<<

I am not sure this is quite right since despite the headline grabbing 'three into one won't go' rhetoric the SPP.P document also says:

'PP108 The Green Party notes that the population of the UK currently supports its way of life by consuming more resources than can be sustainably supplied from within the UK, and more than its fair share of global resources - often to the detriment of the people and the environment in producing areas.'

I am not wholly clear what the population size was when Britain was, wholly or mostly, dependent only on the resources produced within the UK but I suspect it was some millenia ago.

Also somewhat problematic is how the 'fair share of global resources' would be determined

Incidentally I can find nothing on the GP website which gives the mathematics on which they base their calculations. Do You know of a link? (I am aware of the now somewhat discredited I=PxAxT formula)

>>I don't think so. Then again I think of my country as 'The UK' without giving the 'Great' subtext any thought. When prompted it reminds me of Brittany.<<

The United Kingdom of Britain and Northern Ireland would be an unexceptional name for a post secession rUK since the name 'Great Britain' was adopted in Article 1 of the two Acts of Union that formed the single state of Great Britain out of the previously separate political states of England and Scotland:

'That the two Kingdoms of England and Scotland shall upon the First day of May which shall be in the year One thousand seven hundred and seven and for ever after be united into one Kingdom by the name of Great Britain' (Union with Scotland Act 1706: Article 1)

The secession of Scotland would abrogate both Acts of Union and hence the political entity know as Great Britain would cease to exist.

>>I doubt if the name change was a legal precedent. This doesn't mean there won't be a name change - we have politicians dumb enough to do anything.<<

Rather it suggests that politicians grasp that appearing to assert sovereignty over independent states is rather dumb. (Putin excepted)

>>I don't think I suggested otherwise? Vote Blair for 'a full term' and get Brown. It's not fair like the English voting Evil and mercilessly forcing the result on 'The Celtic Fringe'.<<

I'm not persuade by the simile Brown was elected NuLaour Leader unopposed Cameron was not.

>>My Bristol comment was, on reflection, an obscure reference to the number of Welsh registered cars seen trundling around and generally clogging the roads in and out of Wales in the morning and again in the evening. A similar situation exists in Gloucester.<<

Of course it does not follow that the car owners are Welsh they might well be English 'White settlers'.

>>Indeed this appears to me to be the most convincing reason for Scottish independence. Why be subjugated by a foreign ideology when in six months time the Evil can be waved away forever?<<

Indeed I have seen it suggested that the possibility of the Nasty Party (with or wthout the Wingmen) being re-elected in 2015 might swing a 'Yes' vote though I am not wholly persuaded.

>>Whilst Salmond's 'beacon state' comment was cringing; I really would like to see what a British located state will look like without a (still unelected!) House of Lords let alone First Past the Post.<<

The idea seems to be that after the first post independence election (2016) there will be a Constitutional Convention to develop a written constitution:

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Resource/0041/00413757.pdf

Clearly whether a unicameral or a bicameral model is adopted would depend on this convention but given the historical links between Scotland and the Fennoscandia countries, all of which have unicameral legislatures, the status quo ante might prevail.

I am not sure how the voting system will change but I doubt that FPTP will be reintroduced though the current AMS system might well be rejigged to produce greater proportionality along the lines of the Bundestag model.

bs

Hi Bx4

"...21st of March..."

My recollection of school days fixes this as the first day of Spring. I guess that not everyone went to the same school which may at least in part explain the adoption of different conventions to mark the start of the season. Also I wonder whether, by choosing different dates, this gave BBC Sulfur more chance of catching more rainfall in 'Winter' so a record could be reported as broken?

"...Also somewhat problematic is how the 'fair share of global resources' would be determined..."

It would be determined by a Green. I caught a a bit of chat on the radio about the chemical industry in the UK/EU. Apparently the UK is against nuclear, against fracking and for Green taxes. Perhaps we can built some more windmills? I'd build that new energy hungry chemical plant somewhere far away.

"...the two Acts of Union that formed the single state of Great Britain out of the previously separate political states of England and Scotland..."

A single state was formed. If a region wants to separate from the whole that's allowed. If the whole state wants to dissolve itself a la Czechoslovakia then everyone should have a say not just the 9% who happen to live in the separatist region imv.

