h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Now that we can't use some of the nastier modern swear words, we should all go back to ye days of yore ("ye" in the sense of "the" was never actually used, of course - just another urban myth) - and rekindle some of those classic phrases for expressing your irritation at LtU&E.

To get you started, my favourite couple are "steeth" (for "God's Teeth") and "struth" (for God's Truth). Back in the relevant time, such words were be deemed highly offensive - to the extent that there used to be people running around called "quacks" - whenever they heard someone swearing the would release a heard of ducks to drown out the sound - or "quack" it.

Well - some of the above is true, anyway...

Wasn't the "y" at the beginning of "ye" an old letter that gave a "th" sound, thus the word was pronounced "the" ?

I sem to remember this from school but could be mistaken...

In response to the question about ye.
According to David Crystal's Encyclopedia of English Language, "ye" was originally "the", but during the Middle English period scribes wrote both y and a now defunct letter called thorn (it had once looked like a "p" with the bump further down the stick) in the same way. "Thorn" was still pronounced "th" but later readers mistook it for a y: hence ye instead of the.
I hope this helps. For an entertaining look at the development of the English language, I can recommend Bill Bryson's book "Mother Tounge".

The weird looking "p" with the bump half way down the stick is still alive and well in, of all places, Iceland!
And yes, it is pronounce "th"!
If you can just imagine that the "p" in the next sentance is that odd looking "p", then I will explain-ish!

Lag frir pig.

Oh come on! It's NOT pig! It's pronounced "thig". The actual phrase in English is "A song for you". I only know this 'cos I work next to an Icelander who has recorded a couple of CD's, and he explained what it meant as it's one of the songs on his CD of the unpronounceable title!

The graph 'thorn' looks more or less like this "Þ". Icelandic is a very close descendant of Old High Norse, one of the many languages to have had an influence on the development of English. Though English is basically a Germanic language, and most closely related to Fresian, languages such as French and Norse have had a large impact. For example, the words 'beef' and 'cow' are cognates - words that have the same meaning and a common ancestor. In this case, beef comes from French and cow from Saxon, though both originally came from the same word in Proto-Indo European, the reconstructed language to which most modern European languages can be traced back to. 'Beef' came into English through Norman French, as it was used by the ruling Normans to describe the meat they ate. 'Cow', on the other hand, was the word used by the Saxon farmers to describe the animals they reared. This is one of the main reasons that English has such a rich (and often complicated) vocabulary - theft! Or, to be more linguistic about it, 'borrowing' .

Or perhaps more like this -'þ' Damn formatting...

getting off of thorns, and back to the words. . . does "bloody" really come from God's blood, or does it come from an older Germanic word, "bloede" (or "blöde" if the umlaut shows up)?

Actually I think it's a bastardisation of the phrase "By our Lady!" Referring, of course, to "The Virgin Mary".

I Think!

Apparently, Icelandic is closer to Old Norse than any of the Scandinavian languages (Norwegian, Swedish, etc.). So much so that Icelanders are still able to read old Icelandic manuscripts written in the Middle Ages!

Can you really buy the "by our lady" origin for "bloody"? How do you then explain "bleeding"? It seems much more likely that both mean exactly what they say?

I suspect "bloody" in the pejorative comes from medieval surgical practice when it would simply be an adjective,e.g. a bloody mess on the floor. It therefore was a simple step for it to become a rude adjective, hence a sweary-word. Bleeding being used as the mild wersion of the same.

Is there any truth in the theory that in days of yore "bum" was a stronger word than arse?

Dunno about that - but I do know that when my ex was working with a whole load of Americans, Australians and South Africans he once asked "can I bum a fag off anyone?"

(I know it is a little naughty to test out the moderators like this, but I am curious to know what happens to the b-word in the following contexts)

William the Conquerer's parents were not married, and he was quite accurately known as 'William the Bastard', which was a statement of simple geneological fact.

Whether the Saxons called him this because he behaved like a b*****d to the people he conquered is now a matter of conjection".

(In its first use it is arguably not a swear-word, in its second it arguably is - I wrote it in full in the posting).

Well....There's your answer!

So, calling someone a right royal B*****d without any documented proof is a no-no! (I put in the *'s!)

Personally I have found that if you were a goody-goody in those days, you got stamped on big time! FUBAR and all that! Usually by strange hairy people who rejoiced in the name of Beowulf The Foul...Thank God they don't have names like that any more, imagine the fun at school roll call....!

Bum - as in borrow is used a lot in England too.
I think we sometimes think that if we don't hear a word near where we live it's not used in our country.

I liked the danish king "Gorm the Old" unfortunately he didnt have a son called "Gorm the Less"

I always thought the verb "To Bum" was an Americanism more than anythig else.

I know that "A Bum" can also be used to describe a Hobo. So possibly the two could be related...(Paternity suits are pending!)

Bum is virtually never used in the USA for the posterior. However we do say 'buns' - though that is a new term and unrelated, I believe; it refers to the resemblance of a single buttock to a bun or loaf of bread...

Bum is virtually never used in the USA for the posterior. However we do say 'buns' - though that is a new term and unrelated, I believe; it refers to the resemblance of a single buttock to a bun or loaf of bread...

Hey! How 'bout that? I did wonder how that phrase came about...

I know that in The States "Goddam" is a lot stronger than over here in God's country. Possibly from the Quakers? Who konows?

When I was out on the N.Sea working with a load of (I won't say "Yanks" as most of them were from Texas..!) Americans, the phrase "Goddam Sumbitch" was used frequently, usually after a large chunk of steel had bitten their finger!