A Conversation for Mythical Creatures
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
BigAl Patron Saint of Left Handers Keeper of the Glowing Pickle and Monobrows Posted Jul 7, 2006
'if anyone wants to write any more about any of the creatures, I'm more than happy to include it!'
As myself and someonew else mentioned above, you haven't mentioned the basilisk.
The basilisk and cockatrice were often confused with each other as they were both dragon-like creatures. All who beheld the eyes of the basilisk fell dead on the spot. As it destroys all shrubs, both by direct contact and by breathing upon them; and it also burns up grass and fractures stones, it is generally found in barren deserts.
An obvious way to counteract the basilisk's fatal stare was to hold up a mirror, whereupon the creature would slay itself. Apparently, this technique was put to good use in Warsaw in 1857 when a condemned prisoner named John Faurer volunteered to deal with a basilisk by approaching it wearing a leather suit festoonbed with mirrors. This operation was witnessed by over 2000 onlookers.
The cockatrice, Ibelieve was very similar although only the cockerel could withstand its withering glare.
The basilisk was an animal hatched from an egg laid by a cock in a dungheap, and incubated by a toad. Such a feat was obviously of profound value in sorcery and, in 1474, in a celebrated trial in Basle, a cockerel was executed on the capital charge of having laid an egg which might have hatched into a basilisk.The cockerel was legally represented and denied any wrong-doing. However, it was unsuccessful in its defence and it, together with its egg was burned to death with full legal solemnity.
Returning to mdical applications, the commercial importance of products from unicorn, dragon and other such creatures, led to a flourishing export trade. This led Roger Bacon to complain in 1266 that, 'It is certain that wise men of Aethipia have come to Italy, Spain, France, England, and those lands of the Christians in which there are good flying dragons and drive them through the air at high speed...'.
Inevitably the market was flooded by artificial dragons blood, false alicorn etc. This led to the development of a battery of assays to authenticate these products. Thus, true dragon's blood was immiscible with eagle's blood, whilst authentic alicorn could be tested by soaking it in water, dipping one's finger therein, and inscribing a circle on the table surface. A spider placed within the circle would starve to death rather than cross the line.
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
AlexAshman Posted Jul 7, 2006
You could also mention Daedalus (A470981) in the bit about the minotaur, if you have space.
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
six7s Posted Jul 8, 2006
Here in Aotearoa/New Zealand, we have taniwha (pronounced tar knee far - as in all Maori words, there's equal emaphasis on all syllables) who are shrouded in mystery and, although not (to my knowledge) ever 'scientifically' accounted for, are regarded as being very powerful - both in myth/legend AND law!!!
<./>Search?searchstring=taniwha</.> yields only one (non edited) entry: A521191 New Zealand Expressions
However... Google is rather more forthcoming
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http://www.teara.govt.nz/1966/A/AnimalsMythical/AnimalsMythical/en
(1966)
Many caves, river bends, and pools, and places along the sea shore were feared because they were the haunts of the taniwha, awesome water monsters with man-killing tendencies. A host of legends told of the slaying of these reptilian monsters but, as no skeletal remains have ever been found, there is no support for the belief that the taniwha ever existed in New Zealand. In all probability such tales of water-dwelling monsters and other huge reptiles known as kumi were nothing more than distorted folk memories of the crocodile of the western Pacific or Asia.
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http://www.teara.govt.nz/EarthSeaAndSky/Geology/WhenuaHowTheLandWasShaped/6/en
Wellington Harbour
Like most inland and coastal waters, Wellington Harbour or Te Whanganui-a-Tara (the great harbour of Tara) was inhabited by taniwha (sea spirits or monsters), who fashioned some of its features. This harbour had two such creatures: Whataitai (from which the suburb Hataitai gets its name), and Ngake. One day when they were swimming close to the harbour mouth, a great earthquake shook the area. Land that had been underwater rose to the surface, stranding Whataitai on dry ground. The taniwha became the stretch of land that now connects Miramar Peninsula (Motukairangi) to the mainland. Distressed, Ngake headed to the north-east of the harbour (near Seaview), where with one almighty thrust of its tail, it rushed out to sea. It was transformed into a keo bird and flew to mourn on the peak of present-day Mt Victoria. Maori call the mount Tangi-te-keo – the weeping of the keo.
Taniwha tales
In many stories taniwha create lakes and harbours. According to the Ngai Tuhoe tribe, Lake Waikaremoana, in the south-east of their territory, was formed by the thrashing of Haumapuhia, who was turned into a taniwha by her father Mahu. As she struggled to make her way to the sea, Haumapuhia formed the various branches of the lake.
