h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

danny, we all exist. Otherwise how do you explain being here to submit this? I do agree that there is a difference between 'living'
(enjoying life) and 'exisiting'. But either way WE are not no-thing!
And something comes from nothing everytime someone has a thought on the subject. No?

I could be a figment of your imagination (I hope not for your sake coz your imagination must be pretty twisted), or you a crazed imagining of mine. The entire point is that "the Universe" is arrived at by a common consensus of individual's intersecting universes, no two of which will be the same.
What I'm trying to say is "We make it up as we go along" so nothing may or may not continue to exist depending on what everybody thinks of it(or not).

danny

My imagination is just fine, thank you. Yours, I'm not so sure about.
(Yet)
I'm wondering what your mindset is? Are you saying that you believe,
or think, or feel, that WE are somehow in control of the Universe?
When did THAT happen?!? I must have dozed off...
John Lennon said,"Life is what happens when you're planning something else!" I don't know about you, but just when I think I'm going along fine, life jumps up & takes a big bite right out of my ass! (Pardon my language. It's after 5:00am and my dog has been totally freaked by the storm here for several hours. I'm exhausted.)
No two of anything are the same. To a point. Let's use us (you & I)
as an example. We are not the same. I'm female. (you're?) I live in the USA. (you?) I like classic rock & meatless chili, etc. once we get beyond our differences. We are all the same. We can only be as different as 'people' can be. After that, we're all the same.
The proof of my point is: there are 5 things that ALL Humans must do to stay alive. We MUST: eat, drink, void, breath and sleep. Everything else is a choice. We don't make that up. You see? It's the 'law' of the Universe. Without following these requirements, we die.
We only make up little things as we go along. When you're talking the scale of the Universe, our day-to-day happenings are not even as loud as a baby's sigh. One grain of sand and a whole bunch of other metaphors...

Of course we are in control of our universes (how else can we ignore things, good or bad?).
I think you're thinking of rabid dogs if your arse is getting bitten (I am english, ass is a donkey).
We are 99.9% the same (genetically) but I take your point, I wouldn't like to think I was that close to hitler/stalin/jesus.
Human beings must also exercise their mind (possibly bodies as well) or they stagnate. Boredom is perhaps the worst form of nothing.

Hope the dog calms down (at least dogs don't appear to need thought).

danny

Wow, we haven't had a discussion like this here, in quite some time. My brain was expecting to have a drink with Pandy.

Well thank you all. I never realised that I could possibly start a conversation like this!

Oh and Pandora, Fancy a drink?!?

I'll be back...time to run off & make sure my doctor makse his house payment this month.

Would you mind having a bit of room temp. wine awaiting my return?

Hmmm, thought you offered a beverage?
Yep...THAT'S what I meant...just when I'm going along, thinking things are fine, life jumps up & bites my donkey right on the arse!
Unless you can find some way of looking at life that I haven't (& that
would be quiet a feat, because I've been wondering about the Universe
since the first day my Mamma took me outside, and laid me down on a blanket.)
We are not in control of the Universe! We ignore things because we can. When you say we MUST exercise our minds & bodies or we'll stagnate. That, my dear, is simply another choice. There are many amoung us who do next to nothing as much & as often as possible. And
seem very pleased with themselves for taking a 'free ride' thoughout
their stagnating lives. Choice. Freewill.
Thank you for the well wishes about my dog 'Belle'. I ended up giving her a doggie down, & allowing her to sleep in my bed. When you say that dogs don't appear to need thought, that leads me to believe you are not loved by a dog.
I honestly don't think I've ever been bored. I don't understand how boredom is possible? Carpe Diem!!!
Just one woman's thoughts spilling forth.

I didn't say we are each in control of the Universe, just out own little universes.
I agree that some ignorance is by choice but I don't think that's entirely the case, maybe forgetfullnes is a sub-consious form of ignoring things (avoids any nasty conflicts in the fore-brain).

In defence of couch potatoes:
observation is a necessary act (see above arguments on trees falling on mimes or Heisenberg's uncertainty wotsit), without observation a thing cannot be said to have happened. If this is so I would ask all TV viewers not to watch Mr. Springer's show, so it never will have happened.