The ancient texts forming the UK are irrelevant in my view. That's something for the history books.

"...Of course it does not follow that the car owners are Welsh they might well be English 'White settlers'..."

Immigrants or migrants - perfectly legal in the EU/UK.

"...I have seen it suggested that the possibility of the Nasty Party (with or wthout the Wingmen) being re-elected in 2015 might swing a 'Yes' vote though I am not wholly persuaded..."

Indeed though why not in 2014 - after all no one likes The Coalition?

"...The idea seems to be that after the first post independence election (2016) there will be a Constitutional Convention to develop a written constitution..."

I'd favour a unicameral legislature. As you know I'd lose the HoL. It's why the UK is undemocratic along with the absence of PR not to mention unequal constituency size and a Mickey Mouse voter registration system.

I enjoyed a happy sunlit ride on BB away from the madding crowd on deserted lanes in rural Monmouthshire. What were the chances?

bs

hi rg

>>My recollection of school days fixes this as the first day of Spring.<<

I don't recall being taught the meteorological usage but rather the astronomical one. Reinforced perhaps because it is used in things nautical:

http://www.rmg.co.uk/explore/astronomy-and-time/time-facts/equinoxes-and-solstices

Though the actual day varies a little (see above link) and the latest one was on the 20th March.

>> Also I wonder whether, by choosing different dates, this gave BBC Sulfur more chance of catching more rainfall in 'Winter' so a record could be reported as broken?<<

Perhaps, though it might be that an increasingly dumbed down BBC prefers the simplicity of the arbitrary meteorological quadripartite division of the seasons rather that the 'sciency' astronomical one.

>> Apparently the UK is against nuclear, against fracking and for Green taxes.<<

I think you mean the Greens in the UK, I believe the Nasty party and the Wingmen are in favour of both.

>>Perhaps we can built some more windmills?<<

Some of us already are:

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Business-Industry/Energy/Facts

>>A single state was formed. If a region wants to separate from the whole that's allowed.<<

I am not sure the resident populations of England, Scotland, wales or Northern island consider their countries as 'regions' of the UK. Otherwise I agree; the right of self determination being enshrined in the UN Charter.

>> If the whole state wants to dissolve itself a la Czechoslovakia then everyone should have a say not just the 9% who happen to live in the separatist region imv.<<

However if only one ethnic group, Czech or Slovak, wanted to secede the effect would have been the same.

However while Slovakia existed prior to the founding of Czechoslovakia their was no equivalent single Czech state but rather (subsumed into the Austro-Hungarian Empire) the separate states of Bohemia and Moravia-Silesia. So the Czech state somewhat parallels that of the rUK should Scotland secede.

>>The ancient texts forming the UK are irrelevant in my view. That's something for the history books.<<

The relevance is simply that the Great Britain was coined in 1707 as the name of the state formed by the Union of Scotland and England just as in 1918, Czechoslovakia was coined as name of the state formed by the union of Bohemia, Moravia-Silesia and Slovakia. When Slovakia left the name changed to reflect this just as the name of the UK changed when Eire left. So if Scotland leaves the UK the state of Great Britain will similarly not exist.

>>Immigrants or migrants - perfectly legal in the EU/UK.<<

As it was in the British Empire- if you were white and and a settler.

>>Indeed though why not in 2014 - after all no one likes The Coalition?<<

You have somewhat misunderstood I athe likelihood of a 'yes' vote in 2014 might well increase if a Tory victory in 2015 seems likely.

>>I'd favour a unicameral legislature. As you know I'd lose the HoL. It's why the UK is undemocratic along with the absence of PR not to mention unequal constituency size and a Mickey Mouse voter registration system.<<

Indeed as I said all the Fennoscandian countries have one and Scotland has always been historically close to them. Most democratic Commonwealth countries have adopted the bicameral system though the 'upper house' is generally elected. I think New Zealand now has a unicameral one though it was originally bicameral.


>>I enjoyed a happy sunlit ride on BB away from the madding crowd on deserted lanes in rural Monmouthshire. What were the chances?<<

The weather here is now good enough for me to bicycle to work but I'm planning to take B2 of the stocks at the weekend.