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http://www.nzghosts.co.nz/Auckland.htm
Transit New Zealand was forced to stop work in November (2002) on a 100-metre section of State Highway One (SH1) in the Waikato after Ngati Naho, a hapu of the Tainui iwi, complained the new road went straight over the swamp home of Karu Tahi, the one-eyed taniwha.
Ngati Naho believe Kahu Tahi's lair is a small area about 1km south of the Meremere power station beside SH1, surrounded by a grove of protected kahikatea trees, lush grass and raucous cicadas - and right in the middle of the new Meremere expressway.
Transit regional project manager Chris Allen said a 30-metre rock fill would be built next to the swamp "lair", creating a steeper than originally planned embankment along the edge of the new northbound lanes.
Had the embankment not been steepened, it would have occupied more of the swampland believed to house the taniwha.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taniwha
Taniwha
In the mythology of the Maori of New Zealand, are beings that live in deep pools in rivers, dark caves, or in the sea, especially in places with dangerous currents or deceptive breakers. Some can tunnel through the earth, uprooting trees in the process. Some taniwha are credited with creating harbours by carving out a channel to the ocean. Others are said to have caused landslides beside lakes or rivers.
At sea, taniwha often take the form of a whale or a large shark. In inland waters, they may still be of whale-like dimensions, but look more like a gecko or a tuatara, having a row of spines along the back. Other taniwha appear as a floating log, which behaves in a disconcerting way
As notorious monsters
In their role as guardians, taniwha were vigilant to ensure that the people respected the restrictions imposed by tapu. They made certain that any violations of tapu were punished. Taniwha were especially dangerous to people from other tribes. There are many legends of battles with taniwha, both on land and at sea. Often these conflicts took place soon after the settlement of New Zealand, generally after a taniwha had attacked and eaten a person from a tribe that it had no connection with.
(the next 200 words in the Wikipedia article are, in my opinion, rather suspect)
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http://library.christchurch.org.nz/TiKoukaWhenua/WairewaMarae/
Lake Wairewa
In the tradition of 'Nga Puna Wai Karikari o Rakaihautu', the chief Rakaihautu is said to have dug the principal lakes of Te Wai Pounamu including Wairewa and nearby Waihora with his famous ko (digging stick) that he then thrust into Horomaka forming what is known today as Tuhiraki or Mt Bossu. A Taniwha called Tu Te Rakiwhanoa occupied the lake. He was the atua given the task of making Te Wai Pounamu habitable for the children of Tane who came after him. He created the bays, harbours estuaries and waterways.
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A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Danny B Posted Jul 8, 2006
Wow - that's a lot to be getting on with
I'm going to be away for the weekend, so I'll deal with all this as soon as I can when I get back.
Thanks everyone!
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Lbclaire Posted Jul 8, 2006
How about:
Gryphon (already an edited entry A308585)
Phoenix (already an edited entry A442711)
Manticore
Manticore:
The manticore myth is of Persian origin. It has the face of a man, body of a lion and tail of a scorpion, from which it may shoot venomous spines. It is sometimes depicted as having wings. It is said to still live in the forests of Indonesia, where it has traditionally been blamed whenever a villager mysteriously disappears. A scratch from its claws or a bite from its jaws, which have three rows of razor-sharp teeth, will kill instantly and it then eats its human prey whole.
Lbclaire
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups Posted Jul 8, 2006
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
BigAl Patron Saint of Left Handers Keeper of the Glowing Pickle and Monobrows Posted Jul 8, 2006
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Danny B Posted Jul 9, 2006
Right then... I have:
- Added basilisks and cockatrices
- Added a reference to Daedalus
- Added a section on Taniwha
- Added the Gryphon and Phoenix to the 'already in the Guide' section
- Added a section on the Manticore
Any more for any more..?
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups Posted Jul 9, 2006
On a quick google I found these
http://www.eaudrey.com/myth/
http://webhome.idirect.com/~donlong/monsters/monsters.htm
http://www.mythcreatures.co.uk/
I also found that these had not been included
Brownies
Centaurs A647129
Gnomes A10450964
Giants
Unicorn
Sphinx
Gargoyles
Elementals
Pegasus
Dryads
Pixie
Doppleganger
Ogres
Cherubim
Leprechauns A596063
and have Achilles A649910 been mentioned I forget
this link also may be helpful:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/alabaster/C535
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups Posted Jul 9, 2006
For ease of loading - A12981558
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Danny B Posted Jul 9, 2006
Hi Opti - I know there are 101 (possibly 10001) mythical creatures that exist that aren't covered by the Entry... It would be impossible to cover them all in one Entry! The Entry is intended as a 'what H2G2 researchers came up with when asked about mythical creatures'. You could compare it with the Guitar Heroes Entry (A3641799), which we had to call time on as people would have been saying "but how could you possibly forget xxxx xxxxxxx" for ever (and continued to do so for some time after we'd finished)!