Correct I am not loved by an enslaved, inbred canine (does Belle have any free will?),(This is just my opinion and only holds sway in my little corner of the universe(s))

What is a doggy down?

(Carpe Scrotum is far more powerful an addage)

danny, they've lost my reply! I spent some time on it too! I'm not happy about it. Seems like you can goof off & those ALWAYS get posted. I'll return here & try to re-create my response late tonight or Sunday afternoon. I have company. I don't want to be rude & be on Mac while they're here. But I didn't want to be rude to you either!

Get ready...I shall return

Why don't people just stay home for a change?!? Sheesh!

Pandora: I am now replying to what you said to me about a week aga:

Southend, or Southend-on-Sea, is a middle sized to large town in South-east England. Every year, around about the end of May, they have an airshow for 2 days, it's a display of 2nd world war planes doing some really good air displays, such as flying ups-de down or loop-the-loop and sometimes 2 planes flying towards each other looking like they might crash. If the weather is sunny and warm it can be a fantastic day out, plus there is a mini theme park along the seafront. Jules from h2g2 is coming down for the 2nd day and we're going to hopefully have a wonderful day out. Hopefully I'll take some photos and Jules will put them on my photo page for me, and you'll see what I'm talking about. If you ever visit London or somewhere around the south-east of England, make sure to visit Southend, it can be gorgeous on a summers day, and if you go down to the beach, make sure to go to the westcliff or southend bit, as the Shoebury bit is horrible, or I think so. Also let me know of course if you come down!

Also I'm off to Wembly Arena this Monday to see Steps. I'll let you know what happened!

Must log off now, it's 1 a.m.!!!!!

Katsy, that sounds wonderful,like what we have near here. At first I thought you were telling about going to a concert. I have a couple friends who take me flying, it's fun!!! I love when they roll the plane upside down! THE very coolest is when I was with my friend Chuck. We had an open cockpit. (the bubble top slid back & open) and I did'nt have anyway to tie my hair back! It stood straight up, or down. or whatever! He was trying to make me ill! HA! His wife won't even fly with him because of his stunts! One day he was taking me over my house. He said,"Your pilot just had a heart attack, whatcha' gonna' do about it?" And he released the yolk! He totally ignored my pleas!
Since I got over being mad at him right away, I can now look at it as the most fun I've had flying. But ot was still a rotten trick! Do
you ever get around by plane? We have a taxi service on Lake Erie that takes coustomers to islands betewwn here and Canada. Of course there are always boats-but planes are too fun!

danny-I 'will' get back to you-it's after 1am & I'm too sleepy to see the screen. I think I just gave myself whiplash...Ooo, I'm actually falling asleep in front of Mac! G-night! I'll give you plenty to ponder when I can get fifteen minutes to myself. ---Pan

How many years were in the first decade? How many years in the first century?

How can the year, the decade, and the century all end at the same time and not the millenium?

Now, I am a student of mathematics and I don't understand this insistance on the millenium ending in 2001.

Aside from the fact that to our best historical knowledge, Christ was actually born around 4 BC (before Christ), and that the calendar has been modified several times since its inception (which occured long after Christ's death), it doesn't really make all that much sense to say that the millenium does not end in 2000. I mean, the people in 999 certainly thought that 1000 was the end of the millenium, and they were right!

My theory is that the first decade, the first century, and the first millenium were all lacking a year. It's ok, it's just a fickle trick of language because there was no year 0 (zero). But we are already in the second millenium, which does get its full 1000 years, just as every decade since has gotten its proper 10.

My own theory is that only 1 or 2 people thought up this thing about the Millenium ending in 2001 and thought they were very clever and could lord this over those around them. Then those they lorded it over, thought they could get that same superior feeling doing it to everyone around them and so the cancerous ill-thought-out idea spread.

This is my first attempt to trample on it. All commentaries welcome.

We will all ponder and await. Pandy.