I see the F1 season begin on Sunday. New regulations too -wot fun!

bs

Hi Bx4

Starting with F1; I gather the first few races won't be on our TV (we have been without Sky for some time now). I've read that cost cutting is the new way of F1 which is why the cars are now fitted with 'most expensive engines in the history of motor-sport'. http://www.motoring.com.au/news/motorsport-f1-engines-ain%E2%80%99t-just-engines-now-42186 Also there is no bike racing on BBC Sulfur this season. Oh well; that's just the EU parliamentary and the Scottish referendum to watch in my anorak.

Unicameral - The way to go imo. Scotland is blessed with a blank piece of paper and no legacy of an unelected legislature to decide what to do with. In contrast, and without resolution, the UK has been dealing with HoL reform for more than a hundred years!

"... if only one ethnic group, Czech or Slovak, wanted to secede the effect would have been the same..." - Indeed a secession would have taken place. Whether the continuing state would have chosen to dissolve and/or rename itself as a result of the application of 'free determination' by part of the population is pure conjecture.

"... the name [of the state] changed to reflect this..." - I think we have to wait and see [so far as the UK is concerned] notwithstanding my earlier comment about our ruling elite.

"... likelihood of a 'yes' vote in 2014 might well increase if a Tory victory in 2015 seems likely..." - Unfortunately (from the point of view of secession) this doesn't seem likely.

"...'regions' of the UK..." A bit out of date (2010) though the map may still be good http://andrewjburgess-eu.blogspot.co.uk/2010/10/additional-uk-mep-should-go-to-west.html

"... I think you mean the Greens in the UK..." - I meant the UK population as a whole so far as the first two were concerned; ime I've not come across many gagging for fracking nor nuclear. As for Green taxes this is an England and Wales thing (Labour/Evil/Real Opposition) that Salmond seems to want to get away from (e.g. air passenger duty http://www.scotland.gov.uk/News/Releases/2013/04/air-passenger-duty-devolution-essential-to-growth1 )?

Of matters elsewhere I see there is a referendum in The Crimea this weekend. In contrast Miliband has 'promised' an EU referendum though only if he thinks significant powers are to be transferred to 'Brussels'.

bs

hi rg

Just got back from taking B2 out for is first spring/late winter run

>>Starting with F1; I gather the first few races won't be on our TV (we have been without Sky for some time now). I've read that cost cutting is the new way of F1 which is why the cars are now fitted with 'most expensive engines in the history of motor-sport'. http://www.motoring.com.au/news/motorsport-f1-engines-ain%E2%80%99t-just-engines-now-42186<<

I watched the first on BBC2 iPlayer using software which makes it think I'm a UK resident. Race a bit dull, imo. Cost cutting may in part be due to legal fees incurred/to be incurred by dodgy dwarf here and there:

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/02/20/uk-britain-ecclestone-trial-idUKBREA1J0OE20140220

>>Also there is no bike racing on BBC Sulfur this season.<<

I blame Jeremy the Timid.

>>Oh well; that's just the EU parliamentary and the Scottish referendum to watch in my anorak.<<

On the former do you anticiptate the faragists will sweep away the Nasties/Wingmen?

>>Unicameral - The way to go imo. Scotland is blessed with a blank piece of paper and no legacy of an unelected legislature to decide what to do with. In contrast, and without resolution, the UK has been dealing with HoL reform for more than a hundred years!<<

Indeed. Clearly a reincarnation of Oliver cromwell is neded to sweep away the HoL. Never really followed the logic of keeping it except it does seem to keep an overweening executive in check. Unicameral option might only work well with a PR system.

>> Indeed a secession would have taken place. Whether the continuing state would have chosen to dissolve and/or rename itself as a result of the application of 'free determination' by part of the population is pure conjecture.<<


Except, that Czechoslovakia was formed from a union of four predecessor states and on dissolution there were two neither of which retained the name 'Czechoslovakia' Similarly with the Union of Scotland and England to form Great Britain. Not clear why you think the rUK would retain the clearly inaccurate name 'Great Britain'

>>I think we have to wait and see [so far as the UK is concerned] notwithstanding my earlier comment about our ruling elite.<<

Given the confusion over the etymology of 'Great' among the posh boys:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/8771077/David-Cameron-campaigns-to-put-the-Great-back-in-Britain.html

anything is possible.

>>Unfortunately (from the point of view of secession) this doesn't seem likely.<<

A Nasty/Wingmen Coalition would do.

