h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Entry: Is Imitation Flattering? - A861545
Author: Rt. Rev. Lesley Gentle - U204250

This is just a little attack centred on the hideous commercial music-scene that has been suffocating the UK for the last 10 years or so. It can be applied to most things involving creativity, or rather a complete lack of innovation.

I think this is interesting, but not really suitable for the edited guide, as it is an opinion peace, and doesn't seem to be very balanced. I think someone like that would be more suited to the <./>ThePost</.>, the h2g2 newpaper type thing, where they like more opinionated entries.

There is also the Alternative Writing Workshop, here:Writing-Alternative where you can get comments about the entry, and that would be another place where your entry could find an audience.

I think, however, the entry needs fleshing out a bit more, as currently there isn't very much in the entry.

Hi RRLG!

Silverfish is right. The entry is not suitable as it now stands. However, everyone had to start somewhere. It would be good to have a look at the <./>Writing-guidelines</.> to get a feel for what entries are suitable. Peer Review is where entries which are to be featured on the Front Page get to be honed and shaped.

If you need any help or guidance, just click on one of our names, and we would be happy to help.

Good luck!

Nonsense. You are neglecting the fact that what I wrote is the truth. Fact. And there is no need for another side of the argument. It is akin to the whole Father Christmas/Tooth Fairy thing. There are conflicting opinions on whether it is true or not, but at the end of the day it is completely clear-cut and not a matter for debate. Imitation is the behaviour of the unimaginative and no amount of subjective posturing will change that.

Stick it in your guide and smoke it.

That wasn't very gentle, now was it Les?

Do you recognise the nature of the EG? If so, do you recognise the difference between your opinion and a potential editable entry?

Imitation is not limited to the sphere of pop music, by the way.

And indeed, Macca may or may not be flattered by being copied, but that is irrelevant to the quality/value of the imitation.

you have a gripe about bands today producing material that is similar to stuff that's already been done. Fine.

You want to tell the world that's how you feel? Also dandy.

You think that should go into the EG? Sorry mate, i don't think that's particularly likely.

By the way, if Victor-Lewis Smith already said this, then are you simply imitating him? And if so, do you think he'd be flattered?

cyaround
spiff

Wow! How spectacularly wrong you are! Is Dennis Leary a pop star? I don't think so.

Was I imitating Victor Lewis Smith or was I in fact 'quoting' him to make a point?

Regarding the difference between an opinion and an entry to the EG try reading my last entry, thinking about it, and then thinking about what you have just said. Did I not just explain quite clearly why I believe this should be in the EG, as it is in fact not an opinion, but a truth, contentious maybe, but in fact a truth.

I have no gripe about bands today producing stuff that is 'similar' to what has already been done. I am making a wholesale point about imitation using a couple of obvious and clear examples that you have clearly failed to grasp. My point is just as applicable to older bands such as The Move - Goodbye Blackberry Way (read Penny Lane), any part of the work of Donovan whose career was based upon imitating popular trends be they Dylanesque folk music or psychadelia. I could go on to include many works of surrealist art, the acts of a host of comedians (I have already mentioned Leary) countless novels which are pale imitators hopping on to the coat-tails of somebody elses success, films, plays, musicals. The 3 examples given were just examples of a wider trend, but you are blinded by a pattern you see emerging as 2 of them are bands and 'modern' and ape different eras of music, ie Oasis - 60's Beatles, OCS - 70's Who etc.

Read this again and ponder what I was actually pointing to when I said:

'It can be applied to most things involving creativity, or rather a complete lack of innovation.'

I couldn't give two s***s if this doesn't appear in the EG, again, I repeat, I am simply making a valid point which you fail to grasp.

I shudder before your awe-inspiring intelligence and feel only loathing for my own pathetic level of cultural and intellectual insignificance.

well done on being so very much superior to me.

Again you are getting me completely wrong. I making no point of superiority, I am simply saying that you are not reading what I am saying properly. The points you made were often answered already, but you were ignoring them and others weren't valid.

Have I insulted an Oasis fan or are you a natural sulk?

now that i've got my little bit of facetiousness out of the way, perhaps you might like to try to understand what other people are saying to you.

Nobody was really arguing with your earth-shatteringly important comments. I for one am not interested in what you actually say in this entry.

What i and others were trying to point out is that this is peer review, and that only certain kinds of entries should really be in this forum.

For various reasons, this entry should not be in PR, where it is just cluttering things up. There are other forums for this kind of stuff - my best suggestion would be Writing-Alternative but you could post it at AskH2G2.

Not in PR though. Now, it would be very kind of you to remove it yourself. it's not difficult, there is a cross next to your entry in the main PR list with the word 'remove' next to it. I think.

If you choose not to remove it, i think a scout will probably arrange for it to removed for you.

ta-ta, significantly cleverer than me person.
spiff

Well Rev. this is an opinion piece - it may be widely held opinion but it is still opinion.

