A Conversation for LIL'S ATELIER
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence Posted Aug 25, 2004
No, words fail me.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") Posted Aug 25, 2004
I would have to say that their feelings are correct. The Gent that said he would be fighting us (the US) if he was not playing soccer(football), I can definitely agree with his feelings. Were I in his position, I would likely do the same.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Hypatia Posted Aug 25, 2004
After living under the thumb of Saddam Hussein for so long, I hope the Iraqi people understand that all Americans are not guilty of the aggression in Iraq any more than the Iraqi people were guilty of the crimes committed by Hussein.
I also think that there is a difference between trying to defend your homes and terrorism. Likewise there is a difference between trying to impose civil order after a war and aggression. I find the Bush ads distasteful. However, in my opinion, the Iraqi soccer team is just as guilty of playing politics with this issue as Bush is.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence Posted Aug 25, 2004
Fair Labor Standards Act. That's the name of the legislation intended to curtail how much employers have to pay for overtime.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
FG Posted Aug 25, 2004
Egon, I heard that bit of news on NPR this morning, and I hope the Iraqi team wins the bronze medal just so we can hear more from them about this issue. The players and coach are absolutely right--if I were on that team I would totally be offended that the individual responsible for f***ing up my country was using me as a campaign slogan. I don't think the Iraqi team is playing politics at all. They're just responding to the usual outrageous Bush Administration hubris.
I would like to mention at this time I have nothing personal against Italy winning.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Hypatia Posted Aug 25, 2004
I certainly understand why they are offended at the Bush ad. But I still think that their remarks are political. And ill advised. The fastest way to get us out of there is to restore order - not to encourage the resistance movement. Unless they genuinely believe that we never intend to leave. In which case, I can't say I would blame them.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
FG Posted Aug 25, 2004
Of course we're never leaving. We're building about 16 new military bases there. I think that's the right number. Maybe it's 12. Whichever. We. Are. Never. Leaving. Iraq. No matter who gets elected.
When you think about it, Bush's announcement that America is pulling troops out of Western Europe and other former Cold War hot spots makes sense when you look at the long term game plan--we need those soliders in Iraq...and potentially Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia...anywhere the oil is.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Hypatia Posted Aug 25, 2004
I think we should take the money being spent and that we're planning on spending to secure the Middle East oil fields and invest it into developing alternative energy sources. In the long run it would be cheaper and would be soooooooooooo much better for the planet. Why is that such an unreasonable thing to ask the government to do? When I suggest such a thing people look at me like I'm a total moron. (No comments, please. )
FG, you're right of course. I guess the rationale is that the Middle East will always be a tender box and we need a presence there. I heard someone say the other day that it will prevent future conflicts, so I suppose that is going to be the party line when justifying it.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Hypatia Posted Aug 25, 2004
Certainly. If anyone gives you any trouble over it, send them to me and I'll give them my patented librarian peer over the top of my glasses, roll my eyes and sign in disgust look. I've sent grown men screaming from the building with that look.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Blatherskite the Mugwump - Bandwidth Bandit Posted Aug 25, 2004
GDZ: "I would have to say that their feelings are correct. The Gent that said he would be fighting us (the US) if he was not playing soccer(football), I can definitely agree with his feelings. Were I in his position, I would likely do the same."
Well, I certainly do not agree, and I would not be fighting the US if I were in his position. It's all that insurgent action that is making the country so dangerous right now. The US troops wouldn't be shooting back if people weren't shooting at them. The insurgents are destabilizing their own country, and blaming the US for it. How can they turn security concerns over to local authorities when the security situation remains so bad?
The cycle of violence has to stop somewhere.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") Posted Aug 25, 2004
I know a way to stop that cycle, it won't happen though.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Witty Moniker Posted Aug 25, 2004
We opened Pandora's box in Iraq. Hussein was suppressing those insurgents all along. Okay, he was suppressing everybody else, too. What I want to know is why our military experts never saw it coming.