>> A bit out of date (2010) though the map may still be good <<
From your map it is only Egland that is broken into regions as far as far representation in the EU parliament is concerned.

>> I meant the UK population as a whole so far as the first two were concerned; ime I've not come across many gagging for fracking nor nuclear.<<

Money talks:

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/jan/13/shale-gas-fracking-cameron-all-out

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/10/21/uk-britain-nuclear-hinkley-idUKBRE99J03X20131021

>> As for Green taxes this is an England and Wales thing (Labour/Evil/Real Opposition) that Salmond seems to want to get away from (e.g. air passenger duty<<

Not quite:

'No More Nuclear - As well as opposing nuclear weapons, the SNP is opposed to new nuclear power stations or dumps in Scotland'

http://www.snp.org/vision/greener-scotland/climate-change

'The Scottish Government has no plans to join David Cameron in an “all-out” drive in support of the controversial gas extraction technique known as fracking.'

http://www.scotsman.com/news/uk/pm-s-fracking-plea-falls-on-deaf-scottish-ears-1-3266638

Moreover the notion that APD is a 'green tax'is somewhat discredited:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/travelnews/8938267/Air-Passenger-Duty-a-cash-raiser-Government-admits.html

and the Scottish government seems rather more committed to 'Green' policies than Westminster:

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Business-Industry/Energy/Energy-sources/19185

>>Of matters elsewhere I see there is a referendum in The Crimea this weekend<<

Which Russia asserts is illegal but the West disagrees.

>> In contrast Miliband has 'promised' an EU referendum though only if he thinks significant powers are to be transferred to 'Brussels'.<<

'a prospect he describes as "unlikely". '

So it goes.

Though I rarely visit and no longer post I had a brief lurk on 'New Mustarland II' and somewhat to my surprise, given earlier censorship, I was surprise to find an Scottish independence thread that has reached over 2300 posts and that you are active on it.


bs

Hi Bx4

Indeed surprisingly I'm allowed to post on the independence thread whilst the most vociferous 'Yes' campaigner appears to be in pre-mod? I've also taken an interest in The Ukraine and Line of Duty.

The Miliband 'promise' is an odd one. Why say anything at all?

"...Which Russia asserts is illegal but the West disagrees..."

I think it the other way about? I take the view that The Ukraine should sort itself out and yes the result of a referendum held under the barrel of a gun is worthless. If that puts me on anyone's 'side' then that's by the by.

Green policies: I see so air passenger duty isn't a Green tax and we should fly more because it helps the environment.

Whilst Cameron may wish to encourage fracking, aside from those set to benefit directly from this exploitation of the Earth's resources, who else is in favour? A vote winner in 2015? Really?

As for Nuclear it isn't clear whether this is or isn't green for I'm sure I've heard it claimed that it was cleaner than fossil fuels?

EU Regions: UK regions.

Coalition (UK 2015): No chance. There will be a Miliband government. (Also Cameron has ruled out a coalition - not that he'll be in a position to form one).

'...Czechoslovakia was formed from a union...' One state was formed, component states extinguished. The whole state then dissolved into two. Here a region of the UK is to secede (which is its right as it is populated by 'a peoples'). Now if we were all to have a vote then I'd go along with the Czechoslovakia dissolution model.

UKIP in 2009 triumphed over Labour & The Real Opposition - A high water mark? I suspect Labour will win this time as Miliband presents a far more attractive voter offer than Grumpy Gordon.

F1 (BBC iPlayer): I am in the UK. pay my licence and still can't watch it.

I was pleased to read that B2 was out of the stocks and back on the road. I think I mentioned BB and I made a return visit to Herefordshire at the weekend? I was amazed that there was still flooding in evidence. I was glad that BB wasn't a cruiser as plenty of putting weight on pegs was needed on less than pristine roads. Funny I thought I spent plenty on fuel duty, tax disc and the rest - where does the money go - clearly not on repairing Herefordshire's roads.

bs

Hi rg

Somehat engaged at the mo in decluttering my CDs using my shinee new(ish) Brennan JB7i:

http://www.gadgetspeak.com/gadget/article.rhtm/751/495482/Brennan_JB7_Digital_Jukebox.html

After some faffing about using a record deck with a USB connection I have now worked out how to copy vinyl to it as well.