I whould like to say something about the topic on this fourm..
Can Something come from Nothing?
I think it can be. I'll explain.
Mankind has allways been a very long time to figure stuff out (fire and stuff like that) and how things work. But when we finally do, we're very proud. Now we say that nothing will come from nothing, something can't come from nothing because we don't know any better. Soon (I hope) we will figure out how we can make something out of nothing. So making something out of nothing hasn't been invented yet, but if you do so [figure out how to make something out of nothing] please contact me.
And have a nice day! =)

inventing <=> discovering...
Anyway.. this is what I think.
Nothing exists but we just don't know it yet.

Snikkers, this is way off what I was going to say to danny, but...
Do you know that as we ponder if something can come from nothing, scientists are getting ready to try to re-create the 'big bang'? This should answer our question. THEY want to know if something can come from nothing. They want to know so baddly, they have spent six hundred
million dollars to find out! I wish I could remember the State this is going to take place in...if anyone knows, please jump right in! There's a track several miles under ground constructed of concrete & steel. The plan is to 'shoot' two atoms at one another at the speed of light. (I'm not sure how many times the atoms will encircle the track before stricking eachother head on!) I do know that this action will create a temp. of one trillion degrees F.! The example I was given was to think of two ripe tomatoes being smashed together as hard as possible. The desired result will be for the 1st (the last?) time
ever, man will 'know' what occured during the big bang! Tomatoes would smash through eachother, flying in all directions. What's left in the middle is to somewhat resemble a new form of mass. Some think if this works, there will be a major black hole that the World will fall into itself. And all the Universes known & unknown will be changed forever.
Two atoms-stricking at the speed of light-creating one trillion degrees heat...if something can come from nothing...that experiment should be the one that gives us the answer!

danny- 'Belle' wants to know: Who you calln' inbred?!? Free will...well, she pees where & when she wants; she cares not who might see, and she dosen't get arrested for it either. True, man domisticated animals for their own reasons, mainly survival. Can't blame a guy for that...she's by no means enslaved. She has seven achers to run on, lives to please me. And has even saved my life! Not that asked her, she just thought it was the right thing to do. And dogs do think. danny, I could tell you sooo many reasons why I know they think, but I don't even feel the need to prove that piont. Anyone who is loved by an animal knows that animals do think, sometimes too much. They are even pron to mental/emotional problems!

And did I detect some 'back peddeling' by you? You sure did say that WE are in control of the
Universe, that's what got me started. It's okay to change your mind.
When a wise person understands something from another point of view, that's what happens...a mind is changed. When you ask why men do certian things. It's just as simple as:because they can.

Even in a small circle of my life, it's been proven to me that I do not, nor do we together control our World, or any peice of it. Yes, I can plant flowers on a spot of ground, that doesn't make me in control of that ground, or the flowers. The rains, wind, critters,etc. can help or hinder the growth of those flowers I though I was going to grow. We
make plans, then life comes along and bends everything it touches. How you react to what you cannot control decides if you're going to be okay during your lifetime or not. NEXT...

Several points:
1) Purebreed dogs are inbred, witness the Pekinese which cannot reproduce without human intervention. Mongrels are not, so are more likely to be 'real' dogs. (entirely arbitrary definition of what a dog is).
2)Why can people not excrete in public? It's about as natural a thing as possible. Talk about hypocrisy, if god made us in his image then no function of that image can be wrong/bad.
3) The reason I appeared to change my mind is beacuse I like contradicting myself, it helps to think about things from as many angles as possible (no one angle is 'right', excpet if someone believes it in their universe)
4) Everybody inhabits a different universe. If your actions alter your universe they interact with the universes of others, which may then act on your's i.e. reciprocal control. I don't mean everyone controls everything in their universe (gravity is damn hard to ignore) but since you can control some of what happens inside your head you can control your perception and interaction with that universe.
5) Throwing tomatoes is more fun than particle physics.

toodle pip

surely your premise is based on the fact that the mere human brain cannot accept the concept of infinity!!
If you suspend recieved wisdom and accept this premise, then anything is possible!!

Judging by most of what's been written here, I'd been tempted to reverse the question: Can nothing come from something!!!!!!!

Ask a molecular scientist - I don't reckon there is such a thing as nothing, except in the non-physical sense.