So what do people think - is it worth having this Entry in the EG as a sprinkling of mythical creatures, should we keep going until we think we've covered every possible example, or should we abandon it as an impossibility? Votes..?
If people decide it is worth it, I'll certainly link to those other existing Entries
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Danny B Posted Jul 9, 2006
"and have Achilles A649910 been mentioned I forget"
Not sure what you're getting at... Achilles may be a myth, but he was a human. not a 'creature'
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups Posted Jul 9, 2006
I don't believe this entry should be abandoned its fantastic. I see what you are saying that there's a lot out there but I believe you've covered what you need to cover and even explained this in one of your opening paragraphs. I believe an overview like this is absolutely fantastic.
Gosh if people told me I had to write more than an overview on Japan it would never be finished.
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups Posted Jul 9, 2006
oh i think i've given you a link to an unedited source too so be careful.
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Sea Change Posted Jul 9, 2006
I think if you are going to title this entry 'Mythical Creatures' as opposed to "Some Mythical Creatures" or "An Introduction to Mythical Critters" , "An incomplete Bestiary" or something similar then you should aim to be as complete as you possibly can. The last thing the Edited Guide needs is another entry that needs to be Updated as soon as it gets published.
I found the Bogeyman and Jenny Greenteeth in the Edited Guide. They can be added into your 'these have separate entries' section.
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
six7s Posted Jul 10, 2006
Hi Danny B.,
The piece on the taniwha looks great
I think that the right title for this entry is 'Mythical Creatures'
Under [Linking to h2g2 Entries], the Writing-Guidelines, state:
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When linking from an entry ... there are a couple of points to bear in mind:
* The entries linked to should also be in the Edited Guide. (which this one will be )
* They should be direct and relevant. For example, the word 'poetry' should link to Poetry, rather than Poetry Events and Gigs in Glasgow, which, though a laudable entry, does not define the word 'poetry'
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Although 'An Incomplete Bestiary' might be a cool title, it would be a weird phrase to incorporate into another entry as a link to this entry, which does a fair job of defining its subject, as does 'Poetry' A155855 - without needing to mention every poem since the dawn of time
As for being in need of an 'update' as soon as it hits the Front Page... I don't think so... the need for 'all-encompassing' entries applies to many subjects - but this CAN'T be one of them... the ham(p)sters would never handle the load
I can see that this entry will serve as a 'hosting point' for a number of threads dealing with the creatures included in AND ommited from the entry
Of course its impossible to please all of the people all of the time, as seen in F20467?thread=634662 << Is this the best h2g2 can do? >> hanging off the 'Poetry' page
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Danny B Posted Jul 10, 2006
Well, we seem to have a difference of opinion here: two votes for 'doesn't have to be all-encompassing' and one vote for 'should be all-encompassing'. To keep things ticking along, I've added the links to the EG Entries that people have pointed out
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups Posted Jul 10, 2006
A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
Apophis42-The Great DM in The Sky Posted Jul 10, 2006
Hi. Great entry. You neglected to add the kappa. I'll go research that right now and get back to you as soon as possible. I'd vote for not holistic, unless other people are willing to do more work.
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A12981558 - Mythical Creatures
- 21: BigAl Patron Saint of Left Handers Keeper of the Glowing Pickle and Monobrows (Jul 7, 2006)
- 22: AlexAshman (Jul 7, 2006)
- 23: six7s (Jul 8, 2006)
- 24: Danny B (Jul 8, 2006)
- 25: Lbclaire (Jul 8, 2006)
- 26: Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups (Jul 8, 2006)
- 27: BigAl Patron Saint of Left Handers Keeper of the Glowing Pickle and Monobrows (Jul 8, 2006)
- 28: Danny B (Jul 9, 2006)
- 29: Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups (Jul 9, 2006)
- 30: Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups (Jul 9, 2006)
- 31: Danny B (Jul 9, 2006)
- 32: Danny B (Jul 9, 2006)
- 33: Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups (Jul 9, 2006)
- 34: Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups (Jul 9, 2006)
- 35: Sea Change (Jul 9, 2006)
- 36: Noth€r (Jul 9, 2006)
- 37: six7s (Jul 10, 2006)
- 38: Danny B (Jul 10, 2006)
- 39: Opticalillusion- media mynx life would be boring without hiccups (Jul 10, 2006)
- 40: Apophis42-The Great DM in The Sky (Jul 10, 2006)
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