I've been talking about alternative sources of energy for years. I agree that we need to fund research. I don't know if the pharmaceutical industry is a good model, but at least they have a system to fund research in the medical arena. The oil industry should be doing the same, or they will be in the same boat as the buggy whip manufacturers.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence Posted Aug 25, 2004
Ormy, as regards the person who was causing you so much swiftvet bother, I went to his PS and discovered an even bigger grievance; he's got a son or son-in-law in the golf course construction business.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
U195408 Posted Aug 25, 2004
I tend to agree with GDZ; if there was an unprovoked attack upon the US, I would take up arms against it. Actually, I was trying to decide what kind of war would I feel justified fighting in, and I realized it have to be one to stop aggression, or invasion.
It's hard for me to say that - I'm being hypocritical in then hoping for american soldiers to hang in there until the government is established, and hoping that the insurgents do stop fighting.
I was reading the ITER (International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor) website - it's a project to build the largest ever fusion reactor, which will be the stepping stone to eventual use of fusion as an energy source. It was disgusting to read about the american participation:
"From the beginning of the formal collaboration in 1988 through the completion of the initial six-year agreement for the ITER Engineering Design Activities (EDA), the US was an equal party to the ITER effort, carrying out significant tasks in design and supporting R&D. In 1998, the Congress directed the DOE to conduct an orderly closeout of its ITER activities, which was done during FY1999."
1998 - republican congress - same group of *ssholes who cancelled the particle accelerator project. Now the republican president wants back in, since the international community is going ahead anyway. I hate those g*dd*mn republicans.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence Posted Aug 25, 2004
How would you go about finding specifically which representatives/senators were responsible for shutting it down?
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
U195408 Posted Aug 25, 2004
good question. I guess we'd have to search for a bill in congress about ITER, and then look up who voted for or against it.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Montana Redhead (now with letters) Posted Aug 25, 2004
wanna know how they voted? check here: http://www.voterpunch.org/
Anyway, I've gotten through the various comments, and I have the following to add:
Ted Kennedy being on the no fly list is simply too convient to be anything other than political. What bothered me more is that people at Boston's Logan airport didn't recognize the man. DUH.
SBVT are attacking Kerry's war record, but really, they're pissed off about his opposition to the war. My stepfather hates Shrub, but refuses to like Kerry because he felt that Kerry messed up over Viet Nam. Also, too, the fact that an officer went before the senate, rather than an enlisted, is causing some of the ruckus.
Did anyone else see John Kerry on the Daily Show last night? He kept hitting all the points(jobs lost, outsourcing, health care, relative tax burden), and when Jon Stewart asked him point blank if he "flip flops" Kerry said yes. He qualified it by saying that any human being who thinks flip flops, because when presented with facts, one should be willing to rethink a position. He said Shrub's biggest problem is that in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, he stubbornly refuses to acknowledge that he was wrong about Iraq.
I have to say that the Daily Show, while certainly not "news" in the classic sense, at least skewers what news has become.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
FG Posted Aug 25, 2004
I could kick myself for missing that last night. I heard excerpts on the radio this morning, though. It's nice to see Kerry's sense of humor.
The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
Montana Redhead (now with letters) Posted Aug 25, 2004
It was really good. Kerry made several cracks about how Cheney and Co. have been vetting potential audience members, including one about how it surprised him that Dick Cheney, the scariest man alive, was frightened by little old ladies.
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The US Presidential Election dicussion at the Atelier
- 1101: Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1102: Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1103: Hypatia (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1104: Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1105: FG (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1106: Hypatia (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1107: FG (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1108: Hypatia (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1109: FG (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1110: Hypatia (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1111: Blatherskite the Mugwump - Bandwidth Bandit (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1112: Good Doctor Zomnker (This must be Tuesday," said GDZ to himself, sinking low over his Dr. Pepper, "I never could get the hang of Tuesdays.") (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1113: Witty Moniker (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1114: Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1115: U195408 (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1116: Asteroid Lil - Offstage Presence (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1117: U195408 (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1118: Montana Redhead (now with letters) (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1119: FG (Aug 25, 2004)
- 1120: Montana Redhead (now with letters) (Aug 25, 2004)
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