>>Indeed surprisingly I'm allowed to post on the independence thread whilst the most vociferous 'Yes' campaigner appears to be in pre-mod? I've also taken an interest in The Ukraine and Line of Duty.
<<

Who he? Hoddles? I got bored with the thread some time ago. Also unimpressed by erratic censorship by hall monitors more errtic than dementors.

Watched Line of Duty but somewhat spoilt by spotting the final twist some episodes ago. Ukraine I'm giving a bit of a miss the response of the West being a bit too much ' a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury signifying nothing'.

>>I think it the other way about?<<

I was thinking of an earlier Russian statement that the interim.

>>I take the view that The Ukraine should sort itself out and yes the result of a referendum held under the barrel of a gun is worthless. If that puts me on anyone's 'side' then that's by the by.<<

Indeed, but I think Putin got the realpolitik right in that he judged that a toothless West would do nothing serious about it.

>> I see so air passenger duty isn't a Green tax...<<

So your government says...

>>...and we should fly more because it helps the environment<<

Did the government say that?

>>Whilst Cameron may wish to encourage fracking, aside from those set to benefit directly from this exploitation of the Earth's resources, who else is in favour? A vote winner in 2015? Really? <<

I'm rather hoping that the Scottish executive's decision /not/ to encourage fracking will be a vote winner in 2014. If cheap oil/gas is to be had then they will be fracked.

>>As for Nuclear it isn't clear whether this is or isn't green for I'm sure I've heard it claimed that it was cleaner than fossil fuels?<<

I believe some environmentalists like George Monbiot now believe in it:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/mar/21/pro-nuclear-japan-fukushima

>>EU Regions: UK regions.<<

'The United Kingdom is split into constituencies representing Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and each of the regions of England. '

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elections_to_the_European_Parliament

Rather EU Constituencies: English regions

>>Coalition (UK 2015): No chance. There will be a Miliband government. (Also Cameron has ruled out a coalition - not that he'll be in a position to form one)<<

Not all labourites share your confidence:

http://labour-uncut.co.uk/2014/01/06/the-milibelievers-are-destroying-labours-chances-for-victory-in-2015/

>>Here a region of the UK is to secede (which is its right as it is populated by 'a peoples')... Now if we were all to have a vote then I'd go along with the Czechoslovakia dissolution model.<<

Well, just like Scotland, the predecessor states that formed Czechoslovakia were nations not regions.

>>...Now if we were all to have a vote then I'd go along with the Czechoslovakia dissolution model.<<

'While the Scottish government plans to hold an independence referendum, in the former Czechoslovakia the people were not consulted.'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-21110521

Tricky that - votewise

>>UKIP in 2009 triumphed over Labour & The Real Opposition - A high water mark? I suspect Labour will win this time as Miliband presents a far more attractive voter offer than Grumpy Gordon.<<

Blair was originally found attractive then not. Morever, Miliband is not competing against Brown but Cameron who I thought whereas more popular than Miliband.

>>F1 (BBC iPlayer): I am in the UK. pay my licence and still can't watch it. <<

I to pay the licence fee because I own a TV located in the UK though I can't watch it from here hence my using a VPN that makes it look like I have a UK IP address.

>>I was pleased to read that B2 was out of the stocks and back on the road<<

Vaguely thinking of the baltic states this summer. Did the coastal view last year.

>>Funny I thought I spent plenty on fuel duty, tax disc and the rest - where does the money go - clearly not on repairing Herefordshire's roads.<<

>> I think I mentioned BB and I made a return visit to Herefordshire at the weekend? I was amazed that there was still flooding in evidence.<<

So much rain the land is waterlogged, perhaps.

>>I was glad that BB wasn't a cruiser as plenty of putting weight on pegs was needed on less than pristine roads.<<

Surely since BB is a GS ideal for such conditions?

>>Funny I thought I spent plenty on fuel duty, tax disc and the rest - where does the money go - clearly not on repairing Herefordshire's roads<<


Cue Kraftwerk:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68C-r9kSLNE

which you may not be able to watch.

bs

Oops!


>>I think it the other way about?<<

I was thinking of an earlier Russian statement that the interim.

should have read:


>>I think it the other way about?<<

I was thinking of an earlier Russian statement that the interim Ukrainian government was illegal

bs