h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

There is a because we had to give up that thread and at that time I was quite afraid that if anyone finds it I would be banned. 'Just' because we were talking in a different language.

BTW, Pastey, I do like the idea you expressed earlier concerning moderation:

]]The other thing it had going for it, posts weren't automatically hidden on one yikesing, but needed to hit a certain point level, gained usually through lots of profanitiy, although a "known user" or a "hot thread" had multipliers automatically attached.[[

That sounds quite sensible. I understand the legalities that the BBC must abide by and I also vaguely remember what it was like when this were all fields (surrounding a Digital Village) and I much prefer the community to moderate itself as much as possible.

(for clarity, as opposed to being externally moderated as we are now.)

So before the BBC how did it work in terms of moderation for posts in other languages?

I'd love to rebuild that moderation system using newer, quicker technologies. It's was pretty good for its time, quite revelotionary really, but it could be so much better now.

The twin ideas of allowing a user to set the level of moderation they wanted, and having a variable auto-moderation for certain things worked very well.

But, it'd take some work if we went fully multi-lingual. We'd have to look at bringing it in a language at a time possibly.

>The twin ideas of allowing a user to set the level of moderation they wanted, and having a variable auto-moderation for certain things worked very well.<

I'll go for being severly moderated then

But we've had some really nasty stuff here in the past. Bullying and trolling, death threats as tiggy reminded us on another thread. Internet bullying has become a hot topic on the news lately.

I just don't see how in reality we can deal with that if there are whole threads where people are communicating in different languages.

Anyway I'm about done here now with pointing out possible pitfalls.

Just unsubbing for a bit..may be back who knows?

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1. Having parts of h2g2 that are seen as closed to those who don't speak the language. h2g2 has always been a very inclusive Community so that feels a bit weird. On the other hand, by banning non-English we're closing h2g2 to them totally.
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While I understand people's discomfit, isn't this rather like saying to people wanting to move into the neighbourhood - you can live here as long as you sound like us?

Yeah, kea, that's what I thought.

There's a difference between *not banning* other languages and *encouraging* them.

I don't envision - for the moment, at least - a shiny new hootoo where everyone's writing entries in a dozen languages and you have to sift through Ask to find ones you can read. Aside from the problems of segregating the community, which I realise might happen, we just don't have the resources.

But as a speaker of Forn, it's irritating that I can't talk to another speaker of Forn in the same language. Particularly when we're talking *about* that language, quoting things, or making jokes that really only work in that language. (Or in some threads I'm in, only work in multiple languages at once ) It's stifling to be unable to communicate certain concepts because you're bound by language, or have to laboriously describe them when a single word in another language would do.

Mark Twain once said that "censorship is telling a man he can't have a steak because a baby can't chew it". I'm sorry if someone feels left out of a thread because it's in a different language, and I'm sure I'd feel that way, too, about ones I can't read.

But we just need a total perspective vortex. If you can't follow a thread, it probably wasn't meant for you anyway - I certainly wouldn't post in Dutch if I wanted everyone involved. And if someone's writing in another language, they're probably doing it for a good reason - ie you wouldn't get it anyway if it were in English, because the cultural references would elude you.

I don't see why this has to be considered sinister. I just want to be able to have a laugh with Tav about the ridiculous phrase "raumübergreifendes Großgrün" in a thread on her PS where we're talking about that kind of uniquely German expression, without having to explain that it's German legalese for a "space-spanning green object", or "tree", just in case there's a lurker. Or post a link to a German poem for Dmitri, perhaps quoting a key line, without having to find a site with a (usually bad) English version as well.

Meaning gets lost in translation. And eliminating everything other than English as a matter of course would be like making the smileys monochrome because there are some colourblind users who would feel left out otherwise. Sure, you can still use it, but you lose the subtleties of communication.

(And I'm a monoglot, btw.)

##(And I'm a monoglot, btw.)##

did your people come along with gengis khan???

No, actually, 1/8 of my ancestry went the other direction a bit before him

Monoglot=only speak 1 language

Good post, Mala.

RodtheNotaBiglot

Yes yes yes. I hasten to point out that I was trying to summarise some of the perceived problems, rather than thinking they were problems myself.
I don't worry a jot about conversations in other languages, although I still think having a quick link to a auto-translate would be lovely so I can join in some of them if it's more of an odd-phrase-here-and-there conversation.

So why don't we set up Polyglot Plaza properly as a hub for all conversations that are not in English (including Welsh, and Latin) and provide it with a link on the FP and a link on the side bar that appears on every H2G2 page. This should be simple I hope (comments please Tav you know what you are doing page design wise) This could/should also be made a feature and promoted as such it might be something that attracts many more members.


What do people think

Not if it means multilingual postings are allowed *only* there. (Thinking of people's PS conversations...)

But attracting other researchers is definitely the way to go.

The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that the EG should be in English, at least for the time being.

But attracting researchers with other first languages would definitely help. The entries I myself have received the most favourable comments on (and some EotM badges) were all on topics that could easily be researched on the internet - but not in English. As a consequence, they were novel and interesting to readers here.

I know some researchers have great potential, but struggle with the English language. Letting them post in other languages in conversation threads would help us retain them. They feel left out at the moment because they often come across as a bit humourless or even stupid, when it's really just the language barrier keeping them from reaching their full potential. Keep 'em around, and they'll improve their English, as many have done, and become valuable members of the community.

I suggest a specialist volunteer role (perhaps held by native speakers of another language, or those experienced in teaching English as a second language) for scouts/sub-editors that can then help them whip their entries into shape a bit before they ever go to PR. A bit like the writing workshop, but focused on language and grammar rather than content. I know we've tried something like that before, but maybe we can get it off the ground this time!

Mais ouis!

The hub idea is great. No reason that there can't be some other non-English convos elsewhere, but maybe newbies can be directed through the plaza first.

Not if it means multilingual postings are allowed *only* there. (Thinking of people's PS conversations...) Yes and there as well the more the merrier BUT please in the title post eg; (D) Dies ist ein Test. That way people will know if they can handle the conversation without a translator...