You cite 3 examples to back your claim of fact and in the discussion thread allude to many more, but surely the view that these are imitation is only your opinion!

This piece does not comply with the EG guidelines (damn did I really say that!!!) put it in the Post or on your home space by all means!

Oh and just because you shout doesn't make it right either!!!!!!!

"There are conflicting opinions on whether it is true or not, but at the end of the day it is completely clear-cut and not a matter for debate."

Ah, i see... er... no i don't. Perhaps you'd like to explain to me how this is not utterly self-contradictory.

No, i ain't a big Oasis fan. But i have heard records by Dennis Leary.

you're an argumentative li'l blighter, aintcha?

It is akin to the whole Father Christmas/Tooth Fairy thing. There are conflicting opinions on whether it is true or not, but at the end of the day it is completely clear-cut and not a matter for debate

You missed the first sentence which makes it all coherent I believe. I can write more clearly if you are still struggling but as far as I can see it makes sense.

Re: Dennis Leary, I believe the guide article on Bill Hicks says all you need to know about his stand-up routine, if not try the Hicks biography by Cynthia True where it becomes clear that the 'flattered' one is obviously not that impressed.

And yes, I can be argumentative when needs be. There must be something in my nature that makes me want to correct misinterpretation and justify an opinion which I believe to be true. I'm not asking you to believe what I'm saying whatsoever, it's just that I feel the holes you are trying to pick in my argument aren't justified.

Sorry if you don't like it. Your tone in the initial post came across as though you were one of those Oasis fans who believes that they are innovative and the biggest band in the world, and that you weren't particularly happy with my criticism. I meant no offense in calling you an Oasis fan!

You'd have to do considerably better than that to offend me, i can assure you.

But what you are still not acknowledging is that no matter how valid you think this point is, it simply is not EG material.

I only mentioned that i didn't think it was a particularly valid point in passing. I'm not that interested.

The key message here is 'Please remove this from PR coz it has no business being here'

PR isn't the be-all-and-end-all on h2g2.

Try the AWW, or <./>AskH2g2</.> if you want a debate on it.

But PR is all about editable entries, and yours just ain't that.

*gets up of floor*

Did you hear something? That was the sound of me falling off my chair when i realised that you were trying to convince me that this opinion is 'not open to debate' because some children believe in Father Xmas!

Can't/wont spaek for others but I read your piece a number of times to ensure that I had not missed some unassailable truth/fact .......
I hadn't!!
Equally I understand all of the words you have used both individually and when joined up into scentences, sadly none of it amounts to demonstrable fact!
This piece was, is and will always be your opinion and as such is not for the EG.

And in case you ask I am not a fan of any of the artists you mention, though I do like some of their work, but not all of it!

funny people! sense of humour bypass? maybe. I don't have the faintest idea what you are talking about with all your talk of PR and such like. Do you seriously believe I wanted this put on the Guide? I don't have the slightest care as to what your rules are regarding what is wanted and what gets on the guide, I was simply p*****g around after writing it and decided to attempt to stimulate some sort of interesting debate. Sadly my 'so simple, even a child could understand them' points have floated on past you and taken on whole different and sinister meanings akin to the rants of a neo-Nazi.

My deepest deepest sympathies for the terrible behaviour I have exhibited. Keep smiling, you funny funny people!-

Spiff (MP) - soon to be reactively modded ,

I'd just like to ask you, do you UNDERSTAND the point I am making regarding Father Christmas? You find it hilarious, but you din't mention whether you understand it. Can you see the duality existing between the 2 different opinions on whether a Father Christmas exists and the fact that they can be both be valid, but at the same time, there can only be and will ever be a SINGLE RIGHT ANSWER. This is the point I am making. I can appreciate the role of influence and inspiration other artists might make on an artist, but I am saying that the further degree called imitation (and also incorporating parody) is entirely worthless as an art form.

neo-nazis, eh.

it's no big deal, les, and all been pretty friendly, really.

like i said before, it was always quite obvious you wanted that debate, and quite a few people just told you in all good faith that while this wasn't really the place for it, you could try other bits of h2g2. It's a big site with all kinds of 'areas' for different stuff.

it doesn't matter much that it's here, either. I was just trying to save the people who deal with these things the bother of removing it from this little list. They don't 'delete' it... just take the link of one list and put it on another.

While you seem to think we're all being dull-witted humourless morons, we all wish you could understand that you're just barking up the wrong tree.

Coming in here and being disappointed not to get a good old debate about copy-cats is liking being disappointed not to get a good quality pizza in a Chinese Restaurant.

anyhow, watch out for those neo-nazis
and have fun on h2g2

cya
spiff

...like a dog chasing his own tail this is quite infuriating...

My sermon is wasted on this flock, I shall convert others.

May peace be upon you my children

Take it out of PR.

Seconder?